# White couple spent all their savings to renovate house that's now worth 100K less **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [April 27, 2016, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281 "2016-04-27T21:36:21Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![eschereal](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eschereal/32/18939_2.png) [@eschereal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/eschereal)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/41 "2016-04-28T03:44:59Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > So. . .“dummer”? He did that on purpose, to show how ig’nant and shit they really are. And also, because they make a lot more noise than a _dumb_ person would. ---
**Author:** ![octopus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/octopus/32/3716_2.png) [@octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/octopus)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 3:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/42 "2016-04-28T03:51:14Z")
Is it a good investment? Won’t know until they sell it. ---
**Author:** ![Mudshark](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f04885/32.png) [@Mudshark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mudshark)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 4:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/43 "2016-04-28T04:51:15Z")
They seem happy with the house and what they have done with it. It’s their money, they earned it/borrowed it. Obviously their families thought it was a good idea, so I say good investment. ---
**Author:** ![Nava](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/da6949/32.png) [@Nava](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Nava)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 8:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/44 "2016-04-28T08:00:59Z")
Since the work wasn’t intended as an investment, asking if this was “a good investment” is akin to asking if I am a good nurse. Hint: I do not have a nursing degree. And if the book sells enough, hey, they will even have made money! ---
**Author:** ![Asimovian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asimovian/32/172_2.png) [@Asimovian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asimovian)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 10:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/45 "2016-04-28T10:53:07Z")
> [@Zeke\_N.Destroi](#): > > Because the OP is racist Knock off the personal insults. That being said: > [@GovernmentMan](#): > > [http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/23/your-money/in-a-big-hole-for-a-detroit-house-but-happy.html](http://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/23/your-money/in-a-big-hole-for-a-detroit-house-but-happy.html) > > [Couple](https://static01.nyt.com/images/2016/04/22/business/your-money-detroit-slide-LL5M/your-money-detroit-slide-LL5M-slide.jpg) > > [House](https://static01.nyt.com/images/2016/04/22/business/your-money-detroit-slide-P8WL/your-money-detroit-slide-P8WL-slide.jpg) If you have an opinion you want to share, share it. Don’t start a thread to dump a link in it. I will leave this one open, as there has been a legitimate effort by other posters to have a conversation. But future threads like this, particularly where you’re leaving posters to try to guess your point, will likely be closed. ---
**Author:** ![Asimovian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asimovian/32/172_2.png) [@Asimovian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asimovian)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 10:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/46 "2016-04-28T10:56:06Z")
> [@Stranger\_On\_A\_Train](#): > > White people act stupid all the time. Look at Bernie Sanders and Donald Trump supporters. They’re all white, and it is really difficult to get any dummer than that without serious neurological trauma. > > Stranger Let’s not drag political digs into this thread. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 11:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/47 "2016-04-28T11:15:42Z")
The three most important factors in real estate are always: Location Location White People ---
**Author:** ![VinylTurnip](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/b2d939/32.png) [@VinylTurnip](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/VinylTurnip)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/48 "2016-04-28T12:17:02Z")
They got white hands White eyes They walk around Tellin’ big white lies They got white noses And tiny white teeth They wear flat white shoes On their nasty white feet ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/49 "2016-04-28T12:50:01Z")
