# Which is harder - being liberal and surrounded by conservatives, or vice versa **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 1, 2019, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871 "2019-04-01T17:59:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/121 "2019-04-06T05:18:45Z")
> [@CelticKnot](#): > > I guess some people here are unaware of college students reacting to conservative speakers like Ben Shapiro, Dinesh D’Souza, Ann Coulter, or Jordan Peterson. > > I have never heard of YAF rioting when Lefties speak at their schools. That’s because liberals aren’t, by and large, shits. Do you know why millions of people marched against Trump at his inauguration? Because he’s a shit. Do you know why millions of people didn’t march against Obama at his inauguration? Because he’s not. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/122 "2019-04-06T06:00:24Z")
> [@Der\_Trihs](#): > > “Pro-gun” = support for right wing lynchings and terrorism. There are over 12 million Democrats who own guns. ---
**Author:** ![CelticKnot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/celticknot/32/3392_2.png) [@CelticKnot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CelticKnot)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 11:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/123 "2019-04-06T11:59:24Z")
> [@The\_Tooth](#): > > That’s because liberals aren’t, by and large, shits. Do you know why millions of people marched against Trump at his inauguration? Because he’s a shit. Do you know why millions of people didn’t march against Obama at his inauguration? Because he’s not. So using violence is an acceptable way of showing one’s disapproval of a person or a very large group of people? The disgusting bigotry of posters here is probably why it leans so far to the Left. Conservatives don’t burn down their communities when they don’t get what they want. Looking at the numbers leaving CA and NY shows they just get out. ---
**Author:** ![Peter\_Morris](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/peter_morris/32/359_2.png) [@Peter\_Morris](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Peter_Morris)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/124 "2019-04-06T13:53:30Z")
Addressing the question in the title: **Which is harder - being liberal and surrounded by conservatives, or vice versa** ISTM that Liberals regard Conservatives as being evil, while Conservatives regard Liberals as being foolish. Not saying either perception is correct, just that this how how they are seen. There’s a saying, which exists in many different versions, attributed to many different speakers. If you are not Liberal at age 20 you have no heart. \*If you are not Conservative by age 40 you have no brain. \* So, really the choice is: would you rather be in the company of well-meaning fools, or competent nastiness? I don’t know about you, but I think the fools would be better company. So Conservatives surrounded by Liberals have a better time. ---
**Author:** ![ThisOneGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c0e974/32.png) [@ThisOneGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ThisOneGuy)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 3:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/125 "2019-04-06T15:24:39Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > But violent confrontations are common enough that it’s an expected result. Do you really think that a guy wearing a dress or an interracial couple going around to bars out in the middle of nowhere is taking no significant risk? Personal violence enforcing conservative norms is a routine and expected part of life. I hate to break it to you, but this isn’t actually true. I’ve been part of an interracial couple for almost twenty years now. Leave in hyperconservative Utah county (the Utah of Utah). Frequently travel to extremely rural Utah and Idaho. Not being lumberjacks, we don’t hang around in bars much, but do go to grocery stores, restaurants, etc. Never heard so much as a discouraging word. You’d think this was still the range. Regarding the op, I’m on the Lunatic Libertarian Fringe, so neither liberal or conservative. Hanging with either the very liberal California branch of the family or the very conservative Utah branches I hear plenty to disagree with but am not treated poorly by either. Haven’t seen them treat others poorly. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/126 "2019-04-06T15:45:44Z")
> [@CelticKnot](#): > > I guess some people here are unaware of college students reacting to conservative speakers like Ben Shapiro, Dinesh D’Souza, Ann Coulter, or Jordan Peterson. > > I have never heard of YAF rioting when Lefties speak at their schools. That’s sort of unfair. Shapiro and Coulter are professional trolls, and do their best to elicit the reaction they get. It’s their bread and butter. They have a symbiotic relationship going with those college students who react badly (who are, by the way, a tiny minority of college students). D’Souza maybe less so, but he’s not entirely un-troll-like. I’m not familiar enough with Peterson to say. Some of his stuff does seem to be trolling, some doesn’t, but I haven’t seen, heard or read much. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/127 "2019-04-06T15:54:30Z")
> [@CelticKnot](#): > > So using violence is an acceptable way of showing one’s disapproval of a person or a very large group of people? I didn’t say violence, I said marching in the street. > [@](#): > > The disgusting bigotry of posters here is probably why it leans so far to the Left. Conservatives don’t burn down their communities when they don’t get what they want. Looking at the numbers leaving CA and NY shows they just get out. I suggest you examine the statistics regarding the increase in attacks by Trump supporters over the past couple of years. And don’t forget that it’s the American right (not sure they’re conservative) putting children in cages and marching armed in the streets. Now go forth and examine, O Disgusted One! ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/128 "2019-04-06T16:02:22Z")
If you don’t know where to start, start with the name “Patrick Corlineo”. ---
