# Where was Barack Obama, to stand for Democracy? **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [January 12, 2015, 3:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597 "2015-01-12T03:49:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 23
**Author:** ![MaxTheVool](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9fc29f/32.png) [@MaxTheVool](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MaxTheVool)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2015, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/441 "2015-01-15T00:00:59Z")
> [@doorhinge](#): > > Just for future reference, and my own amusement, what, specifically, do you consider to be the appropriate amount of respect that should be shown to Joseph Robinette “Joe” Biden, Jr., 47th Vice President of the United States, if I were to mention him in the future, while posting in the SDMB BBQ Pit? [This is the appropriate amount of respect.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvbMB_GGR6s) ---
**Author:** ![OwnRules](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/ea666f/32.png) [@OwnRules](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/OwnRules)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2015, 6:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/442 "2015-01-15T06:03:10Z")
> [@John\_Mace](#): > > There were more people killed in Nigeria recently than in Paris. Why aren’t all those European leaders rushing off to Nigeria to show solidarity? Multiple problems – starting with the fact that African media themselves way under-report incidents like this. Occlude you might say; money talks and there is only so much demand for first page pictures of death torn Africans – such as this dramatic one, [**here**](http://guruprasad.net/posts/vulture-and-starving-child/). Add to that obvious racism and a “me culture” and there is your answer. Justified? Obviously not. Mayhaps you and I can start a campaign to raise awareness. I highly doubt it, but I am all ears. Africa = to most in Western Civilizations/First World Nations the backwater of the world\*; I get a feeling that’s exactly how they want it. Much profit to be made. What happens in Paris, though in a much smaller scale, is what we are taught to “care” about. After all, they are white kinfolk, or so we are taught. This Wiki slab might refresh your memory: [**Rwandan Genocide**](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rwandan_Genocide). Supposedly Clinton’s “greatest regret” as he’s said since. Though I agree with you in principle, fact is, Africa, in general, is there to be exploited currently by foreign powers for the time being. Not sure when that will change or that we’ll see it happen in our lifetimes… Of course none of what I wrote takes away from you point: Africa is fucked if they espect to rely on the West. Unless said reliance is more of the same: corruption for profit on natural resources. He who has the most toys wins at the end. And we obviously need many more. \*The few exceptions to the rule, apparently, to be ignored. ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2015, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/443 "2015-01-15T22:27:35Z")
> [@joebuck20](#): > > Exactly. > > Also, wasn’t it **just a decade or so ago** that Conservatives were calling the French pussies for not supporting the war in Iraq, and doing shit like renaming French fries Freedom fries and criticizing John Kerry for being “too French.” Didn’t Bill O’Reilly at one point call for a boycott of all things French? (Bold and underline added) That was then. This is now. I heard this morning that France is dispatching an aircraft carrier group to add support to the U.S. efforts in the Middle East. I wonder how many French politicians from just a decade or so ago are still in office now. Did the politicians change their minds or did the voters change their politicians? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2015, 10:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/444 "2015-01-15T22:29:36Z")
> [@joebuck20](#): > > Didn’t Bill O’Reilly at one point call for a boycott of all things French? Ever seen Stephen Colbert on O’Reilly’s show? Colbert is just deadpan-mocking O’Reilly while the best counter O’Reilly can summon is a herpity-durp “You’re name is like, _French!_” ---
**Author:** ![doorhinge](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/a5b964/32.png) [@doorhinge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/doorhinge)\ **Post date:** [January 15, 2015, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/445 "2015-01-15T22:31:17Z")
> [@MaxTheVool](#): > > [This is the appropriate amount of respect.](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=NvbMB_GGR6s) Yes, I agree. A comedy sketch certainly equates to Shotgun Joe Biden’s time as VP. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2015, 9:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/446 "2015-01-16T09:35:31Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > It’s important to distinguish between people who will look for any angle to attack a President and mainstream opinion. Not many people care what Glenn Beck or Rush is going to say. > > We do have an outsized impact, but two points: 1) if there’s anyplace the US wouldn’t overshadow things, it’s at an event with 40 other world leaders. When the US President does the usual D-Day commemoration, it does not overshadow everything. It’s perfectly appropriate and the President stands side by side with the French and British leaders and they don’t appear particularly overshadowed by it. 2) The President has often had a weird concept of when he should make his presence felt. Often on very minor issues, like the Harvard Professor case and the Sandra Fluke kerfuffle with Rush. If he was consistent about his reticence to get involved in stuff, he’d be more careful. Instead, he injects himself into any news story that catches his fancy. **This one just didn’t mean all that much to him.