> [@usedtobe](#): > > Another vote for “Why ‘White’?” Is the area 99.9% Black, whch, of course drags down property values? Are the 1950’s alive and well in Detroit? Detroit has suffered for decades from [white flight.](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_flight) In 1950, Detroit was 83% white, 16% black; these days the percentages are pretty much reversed. [This map](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Detroit#/media/File:FischerDetroit2010Census.png) shows the extreme degree of racial segregation in Detroit and its suburbs; each red dot represents 25 white people, each blue dot represents 25 black people, green=Asian, yellow=Hispanic. The sharp blue/red boundary on the north side of town is [8 Mile Road,](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/M-102_(Michigan_highway)) a longstanding cultural and political boundary between urban and suburban Detroit (it was the basis for the name of [Eminem’s movie](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/8_Mile_(film)) some years ago). So yes, white folks moving _back_ into Detroit is notable, although it’s happening more and more in recent years as conditions in the city continue to improve bit by bit. On the question of whether it was a good investment…clearly not. They may be happy right now, but anything that leaves you with a negative net worth in your 40s is a bad idea. The article suggests that the couple could possibly work into their 70s or 80s. Sure, it’s possible, but will they want to? And even if they do, will they be able to? I wouldn’t count on it. My parents’ health began deteriorating in their 70s; they had retired well before then, but even if they hadn’t, there’s no way they could have worked a full-time job for pay in the past seven years or so. Now they’ve moved into an independent-living retirement community - which is expensive - and before long they’re likely to move to an assisted-living facility, which is _insanely_ expensive. Thankfully they didn’t blow their nest egg in their 40s, so they’ll be able to cover the costs themselves. There’s a fair chance the couple being discussed here will have health issues in their golden years that will make work difficult or impossible, and will also make living comfortably very expensive. Like so many other Americans, they may be buying happiness right now at the expense of misery later… ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 1:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/50 "2016-04-28T13:39:48Z")
There are certain phrases that cannot be reasonably combined into one sentence. Among those are [ul][li]Fell in love with[/li][li]Investment, and[/li][li]Detroit[/ul][/li]Others go quite well together, such as [ul][li]lost a previous house to foreclosure[/li][li]grew up poor, and[/li][li]insane.[/ul][/li] Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Broomstick](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/broomstick/32/246_2.png) [@Broomstick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Broomstick)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 1:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/51 "2016-04-28T13:51:31Z")
I’ve known several people (yes, some of them white) who bought properties in Detroit at fire-sale prices and rehabbed them. At least one of them a couple who bought theirs after losing their prior home to foreclosure. All of them put sweat-equity into the place, scrimped and saved and borrowed to replace things like a busted furnance, and wound up with a nicely livable home. The difference between them and the folks in the OP? None of them spent $400k on their projects. They’re much more like the Drew Philp guy in the linked story. The folks I know bought cheap knowing it would take time, money, and effort to repair what they bought, their primary goal was a decent place to live, and they all brought their projects home for under $100k. One difference is that they did most of the work themselves, and didn’t opt for expensive and custom when cheap and mass-produced would work just fine. Maybe they’ll upgrade stuff later, but they were left with no to small debt that they can easily manage AND still save a little for later. When they get too old to maintain the house they’ll be able to sell it and get something out of the deal without still being burdened with massive loans. Buying foreclosed and distressed homes CAN work, and for Detroit it’s a significant way it’s getting people back into the city, but there’s a right way and a wrong way to go about it. ---
**Author:** ![TokyoBayer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tokyobayer/32/13989_2.png) [@TokyoBayer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TokyoBayer)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 1:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/52 "2016-04-28T13:58:47Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > My white sister bought a house in Milwaukee in the 1950s, paid almost as much again over the years for improvements and maintenance, and sold it in the 1990s for less than the original purchase price. **It has something to do with the changing demographics of the neighborhood**. A phenomenon in which the color of the occupants is relevant to the economics of property values, whether it is politically correct to believe that or not. There, I’ve said it. And now i have to be sent off for sensitivity re-programming. You can climb down off your high horse now. You mock those in the thread who have questioned the the motive of pointed out the race of the couple with a story which has absolutely nothing in common with the people in the account. A very weak and silly argument. One has to presume that you didn’t actually bother to read to read the article before giving lectures to those who rightfully pointed out that there was absolutely no need to mention the race of the _purchasers._ Had you read it, you would have seen that the couple purchased the home in 2013, so there were no changing demographics of the neighborhood. That particular neighborhood is 78% black, but it was undoubtedly 78% black in 2013 and will be 78% black in another three years. If you’re going to mock us, then do your homework first. Otherwise, it makes you look a fool. ---
**Author:** ![Doctor\_Jackson](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/doctor_jackson/32/32_2.png) [@Doctor\_Jackson](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Doctor_Jackson)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/53 "2016-04-28T14:14:23Z")
1st rule of investing: ROI cannot be calculated until both the buy and sell portions have been completed. Until both of these happen one only has a potential/theoretical gain or loss. IOW, the OP’s poll cannot be answered at this point. ---
