# Whiny Bitch Sues for and Wins Valedictorian Title **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [May 11, 2003, 4:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448 "2003-05-11T04:20:42Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 3:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/41 "2003-05-12T03:23:38Z")
OK, so you want judges to be, what? Plumbers? ---
**Author:** ![Milum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ea666f/32.png) [@Milum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Milum)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 4:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/42 "2003-05-12T04:04:52Z")
Uh,\*\* squeegee\*\*, excuse you if you sound a bit elitist. Of course we should want our judges to be plumbers, honest plumbers, plumbers who are part of the american experiment. Plumbers, farmers, ditch-diggers, even left-wing pinkco teachers. What we should want is to re-take our legal system from the grubbing hands of those who extort money from we good americans who have been told that the law is the property of a caste of hoo-dooers who sell justice to the highest bidders. These robbers of the poor are low-life and must be purged from our wonderful system of equal treatment under law. Why? You think different? ---
**Author:** ![squeegee](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/squeegee/32/14537_2.png) [@squeegee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/squeegee)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 4:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/43 "2003-05-12T04:52:11Z")
I just thought perhaps Judges should be at least passingly familiar with, you know, law. Perhaps I should demand an accountant tune up my engine as well? Shall we take back the Precision-Tunes from the grubby hands of the mechanics? Do you wish for airline pilot to be an elected position? ---
**Author:** ![japatlgt](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/df705f/32.png) [@japatlgt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/japatlgt)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 4:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/44 "2003-05-12T04:56:31Z")
I rejoice that these people are not my neighbors. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/45 "2003-05-12T05:00:39Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by japatlgt \* > \*\*I rejoice that these people are not my neighbors. \*\* **Milum** and **squeegee** or the Hornstine’s? 😃 ---
**Author:** ![Mojo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/85f322/32.png) [@Mojo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mojo)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 5:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/46 "2003-05-12T05:06:26Z")
The Philadelphia Inquirer has a more in-depth version of the story [here](http://www.philly.com/mld/inquirer/news/local/5818942.htm), including some of the judge’s comments. > [@](#): > > “If forced to share the award, the stigma would likely be unshakable,” the judge said. "She would be seen as ‘the disabled valedictorian,’ not ‘the valedictorian.’ In my humble non-lawyer/non-judge (although I do have some experience unclogging toilets) opinion, she’s more likely to be seen as “the disabled valedictorian” by virtue of having a GPA that was unattainable by a non-disabled student. > [@](#): > > School officials had proposed changing the criteria for valedictorian at a board meeting next week. Wolfson’s order barred any such change and harshly criticized school officials for considering a rule that she said so transparently targeted one person. “You might as well call it the Hornstine Amendment,” the judge said. “Why haven’t you looked at this [special-education] curriculum before? You have pinpointed her.” Why hadn’t they looked at the curriculum before? Because nobody had taken advantage of the special-ed curriculum before. This is the first time it came up and the principal made a judgement call. I’d really like to know what the “great concerns” about the motivations of school officals that the judge had- from everything I’ve seen it seems that it was fair play. ---
**Author:** ![Tars\_Tarkas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Tars\_Tarkas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tars_Tarkas)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 5:11am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/47 "2003-05-12T05:11:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by japatlgt \* > \*\*I rejoice that these people are not my neighbors. > > * * * > > THEY’RE EVERYWHERE!! > > \*\* lol! This girl is a waste of oxygen. Where is a vengeful God to zap people with lightning when you need him? ---
**Author:** ![don\_t\_ask](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e68b1a/32.png) [@don\_t\_ask](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/don_t_ask)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 6:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/48 "2003-05-12T06:08:41Z")
I don’t think she’s a popular girl - [http://www.petitiononline.com/blairadm/petition.html](http://www.petitiononline.com/blairadm/petition.html) at the moment. ---
