# Which band best typifies "hard rock"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [March 7, 2021, 6:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397 "2021-03-07T18:47:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [March 8, 2021, 11:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/81 "2021-03-08T23:58:40Z")
I dunno, they had that “flower power” song. 😃 [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/QrJlyapt6OY/hqdefault.jpg "spinal tap: listen to the flower people") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QrJlyapt6OY) ---
**Author:** ![Si\_Amigo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/si_amigo/32/2877_2.png) [@Si\_Amigo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Si_Amigo)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 12:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/82 "2021-03-09T00:02:37Z")
Well the Who actually had exploding drums on live TV. [![](https://img.youtube.com/vi/gu42_-Dp4Tw/hqdefault.jpg "Keith moon puts to much gun powder in his drum kit and blows up in his face") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gu42_-Dp4Tw) ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 12:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/83 "2021-03-09T00:03:29Z")
If it ain’t AC/DC (which it is), then it’s Motorhead. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 12:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/84 "2021-03-09T00:37:25Z")
> [@Eonwe](#): > > I know some might consider them more heavy metal, but surely Jethro Tull deserves a place in this discussion. They’re not hard as a rock, but they are thick as a brick. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 1:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/85 "2021-03-09T01:02:26Z")
> [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > **Not hard rock:** > > The Who. Songs like ‘Eminence Front’, ‘Sea and Sand’ and ‘Behind Blue Eyes’ are far from hard rock, and The Who had a LOT of songs like that. Love them, but not hard rock. They had hard rock songs, but it didn’t define them. Plus, they rode scooters and wore their hair neat. That will not do. Still one of my favorite bands, though. See, to me, the Who are one of the original hard rock bands. If I were forced to slot them in one genre, it would be hard rock – few bands, if any, rocked harder than they did. Like one Doper once quipped “most bands play with each other; the Who played against each other.” Just because they had other colors in their musical palette doesn’t mean to me they are not, at heart, a hard rock band, at least in the Keith Moon years. (I don’t listen to anything post-Moon. When he died, the Who became a different band.) ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/86 "2021-03-09T01:27:45Z")
I’m really confused then - Why is Metallica not mentioned? And no mention of Boston? ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 1:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/87 "2021-03-09T01:33:19Z")
> [@simster](#): > > I’m really confused then - Why is Metallica not mentioned? Is it possible that Metallica is considered a Metal band? ---
**Author:** ![Guest-starring\_Id](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guest-starring_id/32/21736_2.png) [@Guest-starring\_Id](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guest-starring_Id)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 1:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/88 "2021-03-09T01:57:30Z")
> [@Ludovic](#): > > Kick it Out, Straight On, and Mistral Wind. Magic Man, White Lightning and Wine, and Little Queen are neither hard nor soft so shouldn’t be counted for or against being hard rock. Indeed - give or take. 😉 Oh - [Heart coffee ad!](https://youtu.be/kTqOMiKfONI?t=14) No - two of them! ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/89 "2021-03-09T02:00:53Z")
Boston was mentioned by @Gatopescado. I personally don’t find them to be particularly “hard.” I’d call the arena rock But I don’t really think of them as “hard rock.” This could just be me, as I know they are lopped into that genre sometimes/often. Metallica is heavy metal, specifically thrash metal, but you can make “metal” a subset of “hard rock” here if you want. It depends on if you’re a lumper or a splitter in terms of musical genres. I consider metal separate from my idea of hard rock, but it’s a little difficult for me to define it succinctly. ---
**Author:** ![Didi44](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47c2d/32.png) [@Didi44](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Didi44)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/90 "2021-03-09T02:39:47Z")
To those who say Cream, I hope Ginger and Jack pay you a visit tonight. Even Eric acknowledges they were a jazz trio. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 3:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/91 "2021-03-09T03:26:12Z")
I don’t care what Eric says, they were in no meaningful way a jazz trio. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 11:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/92 "2021-03-09T11:21:42Z")
Outside nomination of _The Cult_. Because I like them and I can’t stand _AC/DC_. > [@Sam\_Stone](#): > > **Hard Rock:** > […] > Rammstein Just … no. Not in a million years. ---