** (My bolding). Why do you think Obama doesn’t care about terrorism? What past actions lead you to believe that? I can’t think of any myself. And Obama’s prescence completelyovershadowed everyone else’s at the G8 summit in Cardiff. It would have done here too, and he had no particular reason to be there. European leaders are different, since they are part of the EU. Israel had another reason due to the Jewish people being killed. IOW, the 40 world leaders were almost all from countries that had a direct, obvious reason to go and also lived in countries not that far away. The US is not one of those countries. Again, he’s not President of the World and it’s annoying that you keep acting like he is. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2015, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/447 "2015-01-16T17:03:12Z")
Hey, now, baby steps, slow and steady! First we have to pass the President for Life Amendment… ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2015, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/448 "2015-01-16T17:03:19Z")
> [@SciFiSam](#): > > Why do you think Obama doesn’t care about terrorism? What past actions lead you to believe that? I can’t think of any myself. In fact, based on his actions it’s very much the opposite. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2015, 5:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/449 "2015-01-16T17:13:10Z")
> [@andros](#): > > In fact, based on his actions it’s very much the opposite. Adaher isn’t trying to make factually backed up statements. He’s trying to say anything at all to support his partisan viewpoint without regard to its factual nature. His personal measure of success isn’t based on it being a cogent argument, it’s based on if it sounds credible to casual inspection. ---
**Author:** ![andros](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e480ec/32.png) [@andros](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/andros)\ **Post date:** [January 16, 2015, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/450 "2015-01-16T17:16:10Z")
:sigh: Yeah. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 17, 2015, 12:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/451 "2015-01-17T00:42:19Z")
I already explained. Based on what he chooses to involve himself in that he doesn’t have to involve himself in, and based on what he stays out of that most Presidents would be expected to involve themselves in. And I’m not saying he himself had to go. Just that the event demanded more respect from the US than an Obama campaign bundler. Although I guess in some twisted way that’s the highest respect the President could pay the French, given the unprecedented percentage of unqualified campaign donors he’s appointed as ambassadors. > [@](#): > > While Obama is not the first to appoint political loyalists in place of career diplomats, analysts say he has done so more often: 40 percent of his ambassadors are political appointees compared to 30 percent under Presidents George W. Bush and Bill Clinton. > **[Obama Draws Fire for Ambassador Nominations](https://www.voanews.com/a/obama-draws-fire-for-ambassador-nominations/2556691.html)** > > Criticism follows confirmation of soap opera producer with little knowledge of assigned country ---
**Author:** ![SciFiSam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/47e85d/32.png) [@SciFiSam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SciFiSam)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2015, 9:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/452 "2015-01-19T09:10:59Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > I already explained. Based on what he chooses to involve himself in that he doesn’t have to involve himself in, and based on what he stays out of that most Presidents would be expected to involve themselves in. > > And I’m not saying he himself had to go. Just that the event demanded more respect from the US than an Obama campaign bundler. Although I guess in some twisted way that’s the highest respect the President could pay the French, given the unprecedented percentage of unqualified campaign donors he’s appointed as ambassadors. > > [Obama Draws Fire for Ambassador Nominations](http://www.voanews.com/content/obama-draws-fire-for-ambassador-nominations/2556691.html) Regardless of how the ambassador was appointed, it is completely normal to send the Ambassador to represent the President. Representing the President is one of the Ambassador’s main jobs. They go to foreign weddings (like Royal weddings) and so on all the time. This is the same sort of thing. ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2015, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/453 "2015-01-19T11:41:21Z")
> [@SciFiSam](#): > > it is completely normal to send the Ambassador to represent the President. Representing the President is one of the Ambassador’s main jobs. They go to Royal weddings and so on all the time. This is the same sort of thing. No this isn’t the same thing. In diplomacy, there are times when an Ambassador can represent the president at a formal event. Just like, in business, there are times when a salesman from Apple can represent the corporation at a computer convention. But there are other times when a lowly salesman doesn’t work–you need the boss himself. (example: When presenting a major event like, say, the first Iphone, Steve Jobs himself was on center stage.) The mass march in France was led by 50 heads of state, not 50 amabassadors. The White House belatedly realized the mistake, and officially apologized for their blunder.This proves that the OP was right, and the next 10 pages of the thread were unnecessary. Too bad that Obama’s supporters are still so starry-eyed that they can’t admit that their Dear Leader is capable of making a mistake. ---
**Author:** ![Ludovic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/7ab992/32.png) [@Ludovic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ludovic)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2015, 12:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/454 "2015-01-19T12:33:18Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > Dear Leader Bye bye. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2015, 12:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/455 "2015-01-19T12:41:29Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > The mass march in France was led by 50 heads of state, not 50 amabassadors. > The White House belatedly realized the mistake, and officially apologized for their blunder. Cite? ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2015, 1:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/456 "2015-01-19T13:19:50Z")
> [@Smapti](#): > > Cite? Here ya go: > [@](#): > > The White House has issued a rare statement of regret over its decision not to send a more senior US representative to Sunday’s anti-terrorism march in Paris > **[White House apologizes for not sending top officials to Paris unity march](https://www.theguardian.com/world/2015/jan/12/white-house-apologizes-not-sending-top-officials-charlie-hebdo-march-paris)** > > White House strikes apologetic tone – ‘This kind of symbolism is important’ – but cites ‘more onerous’ security precautions for US president as reason for absence As formy comment about the 50 heads of state, I suppose I’m a bit overstating things. A quick google for “fifty heads of state +Paris” turns up dozens of news reports saying “50 heads of state marched…”, etc etc .I assumed those reports to be accurate.But a closer reading of the articles shows that many of the 50 were not the number-one person in their country. But Germany and England were among those who _did_ send their number-one leader…In the international fight against terrorism and in defence of freedom of speech , the president of the USA is more important a world leader as prime ministers Cameron and Merkel. And Obama should know that, and act like a leader. ---
**Author:** ![chappachula](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/d2c977/32.png) [@chappachula](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/chappachula)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2015, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/457 "2015-01-19T13:28:30Z")
> [@](#): > > Dear Leader > > Bye bye. Gee whiz, did I insult you? Or are you so stupid that you don’t know what hyperbole is? Did you really think that I was actually comparing Obama to North Korea’s dear leader? Didn’t it occur to you that maybe, just maybe, I know the difference? But the fact is that many of Obama’s supporters who followed him 6 years ago like starry-eyed groupies , remain starry-eyed today, unable to criticize him. ---
**Author:** ![Smapti](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/smapti/32/17938_2.png) [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2015, 1:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/458 "2015-01-19T13:28:47Z")
“A more senior representative” does not equal > [@chappachula](#): > > But there are other times when a lowly salesman doesn’t work–you need the boss himself. > (example: When presenting a major event like, say, the first Iphone, Steve Jobs himself was on center stage.) So your statement that > [@](#): > > The White House belatedly realized the mistake, and officially apologized for their blunder.This proves that the OP was right, and the next 10 pages of the thread were unnecessary is factually untrue. ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2015, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/459 "2015-01-19T13:34:09Z")
> [@chappachula](#): > > But the fact is that many of Obama’s supporters who followed him 6 years ago like starry-eyed groupies , remain starry-eyed today, unable to criticize him. And Obama haters are the same as they were 6 years ago, unable to praise him. Some things never change. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2015, 3:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597/460 "2015-01-19T15:32:47Z")
Yeah, except we were right, as shown by the fact that the majority of Americans sides with us now. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597.md?page=22) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-was-barack-obama-to-stand-for-democracy/709597.md?page=24)