# Which Would You Choose to Have Restored to the World? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [August 31, 2017, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181 "2017-08-31T17:27:39Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![nightshadea](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/7ba0ec/32.png) [@nightshadea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nightshadea)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2017, 9:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/21 "2017-08-31T21:46:14Z")
Quote: Originally Posted by Chronos Of course, most likely, we wouldn’t get anything from it, because there’s no technology that’s known to two other civilizations that we lack, and then it’d promptly go obsolete again because we already have Education. > [@iiandyiiii](#): > > We’d get tons from it – history, literature and myth, and language. There are many lost languages, or texts we have that are so far undeciphered, and this would probably fill in many of these gaps. its a joke from the civilization strategy pc game series …see in the ancient era if you build it you get the same knowledge from the other two game civilizations that’s learned the same thing … but once you get to a certain point in the education tech tree its obsolete ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2017, 9:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/22 "2017-08-31T21:54:53Z")
I’d choose the Library, if I get to officially rename it as a “Liberry”. ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2017, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/23 "2017-08-31T21:56:16Z")
Library, of course. Also, after having learned about its existence the other day, the Claw of Archimedes would be fun, too. ---
**Author:** ![Anamorphic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/anamorphic/32/3057_2.png) [@Anamorphic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anamorphic)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2017, 10:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/24 "2017-08-31T22:31:54Z")
I am a fan of cinema history, and would LOVE to see many of the lost silent movies. Still, I wouldn’t even have to think about the answer to this question; I’d choose the Library in a second. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 31, 2017, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/25 "2017-08-31T22:52:13Z")
Library. One urban legend that has sprung up is that the Christians burned the books. Not so. Mostly the Romans burned and looted. The Muslims finished off what little remained. ---
**Author:** ![Weisshund](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/ba8739/32.png) [@Weisshund](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Weisshund)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2017, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/26 "2017-09-01T01:32:54Z")
Library, and every book that was every lost in it ---
**Author:** ![MacSpon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/34f0e0/32.png) [@MacSpon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MacSpon)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2017, 2:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/27 "2017-09-01T02:53:48Z")
It’s common to think that the Library of Alexandria was an incalculable loss because it was the great central repository of all knowledge and wisdom. This is actually kind of nonsense. There were thousands of libraries around the Mediterranean at the time. Books were lost, over the centuries, not because of one great fire, but because _nobody bothered to copy them_. Or because of a format change: from scrolls to bound books. A couple of relevant articles: [The contents of the library of Alexandria](http://kiwihellenist.blogspot.com/2016/12/the-contents-of-library-of-alexandria.html) [The library of Alexandria: vox populi](http://kiwihellenist.blogspot.com/2017/03/library-of-alexandria-vox-populi.html) ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 1, 2017, 2:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/28 "2017-09-01T02:58:01Z")
Regardless of why the writings were lost, what the genie is offering us would still restore a lot of lost material. The fact that the same material could also be restored by magically restoring a number of other libraries is irrelevant. ---
**Author:** ![Ramira](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ramira/32/344_2.png) [@Ramira](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ramira)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/29 "2017-09-05T00:00:42Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Library. > > One urban legend that has sprung up is that the Christians burned the books. Not so. Mostly the Romans burned and looted. > > The Muslims finished off what little remained. It is not an urban legend at all. the best documentation closest in time for a deliberate desstruction is by the Coptic Pope anti pagan and pagan documents suppression decrees effort. Not romans nor muslims. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 4:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/30 "2017-09-05T04:24:48Z")
> [@Ramira](#): > > It is not an urban legend at all. > > the best documentation closest in time for a deliberate desstruction is by the Coptic Pope anti pagan and pagan documents suppression decrees effort. Not romans nor muslims. Absolutely, the Patriarch Theophilus in AD391 ordered the destruction of the temple of Serapis. Which was ONCE part of the Library, but had been converted to a Temple of Mitra. There is no indications at all that any books were still housed there. > **[The contents of the library of Alexandria](http://kiwihellenist.blogspot.com/2016/12/the-contents-of-library-of-alexandria.html)** > > The library of Alexandria wasn't majorly different from other ancient libraries. And we have a good idea of what was in it. "_The idea that the temple of Serapis still housed a library in 391 is doubtful; evidently we’re still taking Gibbon at face value and blaming Christianity for the loss of information from antiquity; and here we have even more emphasis on the library’s destruction as if it had any impact."_ > **[The library of Alexandria: vox populi](http://kiwihellenist.blogspot.com/2017/03/library-of-alexandria-vox-populi.html)** > > A selection of assumptions people make about the library of Alexandria. “The royal archive at Alexandria was indeed burned in the Alexandrian War of 48/7 BCE. But other similar incidents are at best poorly attested, at worst illusions. (The supposed destruction in 389 or 391 CE was invented by Gibbon…” > **[Library of Alexandria](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Library_of_Alexandria)** > > The Great Library of Alexandria in Alexandria, Egypt, was one of the largest and most significant libraries of the ancient world. The library was part of a larger research institution called the Mouseion, which was dedicated to the Muses, the nine goddesses of the arts. The idea of a universal library in Alexandria may have been proposed by Demetrius of Phalerum, an exiled Athenian statesman living in Alexandria, to Ptolemy I Soter, who may have established plans for the Library, but the Libr _Paganism was made illegal by an edict of the Emperor Theodosius I in AD 391. The temples of Alexandria were closed by Patriarch Theophilus of Alexandria in AD 391.[32] The historian Socrates of Constantinople describes that all pagan temples in Alexandria were destroyed, including the Serapeum.[34] Since the Serapeum had at one time housed a part of the Great Library, some scholars believe that the remains of the Library of Alexandria were destroyed at this time.[32][35] However, it is not known how many, if any, books were contained in it at the time of destruction, and contemporary scholars do not mention the library directly.[36][37]_ > **[What happened to the Great Library at Alexandria?](https://www.worldhistory.org/article/207/what-happened-to-the-great-library-at-alexandria/)** > > Once the largest library in the ancient world, and containing works by the greatest thinkers and writers of antiquity, including Homer, Plato, Socrates and many more, the Library of Alexandria, northern... _The prime suspect in destruction of the Library of Alexandria is Julius Caesar. It is alleged that during Caesar’s occupation of the city of Alexandria in 48 BCE, he found himself in the Royal Palace, hemmed in by the Egyptian fleet in the harbour. For his own safety he had his men set fire to the Egyptian ships, but the fire got out of control and spread to the parts of the city nearest the shore, which included warehouses, depots and some arsenals. After Caesar’s death it was generally believed that it was he who had destroyed the Library. Roman philosopher and dramatist Seneca, quoting from Livy’s History of Rome, written between 63 BCE and 14 CE, says that 40,000 scrolls were destroyed in the fire started by Caesar. Greek historian Plutarch (died 120 CE) mentions that the fire destroyed ‘the great Library’ and Roman historian Dio Cassius (c. 165 – 235 CE) mentions a warehouse of manuscripts being destroyed during the conflagration._ _In 391 CE, as part of his attempt to wipe out paganism, Emperor Theodosius I officially sanctioned the destruction of the Serapeum, or Temple of Serapis at Alexandria. The destruction of the Temple was carried out under Theophilus, Bishop of Alexandria, and afterwards a Christian church was built on the site. It has been hypothesised that the daughter library of the Museum, located close to the Temple, and the Royal Library were also razed to the ground at this time. However, whilst it is plausible that manuscripts from the Serapeum library may have been destroyed during this purge, there is no evidence that the Royal Library still existed at the end the 4th century. No ancient sources mention the destruction of any library at this time, though 18th century English historian Edward Gibbon mistakenly attributes it to bishop Theophilus._ [http://www.bede.org.uk/library.htmThe](http://www.bede.org.uk/library.htmThe) verdict on Theophilus \*It is hard enough to establish beyond doubt that there was a library in the Serapeum at all but if there was, Ammianus makes clear that it was no longer there by the mid-fourth century. This is confirmed by the silence of all the sources, including one that would be keen to report Christian atrocities, for the destruction of the temple in 391AD. Note that this is not an ‘argument from silence’ because there is no