**Author:** ![Zeke\_N.Destroi](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/4af34b/32.png) [@Zeke\_N.Destroi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeke_N.Destroi)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/54 "2016-04-28T14:14:43Z")
> [@Asimovian](#): > > Knock off the personal insults… I can accept that. The only thing I offer in response is that had it been “black couple does something stupid.”, “Gay couple does something stupid.” or anything of the sort the Dopers would have taken to the roofs to decry the racism inherent in the post. I don’t see that racism is a matter of colour but rather a matter of attitude and this certainly - to me - displayed the hallmarks of it. Note received and understood. Behaviour will be amended in accordance. Zeke ---
**Author:** ![Asimovian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asimovian/32/172_2.png) [@Asimovian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Asimovian)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 3:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/55 "2016-04-28T15:21:07Z")
> [@Zeke\_N.Destroi](#): > > I can accept that. > > The only thing I offer in response is that had it been “black couple does something stupid.”, “Gay couple does something stupid.” or anything of the sort the Dopers would have taken to the roofs to decry the racism inherent in the post. > > I don’t see that racism is a matter of colour but rather a matter of attitude and this certainly - to me - displayed the hallmarks of it. > > Note received and understood. Behaviour will be amended in accordance. > > Zeke If you want to discuss details of the particular moderation decision, let’s discuss in ATMB, as I don’t want to sidetrack this any further. But perhaps as a shortcut and general guidance for addressing the issue in this thread, [this might be a helpful reference](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=12332229&postcount=9). ---
**Author:** ![SmellMyWort](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/ea5d25/32.png) [@SmellMyWort](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmellMyWort)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/56 "2016-04-28T15:40:30Z")
This is what watching too much This Old House will get you. ---
**Author:** ![amaguri](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/49beb7/32.png) [@amaguri](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/amaguri)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 3:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/57 "2016-04-28T15:53:35Z")
If you’re buying a house to, you know, live in… then who cares? Not everyone treats their home purely like an investment. ---
**Author:** ![Jackmannii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jackmannii/32/311_2.png) [@Jackmannii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackmannii)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/58 "2016-04-28T15:58:46Z")
Ha ha, white people! Fooled again! I haven’t laughed so much since I read [this story](http://www.capitalgazette.com/bowie_bladenews/ph-ac-bb-black-homes-matter-0211-20150212-story.html) about a black woman who bought a $483,655 home in Maryland. _"Oliver’s home is now valued at $394,600 — despite adding a $16,000 patio._ Man, that’s a knee-slapper. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![UncleRojelio](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/unclerojelio/32/3160_2.png) [@UncleRojelio](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleRojelio)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 5:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/59 "2016-04-28T17:06:41Z")
They gambled $500k. It doesn’t matter whether they gambled it in Detroit or Vegas. They only difference is how long it takes to find out if they won or lost. ---
**Author:** ![Whiskey\_Dickens](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/9fc348/32.png) [@Whiskey\_Dickens](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whiskey_Dickens)\ **Post date:** [April 28, 2016, 5:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281/60 "2016-04-28T17:30:43Z")
Buffalo (next door to me) is in a similar real estate situation. Full of beautiful old houses worth a third or less of what they would go for in a thriving city. I have lots of dreams about doing exactly the same as this couple. Buying a big old house, dumping a shit ton of money into it to restore it to its former glory, and never worrying about the resale value. I voted great investment. But of course I would say all of the above, I’m white. 😛 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-couple-spent-all-their-savings-to-renovate-house-thats-now-worth-100k-less/753281.md?page=4)