**Author:** ![Covfefe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ee7513/32.png) [@Covfefe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Covfefe)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 7:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/129 "2019-04-06T19:00:56Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > Liberal contempt for rural people, especially poor white rural people helped propel that idiot Trump into office. Looks like he may get four more years. Well put. ---
**Author:** ![Covfefe](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/ee7513/32.png) [@Covfefe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Covfefe)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/130 "2019-04-06T19:11:35Z")
> [@Peter\_Morris](#): > > Addressing the question in the title: > > **Which is harder - being liberal and surrounded by conservatives, or vice versa** > > ISTM that Liberals regard Conservatives as being evil, while Conservatives regard Liberals as being foolish. Not saying either perception is correct, just that this how how they are seen. There’s a saying, which exists in many different versions, attributed to many different speakers. If you are not Liberal at age 20 you have no heart. \*If you are not Conservative by age 40 you have no brain. \* > > So, really the choice is: would you rather be in the company of well-meaning fools, or competent nastiness? > > I don’t know about you, but I think the fools would be better company. So Conservatives surrounded by Liberals have a better time. It’s a really unpleasant choice either way if you think about it in those terms because you picked the option where you’re surrounded by people who think you’re evil. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/131 "2019-04-06T20:30:36Z")
> [@Covfefe](#): > > Well put. The data does not suggest that this is accurate. ---
**Author:** ![Pantastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/3bc359/32.png) [@Pantastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pantastic)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/132 "2019-04-06T21:46:48Z")
> [@Saintly\_Loser](#): > > For Pete’s sake, you’re building a straw man here. That’s \*nothing \*like the situation (or the shirt) I described in my post. That is not a straw man, that is EXACTLY like the situation you described in your post. The contractor in your case wore a shirt that expressed a slogan extremely hostile to the person or their friends who had hired them, and they declined to do business with him as a result. I asked whether you would apply that same standard to someone wearing a shirt that expressed sentiments actively hostile in the same way to the conservative person, and you refused to answer. I’m pretty sure the reason you refuse to answer is that you obviously would not fault a cop for refusing to hire someone who showed up in a ‘fuck the police’ shirt. > [@](#): > > Funny. I actually know a fair number of conservatives. None of them think you and your friends should not be allowed to exist, or that the poor should suffer and die, and so on and so on. Or that women should be forced to act as incubators. Hey, I’m married to a conservative, double-Harvard-grad lawyer. Really, you’re just caricaturing here. No doubt there are people who would identify themselves as “conservative” that think those things, but it’s by no means all conservatives. Are they ‘conservatives’ who don’t vote republican? Because if they do vote republican, then they DO support these things, even if they don’t want to admit it. Conservatives are working hard to end gay marriage in the US and overturn the SC decision acknowledging that it is a human right. Conservatives are working hard to end labor protections of LGBT people, and to do their best to not even acknowledge that the T part exists (like with bathroom bans). Conservatives are working hard to overturn Roe vs Wade and to ban abortion, which means forcing women to act as human incubators. Conservatives are working hard to prevent UHC and dismantle or weaken programs like food stamps and public education, which is working to make sure the poor suffer and die. These are not weird extremists positions that some dude on a website comes up with, these are mainstream ‘conservative’ positions. > [@](#): > > I’ve never met anyone who holds those positions. Irrelevant; I didn’t ask if you did (and didn’t even assert that they actually exist) I asked if your standards of behavior would also apply to someone wearing a shirt as blatantly hostile to your friends and family as someone wearing a shirt with conservative slogans is to me and mine. It’s pretty clear from your response and refusal to answer that in fact you would not consider your religious friends ‘close minded’ refused to hang out socially with someone who was hostile to their very existence, that ‘close minded’ standard only applies if the hostility is to people like you, not to people like me. > [@](#): > > Look, not all conservatives are the same. You seem to be insisting that every “conservative” is a rabid, Trump-rally-going, racist, ranting, ignorant moron. People wearing conservative political messages in 2019 either are such themselves, or are fine with supporting such, most significantly by voting for what the trump-rally-going, racist, ranting, ignorant morons want. I don’t see any significant distinction between the two groups, if you’re working for the goals of the racist, ranting, ignorant morons then you’re at least as dangerous as the people who have such goals. Like Velocity said and other people know, a man showing that he is non-gender conforming and going to engage in normal day to day activities is making an extreme political statement as far as ‘conservatives’ are concerned by showing that he thinks he has the right to even exist. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 10:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/133 "2019-04-06T22:11:38Z")
> **[California woman fired after confronting man wearing MAGA hat at Starbucks](https://www.yahoo.com/news/california-woman-fired-confronting-man-011743555.html)** > > The woman was fired after posting on social media that she “yelled at him about how it was not okay to hate brown people." Woman saw someone wearing a Trump hat in a Starbucks and called everyone over to harass him, saying he was a “Nazi” (ironically, the man was Jewish) ---
