# Which country is the most backwater godforsaken hell-hole on earth? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 31, 2010, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393 "2010-05-31T16:10:27Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/malleus_incus_stapes/32/3293_2.png) [@Malleus\_Incus\_Stapes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Malleus_Incus_Stapes)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/1 "2010-05-31T16:10:27Z")
Back up your answers with cites. I don’t know enough about world politics to back up my own guess, but I wouldn’t be suprised if Zimbabwe, Haiti, and North Korea turned up on the list somewhere. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/2 "2010-05-31T16:21:43Z")
All your examples have functioning governments. I’d nominate Somalia, which hasn’t had such in decades. ---
**Author:** ![Desert\_Nomad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desert_nomad/32/177_2.png) [@Desert\_Nomad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desert_Nomad)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 4:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/3 "2010-05-31T16:30:10Z")
I’ve been to North Korea and other than it being a closed dictatorship with a oddball leader it is certainly not as hell-holeish as Somalia or parts of eastern D.R. Congo (which is the most dodgy place I’ve ever been). ---
**Author:** ![Lemur866](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lemur866/32/434_2.png) [@Lemur866](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lemur866)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 4:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/4 "2010-05-31T16:33:38Z")
In the western hemisphere, it’s definately Haiti. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 4:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/5 "2010-05-31T16:42:50Z")
> [@Desert\_Nomad](#): > > I’ve been to North Korea and other than it being a closed dictatorship with a oddball leader it is certainly not as hell-holeish as Somalia or parts of eastern D.R. Congo (which is the most dodgy place I’ve ever been). Not sure how much of the stories about NK are true or propaganda - the starving and eating grass, the prisoners linked together with wire through their flesh, etc. Which begs the question - what’s worse, a regimented hell or a chaotic one? Cetainly, the propaganda pics of NK show nice tidy apartment buildings have replaced stone and mud thatch villages, but of course you’re not allowed off the beaten path there either… Draconian hell - NK and the Taliban Afghanistan come to mind - are a close contender to chaos, like Somalia where presumably unless you challenge the local warlord or he’s a total fanatic about something, life is somewhat stable. Lack of a central government does not mean the local sites have not made accomodation (if not peace) with the neighbours, so unless a war front passes through you are pretty safe. Just the opportunities to move about are limited. OTOH, Iran a few years ago where some were kidnapped, tortured in the most imaginative was (power drill into the flesh and eyeballs comes to mind) and then killed; for being the wrong sect… Has to have been one of the list toppers. IMHO. I have no experience or specific cites… ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/6 "2010-05-31T17:01:46Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > Cetainly, the propaganda pics of NK show nice tidy apartment buildings have replaced stone and mud thatch villages, but of course you’re not allowed off the beaten path there either… Look at satellite photo’s of any major city in North Korea and it looks like a science fiction movie where everybody disappears. There are almost no cars traveling on the streets. ---
**Author:** ![Lumpy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lumpy/32/446_2.png) [@Lumpy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lumpy)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/7 "2010-05-31T17:10:00Z")
I don’t have a cite, and it’s not on the list of _man-made_ hell-holes, but I have heard that New Guinea certainly qualifies as “backwater” and “godforsaken”. The virtual absence of any trace of civilization in parts of the highlands combined with a hot humid, muddy, disease-and-pest ridden climate, makes it not one of the world’s favorite vacation sites. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/8 "2010-05-31T17:22:57Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Look at satellite photo’s of any major city in North Korea and it looks like a science fiction movie where everybody disappears. There are almost no cars traveling on the streets. It’s only been what, IIRC about 25 years since the news stories about the first privately owned automobile in China, so I would be very surprised if ANYONE could privately own one in NK. There was a photo sequence of NK due to recent news stories, and it was obvious that the large open spaces were pretty empty of traffic. OTOH, the street scenes did show candids (???) which included well-dressed kids off to school. There’s the old joke about Romania before the fall of the iron curtain - Q: “What did they use in Romania before candles?” A: “Lightbulbs”. ---
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/9 "2010-05-31T17:23:12Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Look at satellite photo’s of any major city in North Korea and it looks like a science fiction movie where everybody disappears. There are almost no cars traveling on the streets. I just zoomed in on Pyongyang via Google Maps. Wow. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![RadicalPi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/radicalpi/32/9806_2.png) [@RadicalPi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RadicalPi)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/10 "2010-05-31T17:53:31Z")
If you want something citable, here is the United Nations Development Program’s list of countries ranked by their human development index. While it doesn’t rank the countries by hellholishness directly, it seems a decent match. In any case, according to them, the country at the bottom of the list is Niger. Although, keep in mind there are a number of countries unranked since they didn’t have the data. Somalia is one of them. So is North Korea. Also, Iran is close to the middle of the list, and Papua New Guinea is in the bottom third, for what it’s worth. [http://hdr.undp.org/en/statistics/](http://hdr.undp.org/en/statistics/) ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 7:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/11 "2010-05-31T19:14:14Z")
We were talking about [this video on Liberia](http://www.vbs.tv/watch/the-vice-guide-to-travel/the-vice-guide-to-liberia) last week in a thread about North Korea. It’s definitely not some place most people would ever want to visit. ---