**Author:** ![smiling\_bandit](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e9a140/32.png) [@smiling\_bandit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/smiling_bandit)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 12:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/49 "2003-05-12T12:02:37Z")
> [@](#): > > Ah, now I get it! The 4000 or so attorneys that are in state legislatures today (What an unpleasant thought) serve sorta pro bono. What sacrifice! What altruism! The forgoance of a ton of money to serve we the people! Actually, yes, most lawyers are pretty decent, good people, who serve in public office when they choose to do so because they enjoy the position, like the work, and are willing to give up the money. > [@](#): > > I don’t ask much. But think a bit about what you wrote. Do you really want your life in the hands of an ole boy’s network of lawyers? Why do you assume that lawyers get along with each other to the extant that they automatically form a good old-boy’s club? > [@](#): > > Of course we should want our judges to be plumbers, honest plumbers, I should point out that you are assuming that lawyers are dishonest. I suppose they are no more or less dishonest as a class than any other group, plumbers included. But dishonest or unethical lawyers can sue people for a lot more than a plumber can bilk a customer. > [@](#): > > plumbers who are part of the american experiment. Lawyers live here, too. > [@](#): > > Plumbers, farmers, ditch-diggers, even left-wing pinkco teachers. I should probably point out that ditch-diggers are usually machines now. > [@](#): > > What we should want is to re-take our legal system from the grubbing hands of those who extort money Granted, this is the forum for witnessing… > [@](#): > > from we good americans who have been told that the law is the property of a caste of hoo-dooers who sell justice to the highest bidders. Cite? [quote] These robbers of the poor are low-life and must be purged from our wonderful system of equal treatment under law. Where does this assumption that a law decree is a Baptism in Evil stem from? > [@](#): > > Why? You think different? Yes, I think you are paranoid and must be kept from any public office, ever. ---
**Author:** ![istara](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/e79b87/32.png) [@istara](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/istara)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 7:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/50 "2003-05-12T19:38:41Z")
That petitiononline is nectar! Milk and honey! Just hope she gets to read it. (Doubtless she’ll sue). ---
**Author:** ![Dinsdale](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/97f17d/32.png) [@Dinsdale](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dinsdale)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/51 "2003-05-12T20:10:00Z")
Hmm. I wasn’t expecting another sequel to the Blair Witch Project! ---
**Author:** ![pravnik](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/8edcca/32.png) [@pravnik](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pravnik)\ **Post date:** [May 12, 2003, 10:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/52 "2003-05-12T22:07:23Z")
The wacky adventures of non lawyer judge attorney 1: So, what did the victim say to you? witness: Right before losing consciousness, she told me that Mr. Evans told her that he had poisoned her. attorney 2: Objection, your non-lawyer honor. Hearsay. attorney 1: The statement is a dying declaration subject to a hearsay exception under Rule 804 (b)(2), your non-lawyer honor. attorney 2: That’s preposterous, non-lawyer judge. The victim did not die. attorney 1: That’s not required under the rules, your non-laywer honor. All that is required is that the statement was made in belief of impending death and that the declarant be unavailable. attorney 2: Even if that’s true, your non-lawyer honor, which we do not concede, the statement is double hearsay. attorney 1: We admit that it is double hearsay, your honor; however, the hearsay within hearsay is also subject to an exclusion under 801 (d)(2) as a party admission against interest, and as such the entire statement is admissible. Your ruling, your non-lawyer honor? non-lawyer judge: Hey, how the heck should I know? I’m _not a lawyer!_ Now, if you gentlemen will excuse me, I’ve got a date with a couple of stewardesses! _Yowza!_ ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/53 "2003-05-13T00:45:32Z")
Also from the article: > [@](#): > > The senior who earned the highest grades in the regular curriculum, Kenneth Mirkin, intervened in the lawsuit and appeared in court yesterday. > > His lawyer, Frances A. Harman, argued that Hornstine had an “incidental advantage” over Mirkin because the special-education curriculum had given Hornstine individual attention, extra time to take tests, and an exemption from physical education class, which is weighted less in GPA calculations than regular classes. “My client is cast in the position of being a victim,” Harman told the court. > > Afterward, Mirkin, 18, said he believed he would be vindicated when “all the facts” in the case came out. “I’m not concerned with my personal right to be valedictorian,” he said. “I did this for the senior class, the school, and the citizens of Moorestown.” > > Both Hornstine and Mirkin plan to attend Harvard University in the fall, with Hornstine following in the footsteps of her brother, Adam. Hmmmm…so she’ll be attending Harvard with this guy? Sheesh. She thinks SHE’S the victim? Her classmates are embarassed and ashamed. I hope it’s worth all this to her. ---
