# Which Two Towers? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [January 25, 2003, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759 "2003-01-25T00:26:37Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![peepthis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/9d8465/32.png) [@peepthis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/peepthis)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 12:26am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/1 "2003-01-25T00:26:37Z")
Okay, go easy on me: I’ve only just yesterday finished reading “The Two Towers” (and rapidly see myself turning into a Tolkien dork:eek: ). But I can’t quite figure out which two towers the title refers to exactly. Orthanc, Barad-Dur, Minas Morgul, Minas Tirith? My orginal thought was Orthanc & Barad-Dur (especially given the _palantir_ connection), but am I gathering correctly that the two latter cities of Minas Morgul & Minas Tirith also had towers? Okay, I’m off to start ROTK now. ---
**Author:** ![ryoushi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/85f322/32.png) [@ryoushi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ryoushi)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/2 "2003-01-25T00:33:30Z")
I think it’s Orthanc and Minas Morgul. At least, those are the two towers drawn on the cover of my copy of the book. 🙂 The movies, on the other hand, clearly refer to Orthanc and Barad-dur as the two towers (Saruman, I think, mentions an “alliance of the Two Towers” early on) ---
**Author:** ![Laughing\_Lagomorph](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/6bbea6/32.png) [@Laughing\_Lagomorph](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Laughing_Lagomorph)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/3 "2003-01-25T00:48:20Z")
The little “teaser” paragraph at the end of my copy of _Fellowship_ indicates that they are Orthanc and Minas Morgul. ---
**Author:** ![Wumpus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8c91f0/32.png) [@Wumpus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wumpus)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 12:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/4 "2003-01-25T00:48:25Z")
Tolkien never made up his mind: “The Two Towers … can be left ambigous – it might refer to Isengard and Barad-Dur, or Minas Tirith and B[arad-Dur]; or Isengard and Cirith Ungol.” Letter 140, 1953. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 12:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/5 "2003-01-25T00:50:32Z")
It is a fair question. I think it is Orthanc and the Barad-dur, because the bad guys are working from there. I would ‘pair’ Minas Morgul with Minas Tirith (as you say they’re both cities). I’m sorry if this is a weak answer, but I’ve lent my copy of LotR to a friend! ---
**Author:** ![5\_time\_champ](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/5/278dde/32.png) [@5\_time\_champ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/5_time_champ)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 1:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/6 "2003-01-25T01:35:31Z")
The Two Towers are Orthanc and Minas Morgul. BTW we are Tolkien _geeks_, not _dorks_. Welcome to the club, however. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/7 "2003-01-25T01:45:49Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by 5 time champ \* > The Two Towers are Orthanc and Minas Morgul. But how do you know, given Wumpus’ reference? ---
**Author:** ![Wumpus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8c91f0/32.png) [@Wumpus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wumpus)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 2:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/8 "2003-01-25T02:00:53Z")
There’s a note at the end of Fellowship of the Ring that says The Two Towers refers to Orthanc and Minas Morgul. However, I believe that note was written by the publisher, not by Tolkien himself. ---
**Author:** ![av8rmike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/edb3f5/32.png) [@av8rmike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/av8rmike)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 3:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/9 "2003-01-25T03:18:17Z")
Cafe Society _desperately_ needs a ‘sticky’ link to Greenbooks’ Q & A: [What are the Two Towers?](http://greenbooks.theonering.net/questions/files/030100.html#whattwotowers) [sub]Sooo tired of seeing the same questions…[/sub] ---
**Author:** ![BuckleberryFerry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/5f9b8f/32.png) [@BuckleberryFerry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BuckleberryFerry)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 3:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/10 "2003-01-25T03:21:39Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by 5 time champ \* > \*\*The Two Towers are Orthanc and Minas Morgul. > > BTW we are Tolkien _geeks_, not _dorks_. Welcome to the club, however. \*\* Hey, I’m a Tolkein LOSER geek, thankyouverymuch! ---
**Author:** ![Achernar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/e274bd/32.png) [@Achernar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Achernar)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/11 "2003-01-25T03:22:05Z")
Man. They should have just called it _The Four Towers_, or better, _The N Towers_. ---
**Author:** ![Monstre](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/e274bd/32.png) [@Monstre](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monstre)\ **Post date:** [January 25, 2003, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/12 "2003-01-25T05:37:17Z")
**av8rmike** : Thanks for that link. When I first read the series, back in junior high, I remember thinking that the two towers referred to were Minas Tirith and Minas Morgul. Looks like Peter Jackson’s interpretation was Orthanc and Barad Dur. Apparently, we were both half right and half wrong. Orthanc does make sense to me, since Saruman is the primary enemy of Book III. Barad Dur doesn’t make as much sense, since Frodo’s not in Mordor yet in Book IV. Perhaps a rename is in order. How about _Dude, Where’s My Towers?_😃 ---
**Author:** ![crinklebat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dec6dc/32.png) [@crinklebat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/crinklebat)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2003, 7:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/13 "2003-02-02T07:40:58Z")
Thank you, **Achernar**. _The n Towers_…I’ll be chuckling over that one well into next week. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [February 2, 2003, 10:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-two-towers/150759/14 "2003-02-02T10:27:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Monstre \* > **av8rmike** : Thanks for that link. > > When I first read the series, back in junior high, I remember thinking that the two towers referred to were Minas Tirith and Minas Morgul. Looks like Peter Jackson’s interpretation was Orthanc and Barad Dur. Apparently, we were both half right and half wrong. > > Orthanc does make sense to me, since Saruman is the primary enemy of Book III. Barad Dur doesn’t make as much sense, since Frodo’s not in Mordor yet in Book IV. > > Perhaps a rename is in order. How about _Dude, Where’s My Towers?_😃 Well that is a good link, but it’s still inconclusive! Monstre, you gave me an idea - look for a new thread in Cafe Society! 😃