# Which States have had the longest union in history? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [June 22, 2002, 10:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420 "2002-06-22T10:59:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Montezuma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3be4f8/32.png) [@Montezuma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Montezuma)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 10:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/1 "2002-06-22T10:59:36Z")
I think some contenders are England and Wales, Russia and the Ukraine, the Ottoman empire and the United States. ---
**Author:** ![Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bosda_di_chi_of_tricor/32/16845_2.png) [@Bosda\_Di\_Chi\_of\_Tricor](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bosda_Di_Chi_of_Tricor)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 11:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/2 "2002-06-22T11:36:52Z")
China, baby. Egypt was a nation for a long time, too. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 11:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/3 "2002-06-22T11:39:20Z")
What do you mean by union? The greek empire comes to mind but I need clarification. ---
**Author:** ![Efrem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@Efrem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Efrem)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 11:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/4 "2002-06-22T11:57:37Z")
I thought Iran was the oldest country in the world? ---
**Author:** ![jimmmy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/73ab20/32.png) [@jimmmy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jimmmy)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 1:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/5 "2002-06-22T13:37:59Z")
I’m with **K2Dave** , also needed is a definition of State. The City State of Rome has been “in union” with some of the Greek-founded City States on the Italian East Coast for millenia, but that doesn’t seem to fit your examples. ---
**Author:** ![JeffB](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jeffb/32/188_2.png) [@JeffB](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/JeffB)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/6 "2002-06-22T14:34:02Z")
According to [this site](http://www.nmsu.edu/~molbio/plant/onion.html), England had the worldest biggest **onion** at 10 pounds, 14 ounces. What? ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 3:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/7 "2002-06-22T15:46:10Z")
From the examples given by Montezuma, I think he means the union between two or more formerly sovereign states. Of course, for the United States only Texas was ever an independent republic. ---
**Author:** ![Montezuma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/3be4f8/32.png) [@Montezuma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Montezuma)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 4:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/8 "2002-06-22T16:07:08Z")
The longest union that hasn’t been overrun by another power, so that excludes China, baby. ( I know, exclude ottoman empire and russia) ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/9 "2002-06-22T16:10:04Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Walloon \* > \*\*Of course, for the United States only Texas was ever an independent republic. \*\* Correct me if I’m wrong, but wasn’t California also independent? And while not a republic, Hawaii was also a sovereign state. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 4:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/10 "2002-06-22T16:59:08Z")
California went from being Mexican territory to being a U.S. territory, then statehood. But you are right about Hawaii – the islands were united between 1790 and 1810 under King Kamehameha I. In 1893, Queen Liliuokalani was deposed and a republic was created. ---
**Author:** ![Kyla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/eada6e/32.png) [@Kyla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kyla)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/11 "2002-06-22T17:16:43Z")
California _declared_ independence at one point. The nation, the Bear Flag Republic, existed for about six months before the US government shut it down; its actual influence was a tiny part of the state today. However, the California state flag is the flag of the BFR. The oldest republic still in existence is, I believe, Iceland. Another contender might be Thailand, which was never colonized by Europeans and has certainly been in existence for a long time. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 5:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/12 "2002-06-22T17:23:21Z")
Vermont was also its own republic for a year or two. I’ll throw the Ottoman Empire out as the longest union among formerly sovereign entities - over 1000 years. Can any union beat that? ---
**Author:** ![fandango](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b5ac83/32.png) [@fandango](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fandango)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 6:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/13 "2002-06-22T18:19:27Z")
West Florida was a republic as well for about 3 months. Thailand isn’t a republic–it has a king. ---
**Author:** ![fandango](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/b5ac83/32.png) [@fandango](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/fandango)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 6:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/14 "2002-06-22T18:23:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kyla \* > \*\* > The oldest republic still in existence is, I believe, Iceland. Another contender might be Thailand, which was never colonized by Europeans and has certainly been in existence for a long time. \*\* Iceland has only been a republic since the 1940s. It was a kingdom before that and a part of Denmark before that. I remember hearing that the tiny country of San Marino has been a republic for a long time ---
**Author:** ![Bearflag70](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/8e7dd6/32.png) [@Bearflag70](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bearflag70)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 6:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/15 "2002-06-22T18:48:32Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kyla \* > **California _declared_ independence at one point. The nation, the Bear Flag Republic, existed for about six months before the US government shut it down; its actual influence was a tiny part of the state today. However, the California state flag is the flag of the BFR.** This was immediately before the US came into town in the Mexican-American War. When the US military arrived, the Republic folded. Carry on. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 7:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/16 "2002-06-22T19:21:33Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Kyla \* > \*\*The oldest republic still in existence is, I believe, Iceland. \*\* Iceland was an independent republic from 920 to 1262, before it joined with Norway and then became part of Denmark. Its parliament is the oldest in the world. ---
**Author:** ![bup](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/6bbea6/32.png) [@bup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bup)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 7:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/17 "2002-06-22T19:56:00Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Montezuma \* > \*\*The longest union that hasn’t been overrun by another power, so that excludes China, baby. ( I know, exclude ottoman empire and russia) \*\* I think we’re still not clear on the question, then. AFAIK, Chinca was occupied, but has been its own country for a long, long time. I guess you could say modern China is a union of China and Tibet, but not for so very long, so I don’t see why it’s an answer to the question. What are you asking? ---
**Author:** ![MEBuckner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mebuckner/32/2896_2.png) [@MEBuckner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MEBuckner)\ **Post date:** [June 22, 2002, 10:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/18 "2002-06-22T22:42:15Z")
> [@](#): > > Vermont was also its own republic for a year or two. Vermont was actually an independent republic for 14 years, which is longer than Texas managed. I’m not sure if Vermont was ever recognized or exchanged ambassadors with other countries, though, whereas I believe the Republic of Texas was recognized by other sovereign states. As to the longest-running union of sovereign states: \*\* Bosda Di’Chi of Tricor\*\* pointed out that Egypt has been a nation for a very long time. And Egypt was formed from the union of the independent kingdoms of Upper Egypt (the Nile Valley) and Lower Egypt (the Delta) before 3000 B.C.E., traditionally by the semi-legendary king Menes. ---
**Author:** ![Walloon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/fbc32d/32.png) [@Walloon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walloon)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2002, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/19 "2002-06-23T00:46:28Z")
Unlike the Republic of Texas, the “republics” of California and Vermont were not recognized by any other government, which by my standard is fundamental to being considered a sovereign state. ---
**Author:** ![kanicbird](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/5f8ce5/32.png) [@kanicbird](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kanicbird)\ **Post date:** [June 23, 2002, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420/20 "2002-06-23T01:10:32Z")
> [@](#): > > Vermont was also its own republic for a year or two. I always thought that vermont was disputed terratory between NY and NH. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-states-have-had-the-longest-union-in-history/115420.md?page=2)