**Author:** ![X\_Slayer\_ALE](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/bbe5ce/32.png) [@X\_Slayer\_ALE](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/X_Slayer_ALE)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/54 "2003-05-13T01:10:55Z")
Actually, since she is studying to be a snake …er lawyer, this is pretty good experience for her. It helps her keep her emotions in, shows her that she can screw her classmates and act professional and still get rewards, She already has courtroom experience and she won. To a budding lawyer, thats invalueable. Given her goals, I think she deserves the valedictorian title. Once she sheds her skin, she’d make a fine litigator. ---
**Author:** ![athelas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5e9695/32.png) [@athelas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/athelas)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 12:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/55 "2003-05-13T12:21:45Z")
I live within a 20-minute drive of the school. I’m sure I can find wherever she’s living…so, how many slaps will that be? 😛 ---
**Author:** ![Huerta88](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/82dd89/32.png) [@Huerta88](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Huerta88)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 8:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/56 "2003-05-13T20:57:56Z")
Has anyone confirmed (disproved?) the OP statement that her “tutors” providing the A+s were, or included, her mom or other possibly-partial part(ies)? Most of the news accounts that describe her “immune condition” in any detail characterize it as “similar to CFS.” Has anyone seen a more-specific description, i.e., a name for the diagnosis? Does she drop dead if she gets a cold? Is this truly a girl-in-the-bubble “disease” or a too-delicate-to-live neurasthenic “disease?” ---
**Author:** ![Conflict\_of\_Interest](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/57b2e6/32.png) [@Conflict\_of\_Interest](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Conflict_of_Interest)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/57 "2003-05-13T21:30:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Huerta88 \* > \*\*Has anyone confirmed (disproved?) the OP statement that her “tutors” providing the A+s were, or included, her mom or other possibly-partial part(ies)? > > Most of the news accounts that describe her “immune condition” in any detail characterize it as “similar to CFS.” Has anyone seen a more-specific description, i.e., a name for the diagnosis? Does she drop dead if she gets a cold? > > Is this truly a girl-in-the-bubble “disease” or a too-delicate-to-live neurasthenic “disease?” \*\* Good questions. I was wondering that myself. In addition, I wonder what accomadations will need to be made for her at Harvard. Will we see a repeat of this type of action in 4 years? ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [May 13, 2003, 10:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/58 "2003-05-13T22:36:37Z")
You realize how this stupid case would have been settled in New Zealand. [http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm\_758851.html](http://www.ananova.com/news/story/sm_758851.html) I bet she would have lost, too, if the other valedictorians weren’t complete pansies. At least they took gym class. ---
**Author:** ![Roadfood](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/9fc348/32.png) [@Roadfood](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roadfood)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2003, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/59 "2003-05-14T00:06:54Z")
My idea of justice: The school arranges for Mr. Mirkin to be the one who introduces the valedictorian at the commencement. He stands up, says that he lost out on being the co-valedictorian because of the actions of Ms. Hornstine, but harbors no ill will towards her. However, he goes on to say that in the spirit of free speech, he would like to read some differing opinions, then goes on to read some of the comments from the petition: [http://www.petitiononline.com/blairadm/petition.html](http://www.petitiononline.com/blairadm/petition.html) After a few dozen of the choicest of those are heard, Ms. Hornstine has to get up and give her speech. Even if the petition somehow makes it to the Harvard admissions staff, they wouldn’t act on it. Given Ms. Hornstine’s response to on the current issue, Harvard would have to assume that if they reversed her admission, she’d sue the pants off them. I must say, she certainly has what it takes to be a lawyer: The attitude that the appropriate response to every little disappointment that life hands you is to sue for millions of dollars. ---
**Author:** ![Cosmopolitan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/94ad74/32.png) [@Cosmopolitan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cosmopolitan)\ **Post date:** [May 14, 2003, 3:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448/60 "2003-05-14T03:16:58Z")
I can just see this little debacle screwing over kids who need special testing situations because they have learning disabilities or kids who take the “adapted” P.E. classes because they can’t participate in the regular ones. Oy… [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whiny-bitch-sues-for-and-wins-valedictorian-title/174448.md?page=4)