# Which is more important: Having a good argument or spelling it correctly? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [October 6, 2011, 3:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792 "2011-10-06T15:26:30Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Rachellelogram](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/rachellelogram/32/8689_2.png) [@Rachellelogram](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Rachellelogram)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/21 "2011-10-06T18:12:08Z")
Both are very important. Without a logical basis, there’s no argument. Without the ability to clearly communicate your ideas, there’s no argument. I would say that, in a good argument, there is more tolerance for small errors in communication than for small errors in logic. A small typo or misspelling here or there does not detract from the overall idea, whereas a small logical error early on in an argument can snowball quickly into massively-wrong conclusions. Still, a total lack of grammar or basic understanding of one’s native tongue does not lead observers to believe they know what they’re talking about. ---
**Author:** ![gurujulp](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/ba9def/32.png) [@gurujulp](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gurujulp)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/22 "2011-10-06T18:12:29Z")
If it isn’t literate, I might not be able to recognize good points being made… ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 6:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/23 "2011-10-06T18:17:12Z")
> [@BrotherCadfael](#): > > While I absolutely agree, don’t you mean “there”, “their”, and “they’re”? Don’t _you_ mean “there,” “their,” and “they’re?” 😛 I hate quotation marks anyway when it comes to talking about a single word. ---
**Author:** ![FairyChatMom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fairychatmom/32/21906_2.png) [@FairyChatMom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FairyChatMom)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 6:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/24 "2011-10-06T18:28:44Z")
If there are enough errors to distract me from what the writer is trying to say, then the argument becomes secondary to me. An occasional typo or grammatical flub is not that big a deal in an informal venue. In a scholarly work or a periodical, it will make me wonder about the author’s attention to detail regarding everything presented. Perhaps an unfair assessment on my part, but it’s hard for me to ignore a sloppy presentation. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/25 "2011-10-06T19:20:50Z")
> [@Bosstone](#): > > Don’t _you_ mean “there,” “their,” and “they’re?” 😛 > > I hate quotation marks anyway when it comes to talking about a single word. Well, I guess I can’t listen to either of you. 😛 FYI, in America, commas go on the inside, but question marks go on the outside unless you are quoting a question. As for my argument: Spelling incorrectly or improper grammar doesn’t affect my opinion of your argument, but it is inversely correlate with how likely I am to engage with you. and if u type liek this while callng me stupid I am going to point out that at least I can actually write a sentence. For example, when someone kept telling me I wasn’t a real fan because I disagreed with them about Star Trek, I was sure to point out that Spock is not played by Nemoy. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/26 "2011-10-06T19:29:17Z")
> [@olivesmarch4th](#): > > Using poor grammar is not the same as being stupid. I know so many well-educated people that really seem to struggle with this concept. It’s not the same as being smart, either. For the record, I’m working with a GED and a give 'em hell attitude here, so I don’t have a whole ton of sympathy for people who claim poor education. I learned to write by reading. If you don’t read enough to write coherently, you probably don’t read enough that the opinions you’re spewing are informed. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/27 "2011-10-06T19:29:45Z")
> [@Thudlow\_Boink](#): > > Isn’t this kind of like asking, “Which is more important to a car: the engine or the wheels?” > > There’s no point in communicating if you have nothing to communicate; but there’s also no point in communicating if I can’t understand what you’re intending to say. What he said. The point of communicating is to _communicate_ - a lot of people like to say things like, “Well, you can figure out what I’m saying;” I don’t want to figure out what you’re saying - I want YOU to do some work in your writing so I don’t have to do the work to figure it out. I couldn’t vote in this poll because neither is more important; they are equally important. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/28 "2011-10-06T19:30:47Z")
> [@BrotherCadfael](#): > > While I absolutely agree, don’t you mean “there”, “their”, and “they’re”? Gaudere and I made peace many years ago. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 7:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/29 "2011-10-06T19:32:46Z")
> [@BigT](#): > > Well, I guess I can’t listen to either of you. 😛 FYI, in America, commas go on the inside, but question marks go on the outside unless you are quoting a question. My point is that arbitrary style distinctions which don’t actually improve comprehension are bullshit. ---
**Author:** ![Foxy40](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a9a28c/32.png) [@Foxy40](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Foxy40)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/30 "2011-10-06T19:35:31Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > It’s also a way to acknowledge that I generally can’t be bothered to argue with anyone who isn’t bright enough to retain the information that there, their, and they’re all mean different things. > > That said, if his points were idiotic, why not refute those as well? One of the brightest people I know is an Orthopedic Spine Surgeon who got his undergrad from Yale and attended Chapel Hill medical school. The man can not spell to save his life. Just because he can’t write a letter without spell check does not make what he has to say in that letter less worthy than someone who can spell “receive” and knows when to use “than vs then”. I think it is arrogant to think that a person who writes they’re, there or their in the wrong context is ignorant. ---
**Author:** ![Gary\_T](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/3ec8ea/32.png) [@Gary\_T](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gary_T)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/31 "2011-10-06T19:36:50Z")
> [@Chessic\_Sense](#): > > My final reply was that he’d got the ‘order of precedence’ backwards. Step 1 is to make sure it’s literate. Step 2 is to make sure it’s a solid argument. I would argue against this supposed order. The argument is formed in one’s thoughts before it becomes spoken or written. That said, trying to assign greater importance to either the substance or form of such a thing is a futile endeavor. Both are important, each must attain a certain level to be effective, and each is subject to degrees of imperfection. Thus making a blanket judgment of one being more important than the other (to apply in all cases, presumably) is an exercise in folly. The goal is to communicate a compelling argument. If the argument is weak, or the communication ineffective, or both, the goal will not be reached. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/32 "2011-10-06T19:36:58Z")
