# Which Academy Awards should be revoked? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [December 27, 2004, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726 "2004-12-27T01:44:03Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Fiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/e274bd/32.png) [@Fiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fiver)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 1:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/81 "2004-12-29T13:59:59Z")
> [@Martin Hyde](#): > > documentaries that very dangerously skirt the definition, I don’t know. I just know if the AA is going to have a documentary award it should probably be a bit more fleshed out than it is and certainly try to hit at the real nature of documentary films, which BfC really isn’t. Please explain how _Bowling for Columbine_ fails to meet the Academy criteria for documentaries, as quoted by **AwSnappity**. Show us how it even “skirts” the definition. ---
**Author:** ![Katriona](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/katriona/32/113_2.png) [@Katriona](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Katriona)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 3:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/82 "2004-12-29T15:08:42Z")
> [@Silentgoldfish](#): > > **A Beautiful Mind**. Both best picture and director and actor; why award a retard-of-the-week melodrama? Exactly my feeling about “Forrest Gump” beating out “Pulp Fiction.” ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/83 "2004-12-29T16:41:18Z")
Beautiful Mind was not about a retard, it was about a genius. He was unstable, not disabled. ---
**Author:** ![Gamaliel](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b487fb/32.png) [@Gamaliel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gamaliel)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/84 "2004-12-29T18:29:42Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > Beautiful Mind was not about a retard, it was about a genius. He was unstable, not disabled. I doubt Hollywood makes such distinctions. It’s all part of the tired old ‘triumph over personal adversity’ genre. ---
**Author:** ![ISiddiqui](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/97f17d/32.png) [@ISiddiqui](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ISiddiqui)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/85 "2004-12-29T20:54:08Z")
> [@Kyla](#): > > Ah, I never got that. How clever! Just more evidence that Shakespeare in Love was a brilliant movie. There’s even a logical reason behind casting Ben Affleck in an Elizabethan drama! Yep… the movie is VERY clever and sometimes multiple viewings can reveal all of the fun, like peeling back an onion. ---
**Author:** ![Dragonblink](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b9bd4f/32.png) [@Dragonblink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dragonblink)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 10:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/86 "2004-12-29T22:03:01Z")
> [@don't ask](#): > > Michael Caine should have just said “What a load of bollocks,” and given his to Haley Joel Osment. It’s worth noting that Caine did something somewhat akin to that: in his acceptance speech, he gave an eloquent nod to each of his fellow nominees, including Osment, and said that it was extremely fitting that they had changed “And the winner is …” to “And the award goes to …” because none of the other people up for that role were really _losers_. His speech made it clear that he had seen each of the other nominees’ pictures and thought very highly of each of their performances. I remember thinking it was quite possibly the classiest acceptance speech I’ve ever heard. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [December 29, 2004, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/87 "2004-12-29T23:25:50Z")
Gamaliel: > [@](#): > > I doubt Hollywood makes such distinctions. It’s all part of the tired old ‘triumph over personal adversity’ genre. Perhaps, but certainly it puts Crowe’s performance in **Beautiful Mind** in a different category from Hanks in **Forrest Gump** or Hoffman in **Rain Man**. ---
**Author:** ![Lulia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a88e4f/32.png) [@Lulia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lulia)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 2:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/88 "2004-12-30T02:20:07Z")
After reading this thread, I would like to point out something that annoys me: Now, I’m not saying that Julia Roberts, Gwyneth Paltrow and other starlets deserved their OscarsTM, but saying that an actor who, after winning said award stars in crappy films should return their Oscar is just ridiculous. If the Academy feels that the best supporting actor of 1996 was Cuba Gooding Jr., they based it on his work in a 1996 movie, not on his future ones. Now, if he _deserved_ the award at that point is another question entirely. Also, what is a good movie? What is a great performance? ---
**Author:** ![Stratocaster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stratocaster/32/16393_2.png) [@Stratocaster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stratocaster)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 2:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/89 "2004-12-30T02:41:38Z")
> [@Lulia](#): > > Also, what is a good movie? What is a great performance? It’s whatever I say it is. Feel free to check with me if you’re unsure. ---
