# Which one is paradise for you, which one is hell, and where do you think you live? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [May 13, 2020, 11:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704 "2020-05-13T11:19:35Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/61 "2020-05-23T01:17:01Z")
And which “hell” describes trying to decipher this thread? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 1:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/62 "2020-05-23T01:30:19Z")
> [@AlexPontik](#): > > :), thank you for you kind comments…let me try another way… > > if you lack patience, skip this thread, there is nothing for you here. > if you have patience, read the below (21 pages, but I added pictures to make it more fun for you). > [Let’s talk about everything! So that we know what on earth we are talking about!](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1GZIqhq1jfJasrsddSzKjBPwP5NVgoE-g/view?usp=sharing) Your first page mentions how much fun I’m gonna have like four times, plus you tell me that above. Your idea of fun doesn’t match mine. The overuse of rhetorical questions, as well as phrases like “Gather round boys and girls,” does not convince me that putting more time into reading it would get me very far. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/63 "2020-05-23T02:23:33Z")
People in this thread have shown you quite a bit of patience. Most of it has been in the form of very patient advice. That advice has centered around narrowing your focus and presenting a single idea at a time for discussion. You returned with a 21-page Google doc. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/64 "2020-05-23T02:39:46Z")
> [@AlexPontik](#): > > :), thank you for you kind comments…let me try another way… > > if you lack patience, skip this thread, there is nothing for you here. > if you have patience, read the below (21 pages, but I added pictures to make it more fun for you). > [Let’s talk about everything! So that we know what on earth we are talking about!](https://drive.google.com/file/d/1GZIqhq1jfJasrsddSzKjBPwP5NVgoE-g/view?usp=sharing) If you want us to review your book, this is the wrong forum. I’ll ask a mod to move it for you. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/65 "2020-05-23T02:42:52Z")
Ooh, here’s a good bit: > [@](#): > > What about women in the history of humans? Not much needed to be written about women in the history of humans, according to humans, so this is pretty much what we know about women in the history of humans. Why? > Women are a mystery to males, but women are a mystery to women also. Why? > Because women are a mystery, and this is why women are so much fun! Why? Cause girls just wanna have fun! Why? Cause in the end, mama puts order! I mean, holy shit, dude. ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/66 "2020-05-23T02:46:30Z")
I skipped to the end to see if he, ignoring advice from writing tutors, put his thesis at the end of his manifesto. Uh, maybe? > [@](#): > > To me, girls decide where words end, and actions follow. Why? Cause mama in the end puts order. > > ii. To me, it is girls in the rest of nature throughout history that seem to decide who to chose in life; No one in the rest of nature seems to decide what girls chose, cause mama in the end puts order. > iii. To me, if anyone in the rest of nature decides what girls chose, girls should not choose that one, but should point patiently that one so the rest of society, sees openly that one. Cause mama in the end puts order. > Why? > > 1. Because then, that one person’s family has to deal with that one person, even if that one person’s family has to do “what no one shouldn’t do” to the person. Why? > > 2. Because no ones may comes from nowhere , and do to this person’s family, what “no one shouldn’t do” until they convert that person to no one, and he/she behaves within limits, where it is fun for the rest of us. Why? I mean, there’s more, but you get the idea. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 5:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/67 "2020-05-23T05:18:45Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Ooh, here’s a good bit: > > I mean, holy shit, dude. I would be very outraged by that if I understood what it meant. ---
**Author:** ![xenophon41](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/xenophon41/32/253_2.png) [@xenophon41](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/xenophon41)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/68 "2020-05-23T14:51:09Z")
I’m just gonna drop this right here: [http://www.lousywriter.com/](http://www.lousywriter.com/) You might think it looks like a joke website, but it’s actually a pretty amazing free resource. I have no idea who wrote it or runs it, but I found it searching for online English composition resources on behalf of our OP. The url sort of drew me in. ---
**Author:** ![Johnny\_Bravo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johnny_bravo/32/493_2.png) [@Johnny\_Bravo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johnny_Bravo)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 3:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/69 "2020-05-23T15:00:11Z")
To the OP: A central thesis of your work is counseling patience - if people can’t understand what you’re saying, it must be because they’re not patient enough to listen. I see that you’ve posted this stuff elsewhere on the internet - in other forums and in a half-dozen Reddit subthreads. They were either ignored or closed. As best I can tell, this is the only place on the web where you’ve gotten any kind of response. In terms of people reading your stuff, \*\*this is literally the most patient place on the internet. \*\* You can continue to talk past the people who are trying to engage with you, but they will eventually ignore you and this thread will die the same death it’s died everywhere else. You mentioned in a different location that you wrote this for an assignment. What did your teacher think? What grade did you get? ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/70 "2020-05-23T16:48:06Z")