> [@Foxy40](#): > > I think it is arrogant to think that a person who writes they’re, there or their in the wrong context is ignorant. I’ll cop to arrogance if you’ll take a moment to look up “ignorant”. ---
**Author:** ![Bosstone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/22d042/32.png) [@Bosstone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosstone)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/33 "2011-10-06T19:40:13Z")
> [@Foxy40](#): > > I think it is arrogant to think that a person who writes they’re, there or their in the wrong context is ignorant. Nor is it faux superiority to tell someone “I can’t understand what you’re saying” when the wrong spelling does lead to confusion. The brilliance of a thought does not always permeate the language barrier. ---
**Author:** ![DianaG](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7ab992/32.png) [@DianaG](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DianaG)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 7:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/34 "2011-10-06T19:43:36Z")
Missed the edit window… I work with a ton of highly educated people who can’t spell. They’re ignorant of proper spelling. That said, you get a pass for not using the correct “their” when what you’re writing also contains the words “Mendellian Randomization”. Less so when it’s a poorly constructed rant about a topic you clearly aren’t especially well informed on. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 7:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/35 "2011-10-06T19:51:14Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > Missed the edit window… > > I work with a ton of highly educated people who can’t spell. They’re ignorant of proper spelling. That said, you get a pass for not using the correct “their” when what you’re writing also contains the words “Mendellian Randomization”. Less so when it’s a poorly constructed rant about a topic you clearly aren’t especially well informed on. You don’t make any sense. So then it’s _not_ the spelling that counts; it’s the quality of the argument. ---
**Author:** ![Thudlow\_Boink](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thudlow_boink/32/320_2.png) [@Thudlow\_Boink](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Thudlow_Boink)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 8:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/36 "2011-10-06T20:24:46Z")
> [@DianaG](#): > > Missed the edit window… > > I work with a ton of highly educated people who can’t spell. They’re ignorant of proper spelling. That said, you get a pass for not using the correct “their” when what you’re writing also contains the words “Mendellian Randomization”. Less so when it’s a poorly constructed rant about a topic you clearly aren’t especially well informed on. Hah! I’ll have to remember to toss the words “Mendellian Randomization” into my next Great Debates post. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![boytyperanma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/4491bb/32.png) [@boytyperanma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/boytyperanma)\ **Post date:** [October 6, 2011, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/37 "2011-10-06T21:00:31Z")
The good argument is more important. Unless you’re arguing about proper spelling. ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2011, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/38 "2011-10-07T04:04:15Z")
If I agree with the argument, then the substance is key. If I disagree with it, then the spelling errors show how stupid it is. ---
**Author:** ![drbhoneydew](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/d78d45/32.png) [@drbhoneydew](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/drbhoneydew)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2011, 11:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/39 "2011-10-07T11:46:53Z")
Spelling is not the determinant of a coherent argument. Grammar plays a rather larger role in that it is the scaffolding that allows you to construct the argument and say what you think with less fear that you will be misinterpreted. Punctuation in the wrong places can cause your argument to break down when it introduces ambiguity. Confusing _they’re_ with _their_ or incorrectly rendering the odd word such as _necessarily_ only causes genuine problems if your misspelling happens to form another word that means something radically different and is in context. Assuming someone is wrong because of slight spelling and grammatical errors or that someone is more likely to be right when they’ve used semi-colons or the correct manner are equally boneheaded. Clarity of expression is the most important aspect. If it takes someone several re-readings to even figure out what you are trying to say then you are presenting a poor argument. Ok, so I’ve presented that fairly formally, but we equally have to remember the context of _where_ we are presenting the argument. My word choice on Facebook would be a touch more tabloid if I was on there (which I’m not, so the point is moot). TBH, the education jibe was a bit of a cheap shot - I know people who’ve been to university and everything who present their views equally poorly; indeed, I’ve been known to do so myself when my opinions have been a bit inchoate yet I have a gut feeling in a certain direction. Step 1 is definitely to solidify the argument in my view - there’s no point in polishing a turd with literacy. The arguments should have been countered or you should have pointed out why you couldn’t figure out what the argument actually was. It sounds like the non sequiturs were the biggest argumentative flaw. Mind you, it was on Facebook so I half wonder why you’re bothered 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Eonwe](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eonwe/32/240_2.png) [@Eonwe](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eonwe)\ **Post date:** [October 7, 2011, 12:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792/40 "2011-10-07T12:45:43Z")
> [@gurujulp](#): > > If it isn’t literate, I might not be able to recognize good points being made… Exactly. In my experience, the people who fail dramatically at grammar and sentence structure are also the people whose arguments lack coherence (not that they are wrong, but just that nothing they say truly relates to the conclusion they are trying to reach). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-more-important-having-a-good-argument-or-spelling-it-correctly/598792.md?page=3)