# Which country has the best armed forces? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [February 28, 2005, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210 "2005-02-28T00:31:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![WeRSauron](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f19dbf/32.png) [@WeRSauron](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WeRSauron)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 12:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/1 "2005-02-28T00:31:44Z")
Which country has the best armed forces? How/why so? (I opine it may be Israel or USA, but I have no facts to back either supposition.) WRS - ![y][ch] [l][a][r][s][y] [m][a] ---
**Author:** ![Quartz](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quartz/32/267_2.png) [@Quartz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Quartz)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 12:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/2 "2005-02-28T00:43:15Z")
What do you mean by ‘best armed forces’? At a national level, I’d say the USA; at the squad or troop level, I’d say the UK special forces, but I may be somewhat biased there :D; at an individual level, it’s got to be US pilots as they get hours in the air for which other pilots can only dream, though UK submarine captains probably run pretty close. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 12:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/3 "2005-02-28T00:52:41Z")
I’d assume the Israeli counterterrorism units are the best with the most experience. I’d vote for General Staff Reconnaissance Unit 269 [http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Terrorism/sayerot.html](http://www.jewishvirtuallibrary.org/jsource/Terrorism/sayerot.html) ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/4 "2005-02-28T01:15:46Z")
Overall–USA. Squad level–Israel. Period. ---
**Author:** ![Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 1:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/5 "2005-02-28T01:26:21Z")
Overall, it’s the US kicking ass, with no one close. Squad Level: The US, whose forces have really cliqued in recent months–and will be even better after ground operations commence in Iran. (sorry, but true.) ---
**Author:** ![gravitycrash](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/977dab/32.png) [@gravitycrash](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gravitycrash)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 2:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/6 "2005-02-28T02:48:07Z")
based on population I would say Isreal. They have a huge number of fighter jets as well as Tanks . ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 3:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/7 "2005-02-28T03:20:34Z")
National level? The United States. Squad level? British SAS. Individual level? Tough call. It’s either Sergeant Sven Olandsen in the Swedish Army’s Norrbotten Armoured Battalion or Captain Bokyun Shin of South Korea’s Zaytun Division. Olandsen’s got more instinctive talent but Shin’s stronger on military theory. ---
**Author:** ![Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 4:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/8 "2005-02-28T04:47:32Z")
> [@Little Nemo](#): > > National level? The United States. > > Squad level? British SAS. British Special Forces have long complained about being chronically underfunded vis-a-vis their American counterparts. Given the advantages that the best technology confers–and the rough equivalence of tactics–SAS may be coasting on rep. Factor in the synergistics of what the combined US military can bring to bear against an adversary (and bring to support a special ops team), and there’s little doubt of the US as best. **Sam Stone** will be along to remind us about the dread Canadian Special Forces and the Canadian Red Birds/ Snow Birds? whose aerobatic skills as displayed in North American airshows is second to none. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 6:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/9 "2005-02-28T06:49:42Z")
Actually, I was attempting to be ironic. Several other posters were making comparisons between countries at the “squad level” which is essentially meaningless - wars are fought between nations not squads. So I made a joke about the two best individual soldiers in the world (both were fictional of course). ---
**Author:** ![Mycroft\_H](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/898d66/32.png) [@Mycroft\_H](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mycroft_H)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 2:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/10 "2005-02-28T14:15:32Z")
> [@Little Nemo](#): > > Individual level? Tough call. It’s either Sergeant Sven Olandsen in the Swedish Army’s Norrbotten Armoured Battalion or Captain Bokyun Shin of South Korea’s Zaytun Division. Olandsen’s got more instinctive talent but Shin’s stronger on military theory. Can you be a little more specific? 😃 (Thanks, I appreciated your joke.) ---
**Author:** ![Weird\_AL\_Einstein](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/c67d28/32.png) [@Weird\_AL\_Einstein](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weird_AL_Einstein)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 2:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/11 "2005-02-28T14:59:14Z")
Best all-around armed forces, I would have to say USA, with the UK and Israel the only others even in our league. Australia gets honorable mention. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 4:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/12 "2005-02-28T16:57:01Z")
The US, no question about it. Squad vs. squad scenarios are nothing but fanboy masturbation. The US military is quite capable of crushing any other nation in the world. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/13 "2005-02-28T17:53:58Z")
