# Which came first: the Cheeseheads or the... **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [September 23, 2005, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045 "2005-09-23T13:53:14Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![ShibbOleth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/848f3c/32.png) [@ShibbOleth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ShibbOleth)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/1 "2005-09-23T13:53:14Z")
Which came first,t he Cheeseheads or those strange hats that Green Bay Packers fans like to wear? I know that Wisconsin has long been “America’s Dairyland” and is responsible for inflicting us with non-threatening cheese foods. But did the Packers fans get the nickname from the state, or from those silly cheese wedge hats that they wear? ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 2:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/2 "2005-09-23T14:17:56Z")
Before the hats apeared on the scene there was a series of T-shirts in Wisconsin featuring “The Cheeseheads”, a family whose heads were wedges of cheddar. But our Friendly Illinois Brethren (or FIB’s) have been calling us Cheeseheads for decades. My main problem with the Cheesehead hats is, what kind of cheese is that supposed to be? It has holes like swiss, but is cheddar-colored. ( actually I guess it’s really more yellow.) That has always bothered me, being the stickler for accuracy that I am. And no I do not own, nor have I have I ever owned, a cheesehead hat. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 3:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/3 "2005-09-23T15:49:27Z")
I proudly own a cheesehead hat. And I think the cheese is what is known as “Tom n Jerry” cheese. ---
**Author:** ![Scruloose](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e68b1a/32.png) [@Scruloose](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scruloose)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/4 "2005-09-23T16:26:01Z")
> [@August West](#): > > But our Friendly Illinois Brethren (or FIB’s) have been calling us Cheeseheads for decades. 😃 Hmmm… as a former Chicagoan who lived in Wisconsin for several years, I seem to recall FIB as standing for something else… :dubious: [sub]I’ll be a FIB again this time next year![/sub] ---
**Author:** ![August\_West](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/august_west/32/18069_2.png) [@August\_West](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/August_West)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 5:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/5 "2005-09-23T17:57:46Z")
I’m pretty sure that any alternate meaning of FIB is a myth concocted by Chicagoans to make us poor Wisconsinites seem mean. \ SHHHHH! Don’t spill the beans!\ P.S. Welcome back to the Midwest next year, make sure you come up and see us in Illinois’ largest State Park sometime. ---
**Author:** ![Missy2U](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@Missy2U](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Missy2U)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/6 "2005-09-23T18:29:08Z")
So which of you friendly, loveable, wonderful Wisconsinites are going to send me a Cheesehead??? I’ll send you the money and a fedex number if you’ll just send me one! I’m a HUGE Packer Fan (we even have a Packer Tape Measure from Home Depot!!) and when Mr2U and I are at the bar on Sundays, we like to be as obnoxious as possible. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Duckster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duckster/32/1244_2.png) [@Duckster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Duckster)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 6:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/7 "2005-09-23T18:33:10Z")
> [@Missy2U](#): > > So which of you friendly, loveable, wonderful Wisconsinites are going to send me a Cheesehead??? I’ll send you the money and a fedex number if you’ll just send me one! I’m a HUGE Packer Fan (we even have a Packer Tape Measure from Home Depot!!) and when Mr2U and I are at the bar on Sundays, we like to be as obnoxious as possible. 😃 You can [buy them online](http://www.cheesehead.com/). ---
**Author:** ![Missy2U](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3bc359/32.png) [@Missy2U](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Missy2U)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 6:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/8 "2005-09-23T18:35:42Z")
D’OH - Thanks Duckster!! ---
**Author:** ![samclem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a9a28c/32.png) [@samclem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/samclem)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/9 "2005-09-23T18:56:13Z")
_Cheesehead_ used as a general insult goes back to the teens. Wisconsin-specific cheeseheads came much later. ---
**Author:** ![Bytegeist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9dc877/32.png) [@Bytegeist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bytegeist)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/10 "2005-09-23T19:15:19Z")
> [@samclem](#): > > _Cheesehead_ used as a general insult goes back to the teens. Wisconsin-specific cheeseheads came much later. And _cheesehead_ should never be confused with _headcheese_, an altogether different sort of entity. And by “different” I mean alien, bizarre, other-wordly, perhaps satanic. ---
**Author:** ![Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/qadgop_the_mercotan/32/83_2.png) [@Qadgop\_the\_Mercotan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Qadgop_the_Mercotan)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/11 "2005-09-23T19:51:03Z")
> [@Bytegeist](#): > > And _cheesehead_ should never be confused with _headcheese_, an altogether different sort of entity. > > And by “different” I mean alien, bizarre, other-wordly, perhaps satanic. Mmmmmmmmmm… Head cheese, aged cheddar, vegemite, and habanero sauce, all on a toasted bagel. I’m in! Head cheese is nothing more than a tasty meat jelly. It just looks deadly. So before eating it, just close your eyes with holy dread! ---
**Author:** ![duffer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/duffer/32/1026_2.png) [@duffer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/duffer)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/12 "2005-09-23T19:58:31Z")
Oh, man. I haven’t had headcheese in many many years. Tasty, ambiguous and oh so disusting to look at. God I love that stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Casey1505](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dc4da7/32.png) [@Casey1505](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Casey1505)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/13 "2005-09-23T20:07:34Z")
Is headcheese related to scrapple? From what I understand, scrapple is stuff that couldn’t even make it into a hot dog. ---