reason at all to expect a mention of books in the Serapeum when it was demolished. An invalid ‘argument from silence’ is when we claim something that is not mentioned did not happen, even though other evidence suggests it did. There is no positive evidence for the existence of the library and instead near conclusive eye witness evidence against. The story that Theophilus destroyed a library is clearly a fiction that we can very precisely lay at the door of Edward Gibbon. It is in his monumental Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire that we first find the allegation made. Gibbon seems mainly concerned to clear the Arabs of the responsibility of destroying the library and allows his marked anti-Christian prejudice to cloud his better judgement. His excellent footnotes show he had exactly the same sources as we do but drew the wrong conclusions. The story has recently been popularised by Carl Sagan who includes it in Cosmos. He spices the story up with a role for the murdered philosopher Hypatia, even though there is no evidence connecting her to the library at all. \* “\*\*The story that Theophilus destroyed a library is clearly a fiction that we can very precisely lay at the door of Edward Gibbon. \*\*” ---
**Author:** ![Gatopescado](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gatopescado/32/5711_2.png) [@Gatopescado](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gatopescado)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 5:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/31 "2017-09-05T05:16:44Z")
Neither. I want the little dent in my GB500 tank to be fixed, perfect, like new. Mint. Showroom. Show quality. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 11:41am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/32 "2017-09-05T11:41:58Z")
If those are the only choices, the library. But I’m not convinced we’d be regaining countless lost treasures. I’d be tempted to ask the genie for more options. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 12:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/33 "2017-09-05T12:16:30Z")
Two more wishes. Or a ten inch pianist. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 3:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/34 "2017-09-05T15:04:02Z")
Would I like to have the lost library back? Yes. Do I want it back so much that it takes away from my second favorite part on Spaceship Earth? Nope. The films it is. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/35 "2017-09-05T17:01:02Z")
How can your favorite part be something you’ve never seen? The genie’s offering to restore the movies that were lost, not threatening to erase the movies that still exist. ---
**Author:** ![Ukulele\_Ike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/df788c/32.png) [@Ukulele\_Ike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ukulele_Ike)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/36 "2017-09-05T17:10:07Z")
Fuck dem books. I want to see Erich von Stroheim’s unedited _McTeague_. – Uke, Devil’s Advocate ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/37 "2017-09-05T17:27:44Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > How can your favorite part be something you’ve never seen? The genie’s offering to restore the movies that were lost, not threatening to erase the movies that still exist. Was this to me? Since I mentioned the word “favorite”? ---
**Author:** ![Scylla](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/a5b964/32.png) [@Scylla](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Scylla)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/38 "2017-09-05T17:50:55Z")
If we get Tv shows, too, I might be tempted by the film. I want the lost Ernie Kovacs. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 7:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/39 "2017-09-05T19:22:41Z")
Yes, **Sir T-Cups**. It sounded like you were saying that your second favorite part of Spaceship Earth was a silent movie, and you didn’t want to lose it. But neither of the genie’s options involve losing anything that we already have. ---
**Author:** ![Sir\_T-Cups](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ed655f/32.png) [@Sir\_T-Cups](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sir_T-Cups)\ **Post date:** [September 5, 2017, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181/40 "2017-09-05T19:29:56Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Yes, **Sir T-Cups**. It sounded like you were saying that your second favorite part of Spaceship Earth was a silent movie, and you didn’t want to lose it. But neither of the genie’s options involve losing anything that we already have. Ah ok. Nope, my second favorite part of Spaceship Earth is when they talk about the Library being burned. It’s because they make the area smell like burning and it’s pretty cool. If the library was never burned, then it takes that part away. Although, now that I think about it, the genie doesn’t prevent the original library from being burned, s/he just brings the info back. I think I’m going to change my answer to the library, but only if Spaceship Earth can remain the same. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/which-would-you-choose-to-have-restored-to-the-world/795181.md?page=3)