# Which of these Countries is a Middle Power **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 4, 2022, 1:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-of-these-countries-is-a-middle-power/976018 "2022-12-04T13:56:04Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2022, 12:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-of-these-countries-is-a-middle-power/976018/21 "2022-12-12T00:53:30Z")
The OP’s list includes countries with nuclear weapons. That’s just not in the same category as a country without. ---
**Author:** ![abcdefghij](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/43a26b/32.png) [@abcdefghij](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/abcdefghij)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2022, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-of-these-countries-is-a-middle-power/976018/22 "2022-12-12T00:57:48Z")
> [@DPRK](#): > > Understandable confusion, but that is clearly a diaeresis You mean a diëresis? ---
**Author:** ![FlikTheBlue](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fliktheblue/32/10972_2.png) [@FlikTheBlue](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FlikTheBlue)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2022, 1:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-of-these-countries-is-a-middle-power/976018/23 "2022-12-12T01:00:17Z")
I went with Japan, Turkey, Israel, and South Korea. FWIW I did start by excluding countries with nukes, since that’s an automatic game over should those countries ever get invaded and start to lose on their home territory. ---
**Author:** ![Tibby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tibby/32/17030_2.png) [@Tibby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tibby)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2022, 2:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-of-these-countries-is-a-middle-power/976018/24 "2022-12-12T02:10:05Z")
I believe second strike capability (i.e. _a country’s assured ability to respond to a nuclear attack with powerful nuclear retaliation against the attacker_) as per the Asia Power Index is a good gauge of a relative military power. This is the ranking: > **[Nuclear second-strike capability data - Lowy Institute Asia Power Index](https://power.lowyinstitute.org/data/resilience/nuclear-deterrence/nuclear-second-strike-capability/)** > > Nuclear second-strike capability – proxy: Ballistic missile submarines. ---
**Author:** ![Moonrise](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/moonrise/32/14764_2.png) [@Moonrise](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Moonrise)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2022, 10:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-of-these-countries-is-a-middle-power/976018/25 "2022-12-12T10:32:06Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > - Superpowers - countries that dominate the entire world > - Great powers - countries that strongly influence the entire world. > - Regional powers - countries that strongly influence surrounding countries, but little beyond that. > - Non-powers - everyone else. I like this. Alternatively, we could say : - Superpowers - countries that dominate the entire world - Great powers - countries that strongly influence the entire world. - Middle powers - countries that have a real but limited influence on the entire world. - Minor powers - countries that influence surrounding countries, but little beyond that. - Non-powers - everyone else. ---
**Author:** ![Horatius](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/horatius/32/3572_2.png) [@Horatius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Horatius)\ **Post date:** [December 12, 2022, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-of-these-countries-is-a-middle-power/976018/26 "2022-12-12T18:36:21Z")
> [@Moonrise](#): > > - Middle powers - countries that have a real but limited influence on the entire world. > - Minor powers - countries that influence surrounding countries, but little beyond that. And it’s interesting to note that some countries can be both of these. Canada has a limited influence that can affect the whole world, at least in that we put peacekeepers all over the place, and have been involved in more than one major war far from our own borders. But we can’t really be considered a “minor” power on this scale, because our only “surrounding” country would be the United States, over whom we have only the influence they let us have. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2022, 2:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-of-these-countries-is-a-middle-power/976018/27 "2022-12-13T14:46:06Z")
> [@Dissonance](#): > > Bolding mine; Germany was an occupied country and Israel literally didn’t exist yet when the article was published. It makes a whole lot more sense out of the sentence Yeah, I noticed the same thing. Being a great power used to be much more meaningful before there were superpowers. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-of-these-countries-is-a-middle-power/976018.md?page=1)