# Which river is Moon River? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 24, 2007, 1:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210 "2007-06-24T13:27:10Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Mark\_Ryle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@Mark\_Ryle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mark_Ryle)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 1:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/21 "2007-06-25T13:04:58Z")
[QUOTE=Walloon] To evoke _New York_? [/QUOTE] Why is that surprising? ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 1:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/22 "2007-06-25T13:05:34Z")
[QUOTE=Mark Ryle] … _Moon River_ is autobiographical, I agree, but in the sense of being the poetic expression of Mercer’s own aspirations for rising to the pinnacle of his profession. Mancini’s also – listen to the longing, striving quality in the melody and chords. They were two artists perfectly collaborating to evoke New York. [/QUOTE] I never got the impression that you did, I always thought she was longing for some other place, some place that did not really exist. I like your reasoning but I can’t see it. (Besides the perfect NYC melody and chords was and is Rhaspody in Blue) Jim ---
**Author:** ![Mark\_Ryle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@Mark\_Ryle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mark_Ryle)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 1:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/23 "2007-06-25T13:32:17Z")
[QUOTE=Walloon] Johnny Mercer: Quote: When I grew up in the South, by a river, there were always wild bushes, blackberries, strawberries, little wild strawberries, wild cherry trees, and huckleberries, and that coupled with the name Huckleberry Finn — and Mark Twain had written about the Mississippi, and this girl in Breakfast at Tiffany’s was from around that neck of the woods, down there in the southwest United States, it just seemed to fit the need. [/QUOTE] I think Mercer’s own comment gives a clue – “it just seemed to fit the need.” He was more or less casually picking and choosing elements to build his song, while at the same time, for commercial purposes – almost as an afterthought – make it fit the movie. But a song is bigger than a movie. _Moon River_ is for all time, _Breakfast At Tiffany’s_ well-forgotten fluff. Mercer and Mancini, as songwriters – and great songwriters – know their creation will be remembered when nobody remembers the movie. It always stood on its own – a thing of beauty, a work of art, while the movie was embarrassingly bad. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/24 "2007-06-25T15:15:17Z")
[QUOTE=What Exit?] …(Besides the perfect NYC melody and chords was and is “Rhapsody in Blue”)… [/QUOTE] You got that right. Love that song! ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/25 "2007-06-25T16:20:41Z")
_Rhapsody in Blue_ isn’t a song. ---
**Author:** ![Chez\_Guevara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/aeb1de/32.png) [@Chez\_Guevara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chez_Guevara)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/26 "2007-06-25T16:27:44Z")
[It is now](http://www.sing365.com/music/Lyric.nsf/Rhapsody-In-Blue-lyrics-The-Gathering-Field/94DBE2426F3151CD4825709400014D8F). ---
**Author:** ![Mark\_Ryle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@Mark\_Ryle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mark_Ryle)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 4:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/27 "2007-06-25T16:40:15Z")
[QUOTE=What Exit?] … I always thought she was longing for some other place, some place that did not really exist. I like your reasoning but I can’t see it. [/QUOTE] Mancini / Mercer wrote for \*Breakfast at Tiffany’s \* the way Paul Simon wrote songs for _The Graduate_. Neither \*Mrs. Robinson \* nor anything else in _The Graduate_ soundtrack have much to do with anything occuring in the movie. But don’t they sound good! And make the movie work. Simon’s songs are the only good thing in _The Graduate_, for another parallel. Johnny Mercer, Henry Mancini and Paul Simon are pursuing their art. They don’t let goofy little movies get in the way. The movies as ‘vehicles’ for the songs is a good description. \*Moon River \* was written with Audrey Hepburn’s vocal range a main concern, but how it fit the movie or her character of only passing concern. Audrey was aware of this. She is, after all, an artist. Here is a letter she wrote to Henry Mancini at the time. A photograph of the letter is here:[http://www-personal.umich.edu/~bcash/music.html](http://www-personal.umich.edu/~bcash/music.html) > [@](#): > > Dear Henry, > I have just seen our picture - BREAKFAST AT TIFFANY’S - this time with your score. A movie without music is a little bit like an aeroplane without fuel. However beautifully the job is done, we are still on the ground and in a world of reality. Your music has lifted us all up and sent us soaring. Everything we cannot say with words or show with action you have expressed for us. You have done this with so much imagination, fun and beauty. > > You are the hippest of cats - and the most sensitive of composers! Thank you, dear Hank. > Lots of love, Audrey ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 5:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/28 "2007-06-25T17:12:08Z")