**Author:** ![toofs](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/4491bb/32.png) [@toofs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/toofs)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/12 "2010-05-31T19:40:05Z")
An interesting question. If a country is poor, say stone age living conditions, yet stable and fairly happy, that does not fit with a definition of hellholeishness. The big question is in regards to a governed, intentional hell hole like Cambodia under the Khmer Rouge, or anarchy such as present day Somalia. I am thinking a governed intentional hell hole is worse than chaos. How about Sudan, with a blend of both? Plenty of good old fashioned genocide going on, and a thriving chaotic daily life tossed in for good measure. Plus, it is a super dry, hot-as-hell desert nation that just happens to be poor as fuck. Lots of violent religious fanaticism, too. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Great\_Philosopher](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3ec8ea/32.png) [@The\_Great\_Philosopher](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Great_Philosopher)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 8:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/13 "2010-05-31T20:43:59Z")
The only country that the UK Foreign Office [advises](http://www.fco.gov.uk/en/travel-and-living-abroad/travel-advice-by-country?action=noTravelAll#noTravelAll) against all travel, to all parts of the country, is Somalia. It advises against all travel to _parts_ of: ``` * Afghanistan * Albania * Azerbaijan * Burundi * Cambodia * Cameroon * Chad * Colombia * Congo (Democratic Republic) * Djibouti * Ecuador * Eritrea * Ethiopia * Georgia * Haiti * India * Iran * Iraq * Israel and the Occupied Palestinian Territories * Lebanon * Mali * Mauritania * Niger * Nigeria * Pakistan * Philippines * Russian Federation * Sri Lanka * Sudan * Thailand * Uganda * Venezuela * Yemen ``` Some of those are very small parts, or are temporary: in Cambodia they only advise against all travel to a small area around a disputed temple complex in the North. In Israel they only advise against all travel to Gaza. Thailand wouldn’t usually have its current warning level, but it’s exceptional circumstances. And of course it’s mainly advice for tourists, so North Korea doesn’t make an appearance. But no matter what criteria you’re using, I think DR Congo would make a strong showing. ---
**Author:** ![Desert\_Nomad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/desert_nomad/32/177_2.png) [@Desert\_Nomad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desert_Nomad)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 9:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/14 "2010-05-31T21:19:44Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > It’s only been what, IIRC about 25 years since the news stories about the first privately owned automobile in China, so I would be very surprised if ANYONE could privately own one in NK. There was a photo sequence of NK due to recent news stories, and it was obvious that the large open spaces were pretty empty of traffic. OTOH, the street scenes did show candids (???) which included well-dressed kids off to school. > > There’s the old joke about Romania before the fall of the iron curtain - > Q: “What did they use in Romania before candles?” > A: “Lightbulbs”. It is true that a North Korean owning a car is about like an American owning a small airplane. There are almost no cars. In Pyongyang you can cross most any road and have to wait for only a few cars to clear a path. Outside Pyongyang, you need not bother looking both ways. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 9:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/15 "2010-05-31T21:23:02Z")
Somalia and Congo are definitely at the top of the list. Both countries have large lawless militant organizations, and the rape, abuse, mutilation and murder of women continues nearly unabated. ---
**Author:** ![merrick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/58956e/32.png) [@merrick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/merrick)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 9:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/16 "2010-05-31T21:34:09Z")
No-one mention **Afghanistan** yet? Your choice of corrupt inept quasi-modernised government, corrupt repressive tribal government or straight-up warzone. Life expectancy at birth is the lowest (reported) in the world, most of the infrastructure can be politely described as “medieval” (most of the social attitudes ditto) and the ongoing violence ensures that nothing’s likely to improve soon. The country that seems to dispute the bottom of most of the UN Human Development Index lists with Afghanistan is Mali - but Mali appears relatively stable (just isolated and dirt-poor). So if you lived in Mali you’d likely be poor, illiterate and living in a shack with no electricity or clean water, but at least you’re not likely to be blown up or shot. And there must be a special place in the Hall of Shame for the government of **Equatorial Guinea**. Oil gives it a GDP per head equivalent to First World countries like Italy, yet the ruling class hogs so much of it that 70% of the population lives on less than $2/day. Development indicators are similar to other sub-Saharan countries with a twentieth of the relative GDP. I guess someone has a really nice Swiss bank account. ---
**Author:** ![Sinisterniik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/51bf81/32.png) [@Sinisterniik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sinisterniik)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/17 "2010-05-31T21:44:49Z")
Ever been to East Hampton, CT? ---
**Author:** ![shijinn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cc9497/32.png) [@shijinn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/shijinn)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/18 "2010-05-31T22:54:48Z")
how about Swaziland? > [@wiki](#): > > … Swaziland has the highest HIV infection rate in the world (26% of all adults; more in other reports) and also the lowest life expectancy at 32 years … shows that 61% of all deaths in the country were caused by HIV/AIDS … Infant mortality was at 110 per 1,000 … ---
**Author:** ![Superhal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Superhal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superhal)\ **Post date:** [May 31, 2010, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/19 "2010-05-31T23:23:28Z")
I’ll vote for Texas. ---
**Author:** ![palacheck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/a88e57/32.png) [@palacheck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/palacheck)\ **Post date:** [June 1, 2010, 1:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393/20 "2010-06-01T01:42:58Z")
Texas is pretty sweet where I am. I’ve never even seen a gun fired off except at a gun range and the closest thing to rape I’ve seen was a guy grabbing a woman’s boob in line at a taco truck. Also the Creationist nuts trying to influence textbook committees doesn’t seem nearly as bad as Liberia’s whole Christian warlord cannibal problem. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-country-is-the-most-backwater-godforsaken-hell-hole-on-earth/541393.md?page=2)