**Author:** ![Manduck](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/manduck/32/256_2.png) [@Manduck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Manduck)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/90 "2004-12-30T02:46:00Z")
> [@malkabat](#): > > Zeta Jones really impressed me with her singing and dancing. She wiped the floor with Zellweger Just chiming in to say that I would pay good money to see that 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![vivalostwages](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/d07c76/32.png) [@vivalostwages](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/vivalostwages)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 2:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/91 "2004-12-30T02:47:36Z")
Just off the top o’ my head: Last year’s Best Pic should have been **Master and Commander** –not that I have a problem with LOTR, but the first one might have been more deserving than the third. Affleck and Damon should not have won a damn thing for **Good Will Hunting** script, which I found incredibly predictable and irritating. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 3:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/92 "2004-12-30T03:28:21Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > Perhaps, but certainly it puts Crowe’s performance in **Beautiful Mind** in a different category from Hanks in **Forrest Gump** or Hoffman in **Rain Man**. No, it really doesn’t. You’re right that in terms of real human beings, it’s a big and important difference. As far as Hollywood movies are concerned, it’s very much in the same vein. A little bit less treacly, but still basically what **Rubystreak** said in the general sense. **RickJay** , I haven’t seen _Hurricane_. Maybe I’ll look for it if you think he was that good. Anyway if it’s up to me, he’d have won the award for a great part in a great movie, and that’s what _Malcolm X_ was. ---
**Author:** ![DoctorJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctorj/32/2904_2.png) [@DoctorJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DoctorJ)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 3:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/93 "2004-12-30T03:59:47Z")
Julia Roberts’s past roles have nothing to do with why she didn’t deserve her Oscar. It didn’t even have anything to do with her performance, which was good, and might have been a legit winner in a lot of other years. Just not in the same year as Ellen Burstyn’s performance in _Requiem for a Dream_, which is one of the best acting jobs ever done, IMO. I cannot understand how anyone could have voted for _Dances with Wolves_ over Goodfellas for either Best Picture or Best Director. I _really_ can’t see how Lorraine Bracco lost Best Supporting Actress to Whoopi Goldberg in _Ghost_. What did she do in that role, other than be Whoopi Goldberg? ---
**Author:** ![Diceman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/22d042/32.png) [@Diceman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diceman)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/94 "2004-12-30T04:27:14Z")
> [@DoctorJ](#): > > I _really_ can’t see how Lorraine Bracco lost Best Supporting Actress to Whoopi Goldberg in _Ghost_. What did she do in that role, other than be Whoopi Goldberg? Really. Whoopi is one of a number of Hollywood “actors” who really only have one character that gets inserted into every role. Clint Eastwood is another of these non-actors; you can give him a badge and call him Dirty Harry, or give him a cowboy hat and call him The Man With No Name, but it’s basically the same guy. ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 4:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/95 "2004-12-30T04:57:33Z")
Marley23: > [@](#): > > No, it really doesn’t. You’re right that in terms of real human beings, it’s a big and important difference. As far as Hollywood movies are concerned, it’s very much in the same vein. A little bit less treacly, but still basically what Rubystreak said in the general sense. That’s true regarding the movie, which would be an argument over the “Best Picture” award. I was arguing regarding the character, and the lead actors’ “Best Actor” awards. ---
**Author:** ![Rubystreak](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e5b9ba/32.png) [@Rubystreak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rubystreak)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 8:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/96 "2004-12-30T08:37:46Z")
> [@cmkeller](#): > > That’s true regarding the movie, which would be an argument over the “Best Picture” award. I was arguing regarding the character, and the lead actors’ “Best Actor” awards. I think Russell Crowe did a good job in _A Beautiful Mind_. I came into that movie with a lot of biases against it, which I still hold, but I can’t dis on Crowe’s performance. However, I have a policy of being officially disgusted when an actor gets an Oscar nomination or award for what is, essentially, a show-off part. Hanks in _Gump_, Crowe in _Mind_, Hoffman in _Rainman_… these were over-the-top performances, mannered to show how different the character is from “regular” people. Don’t you think that’s actually much easier than playing a “regular” person dealing with something extraordinary? IMO that’s much harder than what Crowe did, or Penn in _I Am Sam_ (bleah), also nominated that year. That year (2001), there were several nominations that ticked me off. I’ve already mentioned Crowe and Penn. As much as I admire Denzel Washington, he was playing a cartoon, another chew the scenery, ‘look Ma, I’m really acting!’ type role. I also am skeptical of biopics on general principle, but Will Smith was amazing as _Muhammad Ali_. Then again, he did have good make up going for him though, and a real person on which to model himself (as did Crowe). As much as I was left cold by _In the Bedroom_, Tom Wilkinson had the toughest role of anyone nominated that year, and he was totally convincing to me. But I guess that’s not what the Academy voters look for. \*In the Bedroom \* was a rough movie, and Wilkinson’s character dwells in a moral grey zone that is disquieting (maybe that’s also why Ben Kingsley lost the Supporting Oscar to Jim Broadbent that year?). Thus, no Oscar for him. I think the Academy folks want a character to make them feel good, uplifted, and happy with themselves, as if nominating an actor playing a character with a disability somehow shows them to be enlightened and charitable towards the disabled, or something. I don’t quite get it myself. _Hurricane_ was a good movie, and Washington was great as always. However, I think it’s a dishonest film and that soured me on it retroactively. Right after seeing the film, I was so worked up about the injustice to Ruben Carter that I did some research, and came to the conclusion that he was, in fact, guilty. In any case, the situation is certainly not as it’s presented in the movie. Though this shouldn’t take anything away from Washington’s performance, the whole project is diminished in my eyes as a result. ---
**Author:** ![rockle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/73ab20/32.png) [@rockle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rockle)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/97 "2004-12-30T18:31:21Z")
I think that the makers of _Maya Lin: A Strong Clear Vision_ (Best Documentary Feature, 1994) should have refused their Oscar, because even _they_ know that _Hoop Dreams_ is a far superior film. (Incidentally, _Hoop Dreams_’ Oscar snubs led to the changing of the rules and definitions for inclusion in the Documentary categories, IIRC.) Also: I second whoever said Ben Affleck should give his Oscar back. Immediately. Take it back by force, if necessary. If _he_ has one, then Kevin Smith should have at least been nominated for _something_ (except the steaming pile of crap that is _Jersey Girl_.) ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/98 "2004-12-30T19:14:34Z")
Despite the fact that I’ve already posted in this thread, and made my usual attack on the common practice giving out awards to actors who play the retarded or the mentally challenged… SOMEBODY has to say this: There’s practically no way to give out an award that everybody agrees on. I don’t always agree with the Oscar selections, or with Pulitzer Prize selections, or baseball MVP selections, but you know what? On the whole, the selections made are VERY rarely embarrassingly bad ones. Would I have given the 1978 MVP award to Ron Guidry over Jim Rice? Yes. Was Jim Rice therefore a terrible choice? Not at all- he had a great season, and I don’t begrudge him the award. Do I think there have been better novelists than John Steinbeck? Definitely- but his body of work is good enough that I tune out when someone grumbles that James Joyce or Theodore Dreiser or \_\_ (your pick) was more deserving. And while I’ve been a bit disappointed by some Oscar selections, you know what? I can’t think of any HORRIBLE films that have won Best Picture. Sure, there were years when better films (in my opinion) were overlooked, but I scoff at people who’ll claim that “Titanic” or “Oliver!” was the worst film ever made (even the people making such claims can’t possibly believe what they’re saying). I liked “Saving Private Ryan” a lot better than “Shakespeare in Love,” but “SIL” was very clever, and I enjoyed it. So, I was disappointed by the Best Picture selection… for about 15 seconds, at which point I stopped thinking about it. If you’re still outraged about that (or any other Oscar pick), feel free to create your own annual award and give it to anyone you like. ---
**Author:** ![Ephemera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8baadc/32.png) [@Ephemera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ephemera)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/99 "2004-12-30T19:43:23Z")
Since it’s been mentioned so much in this thread, I thought I’d ask here instead of starting a new thread: Is _Shakespeare in Love_ in contemporary english? I have it on my Netflix queue and am curious as to whether or not I’m going to need Cliff’s Notes or something. ---
**Author:** ![Yookeroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yookeroo/32/323_2.png) [@Yookeroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yookeroo)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2004, 9:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726/100 "2004-12-30T21:05:36Z")
> [@Aesiron](#): > > Since it’s been mentioned so much in this thread, I thought I’d ask here instead of starting a new thread: Is _Shakespeare in Love_ in contemporary english? I have it on my Netflix queue and am curious as to whether or not I’m going to need Cliff’s Notes or something. You should have no problem understanding it. I often find Shakespeare hard to follow, but had no problem following this movie. Some familarity with Romeo & Juliet probably helps though. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-academy-awards-should-be-revoked/281726.md?page=6)