# White Anger! **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [January 31, 2021, 1:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918 "2021-01-31T13:45:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2021, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/61 "2021-02-08T03:33:07Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > What % of the capitol hill marchers were white? What % were white men? I think in America about 60% of Americans are white and about 30% are white men. But the people who tried to overthrow the government were mostly white men, with some white women thrown in. What about the people marching shouting ‘jews will not replace us’, what % of them were white men? Sure. And if you anger is directed at the insurrectionists, that’s great, and even all white supremacists. But the OP isnt. Sure that’s one small part but: > [@msmith537](#): > > - Overbearing parents screaming at their mediocre kid’s soccer coach or teacher whenever their kid performs mediocrely. > - Any time you see a “Karen” screaming at some barista because they got her order wrong. That fact that we have a slang term for an angry, entitled, white woman. > - Classic characters in film and TV like Archie Bunker, Al Bundy, Red Foreman from That 70s Show, etc. I get it dude. Your life’s not perfect. Still seem pretty well off though for acting like such a horses ass. > - Any of these reality shows on Bravo like Real Housewives which just seem to be affluent white people screaming at each other over every perceived slight. > - Just the fact that in this day and age, you still have people who become infuriated at the idea of maybe not shooting people who are a different color or letting people marry whoever they want or just using their brain. > - One might even come to the conclusion that the entire history of white people going back to the British Empire, the Romans, and Alexander the Great consists of meeting their neighbors and being like FUCK THESE DUDES! **That is bigotry pure and simple.** ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2021, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/62 "2021-02-08T05:28:36Z")
You’ll pardon me, I hope, for observing that _simple_ hasn’t got a goddamned thing to do with it. ---
**Author:** ![BigT](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigt/32/12044_2.png) [@BigT](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigT)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2021, 6:16am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/63 "2021-02-08T06:16:58Z")
You’ve not actually described any reason that what he’s saying is bigoted. You just seem to be treating it as self-evident. If that is so, why is it that other white people\* in this thread don’t see it as such? The only one of the points you quoted that I can see being interpreted in a bigoted way is the last one. You could possibly read it as saying that every single white person has historically been like this, rather than a comment about the general patterns of our ancestors. But most would interpret it as the latter. The rest? They’re talking about specific people who act in a certain way, not in any way claiming all white people or all affluent people act in that manner. In short, nothing said suggests that the OP is disparaging white people in general or supporting discrimination against white people. He appears to be discussing a legitimate phenomenon where the affluent of a majority, who face fewer problems and thus you would expect to be happier, seem to be as angry or moreso than minorities who face real problems. And he’s bringing up that part of this seems to be because they feel the less privileged making gains is somehow a threat to them. I can’t really disagree with any of it, frankly. And I’m white–am I a self-hating white person? \*I can’t say I know the race of every poster, but I’m fairly confident at least some of the posters in here are white, and I at least know for sure I’m white and do not agree that there is anything bigoted about the OP’s remarks. It punches up, not down. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2021, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/64 "2021-02-08T21:09:07Z")
Naah, mate. Bigotry has to be unreasonable, or prejudiced. The OP’s kind of _observation_ is just judiced. Or postjudiced, if you would. ---
**Author:** ![LSLGuy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lslguy/32/5813_2.png) [@LSLGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/LSLGuy)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2021, 10:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/65 "2021-02-08T22:00:06Z")
@MrDibble. Thank you. I tried to say the same thing, but abandoned my post twice. IMO you nailed the idea succinctly. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2021, 10:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/66 "2021-02-08T22:13:07Z")
Just some of my observations as a white man growing up among other white folk. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2021, 10:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/67 "2021-02-08T22:19:37Z")
I also submit this thread discussing an incident between an Angry White Couple and an Angry White Man that resulted in all of them dead: > [@3 Dead over snow shoveling dispute - PA](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/3-dead-over-snow-shoveling-dispute-pa/932269/75): > > That couple had a child. AFAIK, it had nothing to do with race. Just three people leading normal lives losing their shit over something stupid. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2021, 11:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/68 "2021-02-08T23:14:14Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > AFAIK, it had nothing to do with race. Just three people leading normal lives losing their shit over something stupid. Concur, although with the caveat that sometimes people in a traditionally privileged group are more aggressive about getting their own way as individuals, because they’ve absorbed the attitude that people like them are entitled to get what they want. As I’ve said before, though, I think it’s pointless to try to figure out exactly how much of any particular incident is due to the subtle influence of systemic societal bigotry and how much of it is just due to individual character and personality. ---
**Author:** ![Dark\_Sponge](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dark_sponge/32/121_2.png) [@Dark\_Sponge](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dark_Sponge)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2021, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/69 "2021-02-08T23:23:01Z")
I don’t see it as being race related, just simple selfishness. This country would be a better place if every citizen had to spend a day with a person from a 3rd world country who was truly suffering. We’d all be more content at least. ---
**Author:** ![MrMrmrmr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrmrmrmr/32/5828_2.png) [@MrMrmrmr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrMrmrmr)\ **Post date:** [February 8, 2021, 11:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/70 "2021-02-08T23:38:02Z")
My daughter vacationed in Nicaragua. Eye opening to say the least. ---