> [@UltraVires](#): > > I would be very outraged by that if I understood what it meant. I might be outraged by that if I thought the OP understood what it meant. ---
**Author:** ![BeepKillBeep](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/9e8a1a/32.png) [@BeepKillBeep](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BeepKillBeep)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/71 "2020-05-23T17:01:24Z")
> **[TimeCube.2enp.com](https://timecube.2enp.com)** > > In 1884, meridian time personnel met > in Washington to change Earth time. > First words said was that only 1 day > could be used on Earth to not change > the 1 day marshmallow It reminds me of the time cube. ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/72 "2020-05-23T23:32:59Z")
When first posted, (April13), this thread appeared to be one of those speculative philosophy discussions that occasionally appear here. Recently, it has veered into more of a matter of personal opinion, so I am moving it to the **In My Humble Opinion** forum. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [May 23, 2020, 11:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/73 "2020-05-23T23:53:49Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > Ooh, here’s a good bit: > > I mean, holy shit, dude. At least it might answer [this](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=896774) thread. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [May 26, 2020, 3:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/74 "2020-05-26T03:37:29Z")
> [@BeepKillBeep](#): > > [https://timecube.2enp.com](https://timecube.2enp.com) > > It reminds me of the time cube. Ok, but is the time cube guy schizophrenic? ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [May 28, 2020, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/75 "2020-05-28T22:14:04Z")
> [@VinylTurnip](#): > > Thin and seedy? He said his first joint, not his first girlfriend. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [June 2, 2020, 4:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/76 "2020-06-02T16:39:00Z")
> [@Larry\_Borgia](#): > > Alex, have you ever heard of the concept “Not even wrong?” More like “not even coherent.” ---
**Author:** ![AlexPontik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/50afbb/32.png) [@AlexPontik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlexPontik)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 9:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/77 "2020-06-10T21:42:42Z")
> [@Buck\_Godot](#): > > OK I’m imagining a hell where all of the demons who torment me are laughing honestly at my plight, and a heaven where the world is so blissful that there is no need to laugh. I’ll choose the latter. Is this what you had in mind, OP? The world is so blissful that there is no need to laugh. Could you please describe this wold in more detail? What do I mean? That world that your mind has, where everything is so blissful that there is no need to laugh. Cause it sounds like you are just putting words together, thinking you are making sense, and coming from me…well that should be sounding pretty ironic to you, doesn’t it? I am waiting for any of you gentlemen in here to try to use your imaginations a bit, putting words together you can make any argument, but not all arguments are valid. Also this thread is only for those of you who want to spend the time, the rest of you why are you even bothering with this one :)? ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [June 10, 2020, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/78 "2020-06-10T21:57:54Z")
You want me to use my imagination? Everybody’s stoned out of their mind. Mindless bliss. (Autonomic harp strumming may be occurring.) That sure beats a world of maniacally laughing demons torturing everybody. Alternatively you could have a world where people are physically incapable of laughter, perhaps because their consciousnesses have been transferred into robots with no mouths. (These robots have had their ‘happiness’ meter pegged to maximum, resulting in constant bliss no matter what.) Let’s see, what’s another one? How about a churchy one: everybody is sitting in pews, basking in the radiant glory of God, who is up at the podium making endless speeches about how he is so awesome and totally kicked Satan’s butt. Everybody can’t help but be joyful because the radiant glory forces them to be joyful, but they don’t laugh because it would be rude to interrupt the speech. And before you get on me for forcibly brainwashing everybody into being happy, all the “constant laughter” scenarios involve something similar, because nobody laughs _constantly_ in their natural state either. ---
**Author:** ![AlexPontik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/50afbb/32.png) [@AlexPontik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/AlexPontik)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/79 "2020-06-18T15:19:52Z")
> [@begbert2](#): > > You want me to use my imagination? > > Everybody’s stoned out of their mind. Mindless bliss. (Autonomic harp strumming may be occurring.) That sure beats a world of maniacally laughing demons torturing everybody. > > Alternatively you could have a world where people are physically incapable of laughter, perhaps because their consciousnesses have been transferred into robots with no mouths. (These robots have had their ‘happiness’ meter pegged to maximum, resulting in constant bliss no matter what.) > > Let’s see, what’s another one? How about a churchy one: everybody is sitting in pews, basking in the radiant glory of God, who is up at the podium making endless speeches about how he is so awesome and totally kicked Satan’s butt. Everybody can’t help but be joyful because the radiant glory forces them to be joyful, but they don’t laugh because it