**Author:** ![Edward\_The\_Head](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ce73a5/32.png) [@Edward\_The\_Head](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Edward_The_Head)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 11:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/93 "2021-03-09T11:49:43Z")
> [@TriPolar](#): > > ETA: Beevis may have helped AC/DC maintain an on-going status as the face of Hard Rock. That was Butt-Head who wore the AC/DC shirt. Beavis wore the Metalica shirt. I think AC/DC would have to be it. I skimmed through my albums and most other artists changed through their careers, AC/DC stayed pretty consistent throughout. Motorhead would be up there, though Lemmy always said they were a Rock and Roll band. ---
**Author:** ![jaycat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jaycat/32/3015_2.png) [@jaycat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jaycat)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 1:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/94 "2021-03-09T13:18:40Z")
Among his other issues, Eric wouldn’t know jazz if it bit him on the butt. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 1:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/95 "2021-03-09T13:23:19Z")
> [@Edward\_The\_Head](#): > > That was Butt-Head who wore the AC/DC shirt. Beavis wore the Metalica shirt. Aw jeez, I’m even dumber than those two idiots. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/96 "2021-03-09T15:22:58Z")
> [@pulykamell](#): > > I don’t care what Eric says, they were in no meaningful way a jazz trio. Their last single. Isn’t anything with a flute jazz? [![](https://i.ytimg.com/vi/MB2f6-U72Zk/hqdefault.jpg "Cream - Anyone For Tennis") ](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MB2f6-U72Zk) Remember when Eric walked out of the Yardbirds because “For Your Love” was too poppy? ---
**Author:** ![Didi44](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e47c2d/32.png) [@Didi44](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Didi44)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 3:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/97 "2021-03-09T15:50:12Z")
Eric never was/isn’t a jazz musician, but Ginger and Jack were and they both have stated their playing in _Cream_ was based in jazz. Ginger’s original concept for _Cream_ was a jazz trio. Eric went in thinking it would be blues trio, actually quartet because he wanted keyboards, which he got in _Blind Faith._ It evolved to whatever you want to call it except hard rock as we think of it today. Also, I should have clarified that Eric’s “admitting” it was a jazz trio is a kind of joke because of what Ginger and Jack have been saying for decades. _ **“I thought of Cream as sort of a jazz band,” Jack Bruce said, “only we never told Eric he was really Ornette Coleman.”** _ [https://www.rollingstone.com/feature/how-cream-defined-the-rock-power-trio-190712/](https://www.rollingstone.com/feature/how-cream-defined-the-rock-power-trio-190712/) "Despite his rock bona fides, Baker always insisted that Cream were a jazz band. “Oh, for God’s sake, I’ve never played rock,” he [told jazz.fm](https://jazz.fm/interview-ginger-baker/) in 2013. “_ **Cream was two jazz players and a blues guitarist playing improvised music.** _ We never played the same thing two nights running … It was jazz.” And I know heavy metal is different from hard rock. “I’ve seen where Cream is sort of held responsible for the birth of heavy metal,” Baker said in a typically [caustic 2015 interview](http://www.forbes.com/sites/jimclash/2015/06/12/creams-ginger-baker-opines-on-heavy-metal-led-zeppelin-beatles/#3ec17f634327). “Well, I would definitely go for aborting. I loathe and detest heavy metal. I think it is an abortion." > **[Ginger Baker of Cream](https://www.rollingstone.com/music/music-news/ginger-baker-cream-dead-obituary-240630/)** > > One of rock’s greatest drummers laid the groundwork for heavy metal and world music while excelling at jazz and Afrobeat ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/98 "2021-03-09T16:25:28Z")
Well, I respectfully disagree with the cantankerous but talented Mr. Baker. He most definitely did play within the rock idiom behind the kit, whether he likes to admit it or not. Yes, it was through the lens of jazz background and technique, but he played rock music. There is nothing about rock music saying it cannot be an improvised form. They very clearly have song structures, they may mix things up, but – and it’s all a continuum – to me it’s clearly rock-based with jazz influences vs the other way around. He just has some bee in his bonnet about being called a “rock” band for whatever reason – he sees it as somehow derogatory. Whatever. I don’t listen to what he says, just what he plays. ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/99 "2021-03-09T16:42:14Z")
If you had to explain to the aforementioned alien more precisely what is meant by hard rock, what modes/keys/rhythms/instruments/chord progressions/structures characterise it? ---
**Author:** ![BrickBat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/ac91a4/32.png) [@BrickBat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrickBat)\ **Post date:** [March 9, 2021, 4:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397/100 "2021-03-09T16:53:44Z")
That’s not how I see it. Metal _is_ hard rock. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397.md?page=4) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-band-best-typifies-hard-rock/937397.md?page=6)