**Author:** ![FriendlyCurmudgeon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/friendlycurmudgeon/32/5786_2.png) [@FriendlyCurmudgeon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FriendlyCurmudgeon)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2021, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/71 "2021-02-09T00:05:20Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I also submit this thread discussing an incident between an Angry White Couple and an Angry White Man that resulted in all of them dead: > > > [@](#): > > > > That couple had a child. > > AFAIK, it had nothing to do with race. Just three people leading normal lives losing their shit over something stupid. Hi msmith537, I’m the OP of that post, it’s over 80 replies long - and if you check there’s no mention of race to date. Which is troubling because that means when I read a story about a violent tragedy, I think of the human beings involved, you on the other hand focus on the racial identity of the human beings involved. Guess what that makes you ? ---
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2021, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/72 "2021-02-09T01:23:17Z")
I going to side with those that say that “white anger” is the same anger that is found among a subset of individuals of all races its just viewed differently. Up until recently white anger was strong and assertive, while black anger was dangerous and animalistic and latino anger was firey. Similarly on the Karen side of things white women were stern and no nonsense (if directed at the help) or shrewish (if directed at their husbands), while black women were sassy. But its all really the same anger and assholeishness underneath. I think white anger is more on display than black anger, because blacks have been taught that expressing their anger in public can be dangerous to them. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2021, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/73 "2021-02-09T02:06:50Z")
> [@FriendlyCurmudgeon](#): > > Which is troubling because that means when I read a story about a violent tragedy, I think of the human beings involved, you on the other hand focus on the racial identity of the human beings involved. > > Guess what that makes you ? ?? WTF, dude? msmith537 explicitly said in the very post that you replied to that he thought the Snow Shovel Shooting murder/suicide tragedy had nothing to do with race. (And anyway, there would not automatically be anything racist about considering whether systemic societal racism might have contributed to the mindset of irrationally excessive hostility that the perpetrator and victims of this tragedy exhibited.) ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2021, 3:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/74 "2021-02-09T03:45:05Z")
> [@FriendlyCurmudgeon](#): > > Hi msmith537, > > I’m the OP of that post, it’s over 80 replies long - and if you check there’s no mention of race to > date. > > Which is troubling because that means when I read a story about a violent tragedy, I think of the human beings involved, you on the other hand focus on the racial identity of the human beings involved. > > Guess what that makes you ? How does a white guy having a discussion about other white people’s behavior make me anything? ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2021, 4:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/75 "2021-02-09T04:44:41Z")
> [@FriendlyCurmudgeon](#): > > Guess what that makes you ? _Not_ willfully blind? ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2021, 10:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/76 "2021-02-09T10:00:39Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > I was referring to what angry white males think, not what I think. Generally people who have abused others are afraid that those others will justifiably abuse them back if they get the chance. They rarely bring that up to consciousness, but it is something that fuels their anger toward their victims. A complicated denialism. And you think angry white males have all abused others? That’s a pretty big assumption, how do you justify it? ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2021, 11:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/77 "2021-02-09T11:35:03Z")
Okay, I am only going to say this one more time and then give up. White anger has a big component of fear of retribution. It is not **PERSONAL** , any more than the anger is truly personal. It is **CULTURAL**. It isn’t **INDIVIDUAL** , it is **COLLECTIVE**. Presently we are calling this collective assemblage of group history “white male privilege”, but it is a poor descriptor. What that means is that every white male carries, as a member of that group, all the baggage of history of western civilization with him wherever he goes. It means that he carries all the preferential treatment with him like an invisible skin, as well as the price paid for this treatment, by everyone, including themselves. For those who have reaped the benefits, part of the price is a conscious or (far more usually) unconscious sense that everyone who has historically been shoved aside, demeaned, enslaved, etc. so that white men can be at the top of the pile, desires to displace them, and more than that, punish them for the endless wrongs which have been inflicted. Not mere equality, but vengeance. The less secure in their privilege white men are, I believe, the more they fear this ‘displacement’. If you respond again with the specious argument that I have to show that every individual angry white male has not only individually wronged an individual other person whom they individually fear is going to demand justice, you will just prove how deliberately obtuse you are being. Unless it isn’t deliberate. If you cannot grasp that we are never merely atomic minds but always also are part of a collective cultural moment, there is really nothing to be discussed with you. ---
**Author:** ![DemonTree](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/demontree/32/8646_2.png) [@DemonTree](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DemonTree)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2021, 12:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/78 "2021-02-09T12:08:39Z")
> [@Ulfreida](#): > > Presently we are calling this collective assemblage of group history “white male privilege”, but it is a poor descriptor. What that means is that every white male carries, as a member of that group, all the baggage of history of western civilization with him wherever he goes. It means that he carries all the preferential treatment with him like an invisible skin, as well as the price paid for this treatment, by everyone, including themselves. For those who have reaped the benefits, part of the price is a conscious or (far more usually) unconscious sense that everyone who has historically been shoved aside, demeaned, enslaved, etc. so that white men can be at the top of the pile, desires to displace them, and more than that, punish them for the endless wrongs which have been inflicted. Not mere equality, but vengeance. The less secure in their privilege white men are, I believe, the more they fear this ‘displacement’. Okay, I understand what you’re saying now, although I think it’s probably not true. ---
**Author:** ![What\_Exit](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/what_exit/32/10652_2.png) [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2021, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/79 "2021-02-09T12:59:44Z")
**Modhat** : _What a cute way to call another poster a racist_. Oh wait, no. **Don’t do this again.** Insults of other posters belong only in the pit. _This is just a guidance, not a warning. Nothing on your permanent record._ ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2021, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918/80 "2021-02-09T15:22:28Z")
Accept correction I shouldn’t insult other posters. I was not, for the record, calling anyone a racist. At least not intentionally. So, not being cute. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-anger/931918.md?page=5)