would be rude to interrupt the speech. > > And before you get on me for forcibly brainwashing everybody into being happy, all the “constant laughter” scenarios involve something similar, because nobody laughs _constantly_ in their natural state either. Let’s see: 1. Mindless bliss, has been tried by many, but it’s not bliss, because if it was, the majority would be doing mindless bliss with drugs, but they don’t. So this one is not realistic, for now. 2. people physically incapable of laughter is not people in your example, read what you wrote after this…so this is not realistic either for now. 3. For the church argument, people being able to listen to endless speeches are not people. You need to assume that people are still people using your imagination as you know people in your lives. Assuming consciousness transferring, demons and gods, sure we can do that, but I think you should have already understood that we are not doing that. Why? Because if you make such assumptions, how do you know that people are laughing honestly or not? To know if people are laughing honestly you should imagine people laughing honestly. And I’m getting the sense that some of you here don’t believe that there is such a thing as laughing honestly.Why? Let’s wait for the answers of those ones here and the rest of you will find out ---
**Author:** ![begbert2](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/begbert2/32/3357_2.png) [@begbert2](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/begbert2)\ **Post date:** [June 18, 2020, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704/80 "2020-06-18T18:19:59Z")
> [@AlexPontik](#): > > Let’s see: > > 1. Mindless bliss, has been tried by many, but it’s not bliss, because if it was, the majority would be doing mindless bliss with drugs, but they don’t. So this one is not realistic, for now. > 2. people physically incapable of laughter is not people in your example, read what you wrote after this…so this is not realistic either for now. > 3. For the church argument, people being able to listen to endless speeches are not people. > > You need to assume that people are still people using your imagination as you know people in your lives. > > Assuming consciousness transferring, demons and gods, sure we can do that, but I think you should have already understood that we are not doing that. Why? Because if you make such assumptions, how do you know that people are laughing honestly or not? > To know if people are laughing honestly you should imagine people laughing honestly. > And I’m getting the sense that some of you here don’t believe that there is such a thing as laughing honestly.Why? Let’s wait for the answers of those ones here and the rest of you will find out Moving the goalposts, are we? When you find yourself doing that, you should examine yourself and determine whether there is something wrong with your position. Your question asks us to imagine two spaces: One where people never laugh honestly, and one where people always laugh honestly. The latter scenario is utterly impossible with people in ordinary circumstances; ordinary people in ordinary circumstances don’t laugh all the time, and they don’t _always_ laugh honestly. Even the non-honest-laughing scenario is hard to achieve - some people will genuinely laugh even while being tortured (possibly due to mental breakage). The only true way to ensure that people never laugh honestly is to kill all the people. So to review: if we’re dealing with ordinary people, the only way to ensure there is no honest laughter is to kill all the people, or for there to be no people there at all. And the only way to ensure that everyone is laughing honestly is for there to be no people at all - that is the only way to ensure there are no people failing to laugh honestly. That, or we accept that you are perforce requiring us to put people in unusual circumstances. I reject your bland dismissal of people being put into a permanently blissful state. Even putting aside the fact that we’re talking about _heaven_ here, it’s pretty easy to put people in a mindless (and laughterless) state: just put them to sleep. Normal people refrain from laughing honestly for a period of time every day, without fail. So it’s not hard to imagine a heaven where everyone is asleep or in a torpor - and where pleasant dreams are being piped into their skull. I’m also not impressed with your rejection of the idea that people who can’t laugh aren’t people. That’s a cop-out, on your part. People with artificial hearts are still people; people with artificial voice boxes are still people. And if you have a problem with people doing the same thing endlessly without end, you’re going to have a problem with _any_ heaven, because after living forever at least some people are going to settle into a rut because variety is no longer interesting. I get that you’re trying to make, well, _some_ kind of weird point with this odd question, but we’re not privy to the inside of your brain. We just see the question, and taken literally, you’re asking us if we’d prefer a place where people are constantly 100% of the time laughing honestly - continuously, compulsively, like the Joker on meth. Or, a place where people (for some reason) never emit a sound based on genuine pleasure or amusement. Because they’re dead? Because they’re unable? Because they’re forced to watch The Big Bang Theory? (Even then they’d probably laugh _sometimes_.) I get that you’re trying to tease us around to guessing what’s in your head, for some unknown reason, but in all seriousness, that is never going to happen. If you want us to talk about some _specific_ scenarios where people are all laughing maniacally or chuckling half-heartedly, feel free to present those scenarios. Because they’re not going to appear in the thread any other way. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-one-is-paradise-for-you-which-one-is-hell-and-where-do-you-think-you-live/853704.md?page=5)