# Which 2020 Democrat CAN defeat Trump? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [July 19, 2018, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218 "2018-07-19T18:35:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 17
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2018, 6:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/321 "2018-07-30T18:55:27Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > _None_ of that applies to McRaven. None. All the Regressives have to do is lie. ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2018, 7:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/322 "2018-07-30T19:02:13Z")
It would depend on how well-liked McRaven is by his colleagues in the military. Anyone who’s served as an officer for as long as he has, is bound to make some enemies. But will those enemies outweigh his allies? The Republican spin machine can lie all they want, but they’re just going to look like idiots if 200 guys from the SpecWar community come out in support of McRaven. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2018, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/323 "2018-07-30T19:09:42Z")
The same happened with Kerry, and it didn’t help him. No number of former colleagues or crewmen explaining how the swiftboaters were lying changed any minds. The people looking for reasons to oppose a Democrat don’t need those reasons to be factual, just derogatory. ---
**Author:** ![Silver\_lining](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/aca169/32.png) [@Silver\_lining](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Silver_lining)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2018, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/324 "2018-07-30T19:50:39Z")
> [@ElvisL1ves](#): > > The same happened with Kerry, and it didn’t help him. No number of former colleagues or crewmen explaining how the swiftboaters were lying changed any minds. > > The people looking for reasons to oppose a Democrat don’t need those reasons to be factual, just derogatory. An interesting theory. It seems that Obama was heavily guarded against vetting and derogatory types of comments from the press and his political opponents. Let’s be real, there was a double standard used in his case, just because he was African American and anything said against him, they screamed racism. I don’t think that will work again. With most of the press is left-leaning, the positive comments come easier for Democrats. Fake news is in vogue. Fair coverage, is not. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2018, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/325 "2018-07-30T19:59:08Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > Also, Washington was a general. General of the Armies (posthumously) no less! That’s how we get to twelve. There were {1, 10, 1} General-Presidents in the {18th, 19th, 20th} centuries respectively. **foolsguinea** was asking about the ten 19th-century Generals specifically. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 30, 2018, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/326 "2018-07-30T20:02:29Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > An interesting theory. It seems that Obama was heavily guarded against vetting and derogatory types of comments from the press and his political opponents. Let’s be real, there was a double standard used in his case, just because he was African American and anything said against him, they screamed racism. > > I don’t think that will work again. Um, check out Snopes some time. > **[Obama Articles | Snopes.com](https://www.snopes.com/search/obama/)** > > The definitive Internet reference source for researching urban legends, folklore, myths, rumors, and misinformation. Plenty of fake news, and of course the whole Birther and Secret Muslim things. ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/327 "2018-07-31T00:00:13Z")
> [@Silver\_lining](#): > > Let’s be real, there was a double standard used in his case, just because he was African American and **anything** said against him, they screamed racism. > > I don’t think that will work again. “Anything”? Right - I think you meant “anything racist”, or cite otherwise. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 1:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/328 "2018-07-31T01:16:06Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > The Republican spin machine can lie all they want, but they’re just going to look like idiots if 200 guys from the SpecWar community come out in support of McRaven. Do we expect that they would? Special operations guys aren’t known for sticking their faces out in public for politicians. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 11:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/329 "2018-07-31T11:01:53Z")
Joe Biden seems to me the guy who best matches up to Trump, Trump’s stated eagerness to face him notwithstanding. Maybe Trump actually believes that’s the guy he wants, maybe it’s bravado, maybe he’s trying to screw with Democrats. The way I see it, Joe Biden is Romney in 2012. The Democrats will audition several candidates so as to avoid nominating Joe Biden, but will realize that all but Biden are unready or unacceptable. The good news is that Biden will probably wipe the floor with Trump and won’t disappoint like Romney did. ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/330 "2018-07-31T13:18:52Z")
> [@nelliebly](#): > > Thought it might be interesting to throw [this CNN article](https://www.cnn.com/2018/07/19/politics/2020-democrats-rankings/index.html), out today, into the discussion. > > What do you folks think about those criteria and CNN’s picks? > > …6. Eric Holder. Pros: Obama connection who, like Trump, grew up in Queens. Cons: CNN lists none. I’ve never actually seen him debate or run for anything. Better SCOTUS pick than presidential candidate. > [@](#): > > 1. Kamala Harris: Pros: Black and Indian woman (“sharp contrast” with Trump) with a strong law-and-order background as former CA AG; massive $$ to Dems from California. Cons: None listed. Affair with a married politician twice her age as she was working her way up the ladder. She is soft on crime. She is very anti-2nd amendment. She might make a good VP choice to shore up the Democratic party (or she might turn out to be the Democrat5ic version of Sarah Palin) ---