[QUOTE=Mark Ryle] Mancini / Mercer wrote for \*Breakfast at Tiffany’s \* the way Paul Simon wrote songs for _The Graduate_. Neither \*Mrs. Robinson \* nor anything else in _The Graduate_ soundtrack have much to do with anything occuring in the movie. But don’t they sound good! And make the movie work. Simon’s songs are the only good thing in _The Graduate_, for another parallel. Johnny Mercer, Henry Mancini and Paul Simon are pursuing their art. They don’t let goofy little movies get in the way. The movies as ‘vehicles’ for the songs is a good description. \*Moon River \* was written with Audrey Hepburn’s vocal range a main concern, but how it fit the movie or her character of only passing concern. … [/QUOTE] Now it makes more sense to me, good comparison, I was thinking of the song as further the development of the character. Your suggestions makes sense except for the fact that Mrs. Robinson was background music and Moon River was sung by the main character in character. [QUOTE=Walloon] Rhapsody in Blue isn’t a song. [/QUOTE] Okay, so what word should I use, “Instrumental”, “Piece”? I have seen ‘Song’ used the way I used it all the time. I take it this is incorrect? Jim ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 6:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/29 "2007-06-25T18:08:03Z")
Composition, orchestral work, piece of music. ---
**Author:** ![Mark\_Ryle](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/8dc957/32.png) [@Mark\_Ryle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mark_Ryle)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 6:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/30 "2007-06-25T18:42:12Z")
[QUOTE=What Exit?] … Mrs. Robinson was background music and Moon River was sung by the main character in character. [/QUOTE] Good point. You’re right. I would quibble on just one point. The Graduate soundtrack was something more than background music, which isn’t usually so mesmerizing. The movie is laughable now, but when new we thought it monumentally hip, smart and cool. The soundtrack was something new in the world, equally as appealing as anything else in the film, with song after good song, rivaling the movie, almost, in length as well as other ways. It was the same feeling I got on first seeing a music video (very belatedly) and feeling I was seeing a new art form. ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 6:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/31 "2007-06-25T18:54:40Z")
[QUOTE=Walloon] _Rhapsody in Blue_ isn’t a song. [/QUOTE] It was composed. It has notes following one after another, a melody, and is played on musical instruments. It can be whistled or hummed. You can get it on cassette, CD or LP. It’s a song. ---
**Author:** ![rivulus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/839c29/32.png) [@rivulus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rivulus)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 7:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/32 "2007-06-25T19:27:08Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] It was composed. It has notes following one after another, a melody, and is played on musical instruments. It can be whistled or hummed. You can get it on cassette, CD or LP. It’s a song. [/QUOTE] One could describe it as a “song” but only in the most unsophisticated way. Better terms would be “concerto” or, more properly, “rhapsody” – which is a specific musical form. Opinions are divided over whether the Rhapsody is really jazz or classical or something in between, but given the fact that Gershwin was asked to write a concerto-like piece (concerto being a classical term) and that this work was his big entrance into the classical world, I would lean toward calling it a classical work with jazz influence. Moreover, the orchestration was done by Ferde Grofe, who is unmistakably a classical composer. Therefore, it makes sense to describe it by classical terminology, and under those circumstances, “song” would not only be rather vague but downright wrong (“song” being reserved, usually, for shorter works that feature at least one singer – not an extended instrumental piece.) ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/33 "2007-06-25T19:44:17Z")
[QUOTE=Elendil’s Heir] It was composed. It has notes following one after another, a melody, and is played on musical instruments. It can be whistled or hummed. You can get it on cassette, CD or LP. [/QUOTE] That makes it “music”, but not a song. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2007, 10:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-river-is-moon-river/409210/34 "2007-06-25T22:48:27Z")
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