# Which is worse: stupidity or malice? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [February 17, 2010, 3:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287 "2010-02-17T03:24:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/21 "2010-02-17T17:01:06Z")
Stupidity is very frustrating to deal with, but malice is a choice. ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 6:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/22 "2010-02-17T18:18:25Z")
> [@MeanOldLady](#): > > I’d need to know more about the hookers, and just how appealing the sounds of their screams were. I like your style; would you be interested in a position in my imperial regime? I’ll be in need of talent for the Directorate of Crushing Things. ---
**Author:** ![Emily\_Litella](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/emily_litella/32/3370_2.png) [@Emily\_Litella](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Emily_Litella)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 6:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/23 "2010-02-17T18:29:07Z")
> [@Swallowed\_My\_Cellphone](#): > > I picked stupid, just because it’s everywhere. > > (…and because I made a boo-boo hitting the button.) That was stupid. OK - who’s worse? 😛 What this really tells you is that management will let you get away with being stupid and malicious - so give them each a dose of their own medicine and see if it makes you feel better? ---
**Author:** ![Trepa\_Mayfield](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/edb3f5/32.png) [@Trepa\_Mayfield](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Trepa_Mayfield)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/24 "2010-02-17T18:31:39Z")
> [@Noone\_Special](#): > > Which is (pseudo-objectively) “ **worse** ”? – I’ll go with “malice.” > > Stupidity, however, **pisses me off** more because > > 1. You can’t change Teh Stupid > 2. You can’t fight back… just feel sorry. > 3. You can’t even quit the game… 🙂 > > Since option 3 says **both** “infuriating” (annoying) and “horrible” (bad) – I’ll have to go with it 😃 Ah yes, the vaunted Laws of Idiodynamics. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 7:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/25 "2010-02-17T19:42:50Z")
> [@Ranchoth](#): > > I like your style; would you be interested in a position in my imperial regime? Yes. > [@Emily\_Litella](#): > > What this really tells you is that management will let you get away with being stupid and malicious - so give them each a dose of their own medicine and see if it makes you feel better? You may be on to something. Screaming in people’s faces is not my style of bitchiness (especially at the office), but I can give it a whirl since it is apparently okay. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 8:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/26 "2010-02-17T20:21:17Z")
Both are more or less equal I think. Malice is more systematically nasty; it’s usually easier to dodge out of the path of stupid. On the other hand, malice can be deterred or restrained easier by threats or self interest; stupid doesn’t see disaster coming. ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 9:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/27 "2010-02-17T21:53:35Z")
Indeed, and this is so of the horrible shrews at work that inspired this OP. While HC continues to verbally abuse certain coworkers who she has deemed worthy of her scorn, and goes out of her way to make their jobs difficult, she has stopped that BS with me entirely. I initially tried to work with her malice, counter her with politeness and logic, but none of it worked. Eventually, and followed by one horrible event in particular, I was forced to put the brakes on her shenanigans. It is now against her best interests to try to give me shit, and everything has been smooth as silk. Working with her pre and post incident have been night and day. Now FR, on the other hand, is as stupid as ever, and I fear there’s nothing we can do about it. I have made the situation slightly more bearable, though. That is, she doesn’t think about asking me anything until she has her ducks in a row. She does her homework now before bothering me. She’s still stupid, but working with her has become tolerable these days. All in all, I enjoy working with HC now that she’s stopped being super bitch, because we can actually get things done in quickly. This will never be the case with FR. HC is still a worse person, of course, but if I had to choose one to work with, HC all the way. ---
**Author:** ![LouisB](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/dfb087/32.png) [@LouisB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LouisB)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 10:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/28 "2010-02-17T22:30:35Z")
Some one around here had a sig line to the effect of: Never attribute to malice that which can be explained by stupidity. That always struck me as being pretty sound. I think both malice and stupidity are equally horrible. ---
**Author:** ![lindsaybluth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/90db22/32.png) [@lindsaybluth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lindsaybluth)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 11:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/29 "2010-02-17T23:01:27Z")
Woah. I had no idea there’d be such a minority for stupid. I find stupid far, far more horrible. Malice is for petty people, and they make my life difficult, but they don’t make me want to stab my eyes in like stupid people do. Stupidity is offensive; trying hard despite their stupidity is sad and pitiful. Meter maid’s union rep said they can’t shovel snow [here](http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/10040/1034507-258.stm). Shawn Beck, idiot union steward, is _stupid_. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 11:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/30 "2010-02-17T23:19:08Z")
Stupidity. There’s more of it, and there’s less you can do about it, because it often must simply be tolerated. “Against stupidity, the gods themselves contend in vain.” -Friedrich von Schiller, writer-philosopher ---