**Author:** ![Damuri\_Ajashi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/898d66/32.png) [@Damuri\_Ajashi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Damuri_Ajashi)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 1:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/331 "2018-07-31T13:22:06Z")
> [@Lamoral](#): > > I can think of a dozen or so guys that I know personally, who voted for Donald Trump, that I would bet my last dollar would have voted for Webb if the choices were between Webb and Trump. > > People revere the military; they revere Marines; they revere (rightly or wrongly) Reagan, who Webb served under as Secretary of the Navy; and the fact that he was openly pro-gun would seal the deal. > > I am POSITIVE that a lot of guys like this would have looked at their two options and chose the conservative military Southern Democrat over the Republican from New York who looks and acts like a clown. POSITIVE of it. > > Imagine Trump trying to debate Webb. Trump had a million things he could throw at Hillary and have the crowd roaring with laughter; she had _so_ much baggage and so many things that were ripe for mockery; what could Trump have done with Webb? All of Trump’s “tough talk” would seem ridiculous compared to the guy who has _actually killed other people_. I hadn’t thought of him. But you might be right. This may be the only circumstance under which someone with as little charisma as Jim Webb could get elected. He would be good for the country, he would put the country ahead of everything else, but god damn he is boring. he would never make it as a reality TV host. Never. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/332 "2018-07-31T17:55:12Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I’ve never actually seen him debate or run for anything. Better SCOTUS pick than presidential candidate. > > Affair with a married politician twice her age as she was working her way up the ladder. > > She is soft on crime. > > She is very anti-2nd amendment. > > She might make a good VP choice to shore up the Democratic party (or she might turn out to be the Democrat5ic version of Sarah Palin) Harris is also far left and not a good enough public speaker to be slick enough to get around that. I’d also note that in the postwar era only two Senators have been elected, both with off the charts charisma. Harris isn’t anywhere close to that category as a speaker, so her path to the Presidency goes through the California governors’ mansion. If you don’t have charisma, you need a record of competence and accomplishment. She can also get there by being a VP nominee, and I’m sure she’ll be on all the short lists. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/333 "2018-07-31T17:56:51Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I hadn’t thought of him. But you might be right. This may be the only circumstance under which someone with as little charisma as Jim Webb could get elected. He would be good for the country, he would put the country ahead of everything else, but god damn he is boring. he would never make it as a reality TV host. Never. A candidate can be boring, boring candidates get elected all the time. Webb actually had some hooks to draw people in: good with critical white working class voters, military record, executive experience as SecNavy, and a reputation as a centrist. Problem is, that doesn’t get you past Democratic primary voters. ---
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/334 "2018-07-31T18:20:47Z")
> [@adaher](#): > > A candidate can be boring, boring candidates get elected all the time. Not to the Presidency, they don’t. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/335 "2018-07-31T18:32:28Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Not to the Presidency, they don’t. Not recently, no. Not since JFK. ---
**Author:** ![Bijou\_Drains](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bijou_drains/32/2814_2.png) [@Bijou\_Drains](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bijou_Drains)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/336 "2018-07-31T21:02:22Z")
if the economy is doing ok in 2020 like any incumbent Trump will be hard to beat. You would need an A+ level guy to beat him. Don’t see any A+ guys out there so the Dems probably need a bad economy ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 10:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/337 "2018-07-31T22:33:08Z")
> [@Gyrate](#): > > Not to the Presidency, they don’t. The Republicans have won two races with Bushes who could barely speak publicly. The Democrats seem more dependent on charisma than the GOP, but I’d call that a historical coincidence based on finding two generational talents in a relatively short period of time in Clinton and Obama. There are no Clintons or Obamas in this field. Biden actually has quite a bit of charisma, not off the charts Obama level, but he’s a solid talker, likeable, and honest(sometimes too honest). Cory Booker has the raw speaking skills but many progressives actively hate him and he doesn’t use his speaking talent to say much either inspiring or interesting. Easy to see why, since when he goes off script he sounds a little crazy. Harris is a poor speaker, Warren is articulate but a scold, Sanders is just goofy although comedy gold for SNL writers, and Gillibrand is the biggest flip flopper to ever run for office. Much like the wacky cast that tried to take the nomination from Mitt Romney, it’s hard to see any of these folks vault ahead of Joe Biden, the default but weak, frontrunner. But anyway, assuming Democrats elect 2-3 Presidents between now and 2050, I’d bet strongly on only one having really great charisma and the other two being closer to LBJ or Jimmy Carter. ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/338 "2018-07-31T22:37:23Z")
> [@Bijou\_Drains](#): > > if the economy is doing ok in 2020 like any incumbent Trump will be hard to beat. You would need an A+ level guy to beat him. Don’t see any A+ guys out there so the Dems probably need a bad economy I do agree that if the economy stays good people will get kinda used to Trump, at least those he hasn’t directly pissed off. We’re seeing it in his approval, which every month inches up like .1% or so. This time last year he was around 40%, now he’s about 42-43%. At the current trend he’d be 45% in November, which is about where Obama was. So he’ll be plenty beatable, but it’ll take a decent candidate. The good news is the Democrats can do decent. Biden is decent. Sanders isn’t really but I think he matches up well with Trump due to populism and authenticity. Booker and Harris probably bring out young and minority voters but probably can’t win Obama/Trump voters who were so key in 2016 in critical states. Easy to see Booker or Harris win a popular vote victory and another EC loss. I can’t see Gillibrand or Warren doing well at all. They can beat Trump if he’s more unpopular than he is now but at 45% approval I think they end up like Romney. Close, but oh so far. ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 11:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/339 "2018-07-31T23:22:07Z")
> [@Damuri\_Ajashi](#): > > I hadn’t thought of him. But you might be right. This may be the only circumstance under which someone with as little charisma as Jim Webb could get elected. He would be good for the country, he would put the country ahead of everything else, but god damn he is boring. he would never make it as a reality TV host. Never. I’m thinking if he could be trained to get through the Naval Academy and Vietnam, he could be trained to be less boring, right? There are professional debate coaches and acting teachers and all kinds of people who make their living teaching other people how to be un-boring. I’m not really down with the idea that someone’s charisma and personality is totally fixed; it can be changed, right? ---
**Author:** ![adaher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/dec6dc/32.png) [@adaher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/adaher)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2018, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218/340 "2018-07-31T23:25:24Z")
People can improve at public speaking but I don’t think you can change a Jim Webb into a Bill Clinton. Maybe you could get him into Joe Lieberman territory. 🙂 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218.md?page=16) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-2020-democrat-can-defeat-trump/818218.md?page=18)