**Author:** ![sqweels](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/f19dbf/32.png) [@sqweels](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/sqweels)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/14 "2005-09-23T21:02:54Z")
How about dickcheese, ever have any of that? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Bytegeist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9dc877/32.png) [@Bytegeist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bytegeist)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 10:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/15 "2005-09-23T22:26:23Z")
> [@Casey1505](#): > > Is headcheese related to scrapple? From what I understand, scrapple is stuff that couldn’t even make it into a hot dog. It’s appalling, isn’t it, that our species would have invented _both_ headcheese _and_ scrapple. You’d think just one of these would have been enough to prove the concept. Just one or the other would have revealed the boundless frontier of Disgusting Edibles, and then all further interest in the field, this highly competitive field apparently, should have fallen instantly. Before reaching the bathroom even. But no. Having mastered fire, our species had to go an invent napalm. Having grasped the atom, we had to go and invent nuclear bombs. Having discovered music, we had to go and invent Britney Spears. And having tasted pig, we had to go cook up every conceivable combination of pig bits, in every conceivable way. We just can’t stop biting into that forbidden apple of knowledge, over and over and over — exactly how roast pigs are served, come to think of it. Sorry, I digress. Anyway, to remind ourselves of what headcheese is, we’ll drink a quick swig of vodka and then consult the [Pig Processing FAQ](http://members.tripod.com/~BayGourmet/pig.html). If you already have this site bookmarked, I don’t want to know that side of you. And if you drink some more vodka, you won’t have to remember what you’re about to read: > [@](#): > > **Headcheese** > > Headcheese is one of the more simple and **popular uses for the pig’s head** , though there are certainly more complex ones — deboning and stuffing, roasting whole, or deboning cheek and jowl in the classic English “Bath Chap” dish are all methods of utilizing this **underappreciated cut** that have a long historical backing. […] > > To make headcheese, **remove the eyes from the pig’s head** and set it in a large pot to slowly boil down for four or five hours in hot water and a generous dollop of white vinegar. If you like, add a handful of herbs to taste (bay leaf, thyme and cracked pepper works well), some onions, carrots and garlic. Add all four cleaned hocks as well, and **make sure you have neatly de-hooved them** first. You can add any **meat scraps that you do not want** for terrine or pate or sausage also, **especially if they are gristly bits** that will benefit from long stewing. > > You can **add those trotters** to the headcheese, or you can do something else with them once they have been boiled into softness. You can pickle them in a mixture of vinegar and **brine** , or bone them and stuff them and roll them in crispy breadcrumbs. **The ears, boiled into tenderness** on the outside and **crunchy cartilaginousness within** , are also worth removing and serving up separately. > > **Splitting the head in half** is optional but helpful; if you do, **remove the brains** and […] I’m sorry, I had to stop it right there. I had to go look at a portrait of Cthulu to clear my head. You can read the rest on your own time. Next up on the menu of horrors, I offer you [scrapple](http://www.velvitoil.com/Scrapple.htm): > [@](#): > > **Scrapple** […] > > The **feature attraction** is the cleaned head. **Remove the eyeballs** (the brains were removed on killing day and scrambled with eggs the next morning), **break the head(s) into manageable pieces with a cleaver**, and cook them down in a kettle of boiling water 'til the meat is easily pulled. Skim the fat from the water and save. Pull all of the meat and fat (separate) from the heads and chop up the chunks. Cook the liver and heart **and whatever else wasn’t used** in other delicacies and **grind them up**. Get a tote-sack full of corn meal and keep it handy. Put the meat, heart, and other scraps (except liver) back into the simmering kettle of stock. Add liver until you can taste it but the liver flavor does not predominate. You can **put some of the fat in** if you wish. Add salt and celery salt - the cornmeal will take a lot of salt so you get this mixture fairly salty. Stir. **Taste.** Add sage and pepper to taste - not too much, now. Stir. **Taste.** Pass the spoon around so everybody can **pass judgment**. When it’s right, you should taste salt first, then liver - but not too strong, rich pork meat flavor and a hint of sage. When everybody … is agreed that it couldn’t possibly be better, bring out the cornmeal **and kids [?!?]**. > > […] Hoo-kay. It’s alright. Breathe easy now. Everything’s going to be alright. Those people are far, far away from here. Oooooh, oh God. Oh Mary Mother of Christ. _I am not well._ […] Okay. Better now. Had a lie down. And more vodka. I’m getting my second wind. To continue. Scrapple and headcheese seem to be very similar. Both eschew the pig’s eyeballs for example, though offhand I can’t understand the sudden finickiness, given everything else that goes in. But headcheese is open to including the ears, in toto, with their “crunchy cartilaginousness”, whereas scrapple seems to reserve the ears only for the marinade. On the other hand, scrapple includes cornmeal, a welcome and hearty vegetable addition to an otherwise all-meat product. Finally, note that scrapple uses children as an ingredient. Presumably the young, slower ones who can’t run away fast enough. I have to admit this surprised me at first, but it’s not so surprising once you realize that scrapple must have found its original inspiration in some severe famine. People make do with what they have available. Hope this helps. ---
**Author:** ![Casey1505](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dc4da7/32.png) [@Casey1505](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Casey1505)\ **Post date:** [September 23, 2005, 11:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/16 "2005-09-23T23:43:37Z")
> [@Bytegeist](#): > > Hope this helps. :eek: :curls up into fetal position, begins rocking back and forth, and inserts thumb into mouth: ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [September 25, 2005, 8:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-came-first-the-cheeseheads-or-the/323045/17 "2005-09-25T08:04:21Z")
Cheesehead grandson of a cheesemaker here. The nickname “cheesehead” for Wisconsinites has been around for decades, and the Cheesehead created by [Foamation](http://www.cheesehead.com/) in the late 1980s is simply a product realization of the nickname. I own three of them!