**Author:** ![HurricaneDitka](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/96bed5/32.png) [@HurricaneDitka](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/HurricaneDitka)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 10:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/134 "2019-04-06T22:46:35Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > [California woman fired after confronting man wearing MAGA hat at Starbucks](https://www.yahoo.com/news/california-woman-fired-confronting-man-011743555.html) > > Woman saw someone wearing a Trump hat in a Starbucks and called everyone over to harass him, saying he was a “Nazi” (ironically, the man was Jewish) I’m delighted that she got fired for being an asshat ---
**Author:** ![Shagunathor](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e47c2d/32.png) [@Shagunathor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shagunathor)\ **Post date:** [April 6, 2019, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/135 "2019-04-06T22:48:50Z")
> [@CelticKnot](#): > > I guess some people here are unaware of college students reacting to conservative speakers like Ben Shapiro, Dinesh D’Souza, Ann Coulter, or Jordan Peterson. > > I have never heard of YAF rioting when Lefties speak at their schools. While this isn’t YAF rioting, there are incidents where conservatives have exercised their “heckler’s veto.” They weren’t covered as strongly by the media, so they aren’t as well known, but there were incidents like protesters shouting down Xavier Becerra at Whittier, or folks sending death threats to a scheduled speaker at UCSD because she was critical of Trump–leading to her cancelling a planned speech. ---
**Author:** ![ZurBob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/71e660/32.png) [@ZurBob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZurBob)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2019, 12:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/136 "2019-04-07T00:10:07Z")
What does most of the up thread chatter have to do with the OP? Focus, people. ---
**Author:** ![Scumpup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ce73a5/32.png) [@Scumpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scumpup)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2019, 1:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/137 "2019-04-07T01:56:29Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > The data does not suggest that this is accurate. The “data?” Let’s see the poll and the analysis of its results to which you must be referring. Or does “data” mean, in this context, that your opinion differs? ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2019, 2:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/138 "2019-04-07T02:03:11Z")
> [@Scumpup](#): > > The “data?” Let’s see the poll and the analysis of its results to which you must be referring. Or does “data” mean, in this context, that your opinion differs? I was referring to the political data guru of gurus, Nate Silver: [https://twitter.com/natesilver538/status/703975062500732932?lang=en](https://twitter.com/natesilver538/status/703975062500732932?lang=en) “Strongest correlate I’ve found for Trump support is Google searches for the n-word.” ---
**Author:** ![The\_Tooth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/c67d28/32.png) [@The\_Tooth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Tooth)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2019, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/139 "2019-04-07T04:27:59Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > I’m delighted that she got fired for being an asshat I’m delighted that your fellow Trump supporter was prevented from killing Rep. Omar out of anti-Muslim bigotry. I’m sure you are too. ---
**Author:** ![Saintly\_Loser](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saintly_loser/32/4045_2.png) [@Saintly\_Loser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saintly_Loser)\ **Post date:** [April 7, 2019, 5:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871/140 "2019-04-07T05:08:37Z")
> [@Pantastic](#): > > That is not a straw man, that is EXACTLY like the situation you described in your post. The contractor in your case wore a shirt that expressed a slogan extremely hostile to the person or their friends who had hired them, and they declined to do business with him as a result. I asked whether you would apply that same standard to someone wearing a shirt that expressed sentiments actively hostile in the same way to the conservative person, and you refused to answer. I’m pretty sure the reason you refuse to answer is that you obviously would not fault a cop for refusing to hire someone who showed up in a ‘fuck the police’ shirt. > > Are they ‘conservatives’ who don’t vote republican? Because if they do vote republican, then they DO support these things, even if they don’t want to admit it. Conservatives are working hard to end gay marriage in the US and overturn the SC decision acknowledging that it is a human right. Conservatives are working hard to end labor protections of LGBT people, and to do their best to not even acknowledge that the T part exists (like with bathroom bans). Conservatives are working hard to overturn Roe vs Wade and to ban abortion, which means forcing women to act as human incubators. Conservatives are working hard to prevent UHC and dismantle or weaken programs like food stamps and public education, which is working to make sure the poor suffer and die. > > These are not weird extremists positions that some dude on a website comes up with, these are mainstream ‘conservative’ positions. > > Irrelevant; I didn’t ask if you did (and didn’t even assert that they actually exist) I asked if your standards of behavior would also apply to someone wearing a shirt as blatantly hostile to your friends and family as someone wearing a shirt with conservative slogans is to me and mine. It’s pretty clear from your response and refusal to answer that in fact you would not consider your religious friends ‘close minded’ refused to hang out socially with someone who was hostile to their very existence, that ‘close minded’ standard only applies if the hostility is to people like you, not to people like me. > > People wearing conservative political messages in 2019 either are such themselves, or are fine with supporting such, most significantly by voting for what the trump-rally-going, racist, ranting, ignorant morons want. I don’t see any significant distinction between the two groups, if you’re working for the goals of the racist, ranting, ignorant morons then you’re at least as dangerous as the people who have such goals. Like Velocity said and other people know, a man showing that he is non-gender conforming and going to engage in normal day to day activities is making an extreme political statement as far as ‘conservatives’ are concerned by showing that he thinks he has the right to even exist. Really! What was that slogan? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871.md?page=6) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-harder-being-liberal-and-surrounded-by-conservatives-or-vice-versa/831871.md?page=8)