**Author:** ![Arnold\_Winkelried](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Arnold\_Winkelried](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Arnold_Winkelried)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/31 "2010-02-17T23:33:40Z")
Malice is definitely worse on the Winkelried objective scale of bad character treats. Which one I prefer to deal with depends on the situation. If I am having drinks and chatting with people, playing cards, whatever, I would prefer malice to stupidity. The person could be a real jerk but may have some good insights or skills. In a position where I want empathy and support (let’s say in a marriage, in a therapist, when unburdening my soul of the many worries that afflict me) I would much prefer someone stupid than someone malicious. ---
**Author:** ![luv2draw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/46a35a/32.png) [@luv2draw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/luv2draw)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 11:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/32 "2010-02-17T23:36:30Z")
I picked stupidity. You KNOW where you stand with malice. With stupidity the results are all over the place… ---
**Author:** ![Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/13edae/32.png) [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stranger_On_A_Train)\ **Post date:** [February 17, 2010, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/33 "2010-02-17T23:45:52Z")
In the end, I think incompetence does more damage than intentional malfeasance (just look at American foreign policy, 1945-2010) so I’m going to go with stupidity. Besides, you can get punitives if you can prove malice; stupidity generally just gets you compensatory damages. Stranger ---
**Author:** ![MeanOldLady](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/meanoldlady/32/10737_2.png) [@MeanOldLady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MeanOldLady)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/34 "2010-02-18T15:23:09Z")
> [@lindsaybluth](#): > > Malice is for petty people, and they make my life difficult, but they don’t make me want to stab my eyes in like stupid people do. Malice makes me want to stab _their_ eyes. > [@Arnold\_Winkelried](#): > > Malice is definitely worse on the Winkelried objective scale of bad character treats. Mmm, bad character treats… > [@](#): > > Which one I prefer to deal with depends on the situation. > If I am having drinks and chatting with people, playing cards, whatever, I would prefer malice to stupidity. The person could be a real jerk but may have some good insights or skills. > In a position where I want empathy and support (let’s say in a marriage, in a therapist, when unburdening my soul of the many worries that afflict me) I would much prefer someone stupid than someone malicious. Agreed. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/35 "2010-02-18T17:12:45Z")
I vote that stupid is worse. The systematization of malice can be used against it. Malice can be predictable. Malice is only in a few people. Stupidity, otoh, is ethereal, and may manifest itself at anytime, in any shape. Unpredictable, except in the fact that it will happen when you least expect it. Stupidity is pervasive, and, has many acolytes. Stupidity is rewarded/protected by all, wherein malice is universally censured. Mobs are led more by stupidity rather than actual malice. Stupidity can also be a cloak for malice. And, everything else that the previous have said. hh ---
**Author:** ![beowulff](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beowulff/32/542_2.png) [@beowulff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/beowulff)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 5:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/36 "2010-02-18T17:22:53Z")
Stupidity can be ameliorated with education (to a point), but Malice may be deep-seated and intractable. Also, stupid people can be shunted to positions where they can’t do too much harm, but malicious people are a danger (or nuisance) everywhere. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGauss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/karlgauss/32/3713_2.png) [@KarlGauss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGauss)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/37 "2010-02-18T18:02:25Z")
Which is worse? I don’t know, but the key thing is to “[never ascribe to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanlon%27s_razor).” 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Sunspace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sunspace/32/1250_2.png) [@Sunspace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sunspace)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 6:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/38 "2010-02-18T18:06:33Z")
Malice is a choice. That makes it worse than stupidity. However, I think stupidity is more common, so we have to deal with it more often. ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/39 "2010-02-18T18:46:37Z")
I chose malice. Malice occurs by choice, stupidity by chance. And stupidity can be corrected. ---
**Author:** ![Happy\_Poster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/c89c15/32.png) [@Happy\_Poster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Happy_Poster)\ **Post date:** [February 18, 2010, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287/40 "2010-02-18T18:57:08Z")
I have worked with both. To be honest, stupidity has caused me the biggest problems. By far, actually. Particularly financially, but I think inter-personally as well. I’ve been pretty fortunate not to have worked with malicious people that I couldn’t sort out in my own way. But morally I can never say stupidity is worse. Absolutely malice, indeed I’m amazed this is even a question. I guess the best way of putting this is that stupidity is a character attribute, malice is a character defect. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-is-worse-stupidity-or-malice/529287.md?page=3)