> [@Little Nemo](#): > > National level? The United States. > > Squad level? British SAS. The SAS isn’t an “armed forces.” (And by what objective measure is the SAS better than any number of other elite commando units?) An “Armed Forces” is the total defense apparatus of a nation. Meaning no disrespect to the UK, Israel or Australia, but in a conventional fight the US could roll over them like a steamroller over a troupe of circus midgets. I’ve sure they’d put up a hell of a fight, but assuming we are staying conventional, quantity has a quality all its own. Of course, this comes with the caveat that any of the countries with ICBMs could force a tie. ---
**Author:** ![keeper0](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/b19c9b/32.png) [@keeper0](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/keeper0)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/14 "2005-02-28T18:07:53Z")
The “best” armed forces in the world would have to be the USA, for reasons others have covered. The “best” for it’s size might still be the USA, since the use of top-technology is a great force multiplier. So, to liven up the discussion, how about “Which nation has the best armed forces per annual budget dollar?” ---
**Author:** ![lno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a8b319/32.png) [@lno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lno)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/15 "2005-02-28T18:21:30Z")
> [@keeper0](#): > > So, to liven up the discussion, how about “Which nation has the best armed forces per annual budget dollar?” Don’t forget about the Vatican’s Swiss Guards! They aren’t just halberdiers performing ceremonial roles anymore, y’know. ---
**Author:** ![Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ccd318/32.png) [@Carnac\_the\_Magnificent](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carnac_the_Magnificent)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/16 "2005-02-28T20:52:12Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > The SAS isn’t an “armed forces.” (And by what objective measure is the SAS better than any number of other elite commando units?) An “Armed Forces” is the total defense apparatus of a nation. Meaning no disrespect to the UK, Israel or Australia, but in a conventional fight the US could roll over them like a steamroller over a troupe of circus midgets. I’ve sure they’d put up a hell of a fight, but assuming we are staying conventional, quantity has a quality all its own. > > Of course, this comes with the caveat that any of the countries with ICBMs could force a tie. Your points echo mine and are well taken. That said, perhaps you’ve missed the heated debate elsewhere in which some argue that SAS is the “world’s best.” Others counter with Delta Force, Seals, Green Beret, etc. All of this misses the larger point, as you so eloquently noted re: “total defense [offensive] apparatus…” BTW, does anyone get tired of the jingoistic grunting in these threads? No one, in my estimation, does it worse than **Carnac**. Idiot. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/17 "2005-02-28T21:15:28Z")
> [@RickJay](#): > > The SAS isn’t an “armed forces.” (And by what objective measure is the SAS better than any number of other elite commando units?) From what I’ve heard/had half-drunkenly shouted at me, experience; supposedly the SAS (until recently) had a lot more operational time than most other elite units, mostly against the IRA. This was a while back and may or may not be true now, assuming it ever was. ---
**Author:** ![Wesley\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wesley_clark/32/20581_2.png) [@Wesley\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wesley_Clark)\ **Post date:** [February 28, 2005, 10:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/18 "2005-02-28T22:40:28Z")
> [@Little Nemo](#): > > Actually, I was attempting to be ironic. Several other posters were making comparisons between countries at the “squad level” which is essentially meaningless - wars are fought between nations not squads. So I made a joke about the two best individual soldiers in the world (both were fictional of course). Not really, if it was just ‘the best’ military it would be the US w/o any real debate. You have to consider squads and organizations just to make it fair. And modern wars like the war on terror rely heavily on squads of special forces, they are a major factor in warfare nowadays. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2005, 12:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/19 "2005-03-01T00:28:15Z")
Let’s not forget less-known units. The Somalian Warlords’ various “bodyguard troops” units are mostly 10 year veterans of Somalia’s endless civil wars, & are as tough as old boots. The US tried to treat 'em as goons & stumblebums, & they dragged our dead through the streets for our trouble. The op was not well-planned, true, but these guys have **Experience**! ---
**Author:** ![kidchameleon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/898d66/32.png) [@kidchameleon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kidchameleon)\ **Post date:** [March 1, 2005, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210/20 "2005-03-01T00:34:57Z")
> [@Bosda Di'Chi of Tricor](#): > > Let’s not forget less-known units. > > The Somalian Warlords’ various “bodyguard troops” units are mostly 10 year veterans of Somalia’s endless civil wars, & are as tough as old boots. > > The US tried to treat 'em as goons & stumblebums, & they dragged our dead through the streets for our trouble. > > The op was not well-planned, true, but these guys have **Experience**! If they’d listened to Eric Bana, we’d have kicked ass! [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-has-the-best-armed-forces/292210.md?page=2)