# White House announces Russian sanctions. **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [December 29, 2016, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863 "2016-12-29T20:31:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Esox\_Lucius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Esox\_Lucius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esox_Lucius)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 3:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/21 "2016-12-30T03:31:06Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > It’s almost a certainty that he will roll back the sanctions almost immediately upon taking office. Can he do that without Congress? Cause I’m pretty sure Congress, including most Republicans–okay, _some_ Republicans–wouldn’t go along with it. ---
**Author:** ![Kimstu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/ecd19e/32.png) [@Kimstu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kimstu)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 4:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/22 "2016-12-30T04:14:36Z")
> [@HurricaneDitka](#): > > Obama seems to be making a lot of big moves in the waning days of his administration. […] creating huge new national monument in Utah […] Dunno about this one, creating huge new national monuments seems to be pretty much SOP for lame-duck presidents these days. Clinton did the Grand Canyon-Parashant National Monument and the Agua Fria National Monument in Arizona and the California Coastal National Monument in January 2000. Bush designated the Northwestern Hawaiian Islands (largest marine reserve in the world) in June 2006. ---
**Author:** ![Captain\_Amazing](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/6de8d8/32.png) [@Captain\_Amazing](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Captain_Amazing)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 4:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/23 "2016-12-30T04:15:10Z")
> [@Esox\_Lucius](#): > > Can he do that without Congress? Cause I’m pretty sure Congress, including most Republicans–okay, _some_ Republicans–wouldn’t go along with it. Sure, he can. Obama put the sanctions on without Congress. Trump can take them off without Congress. ---
**Author:** ![Euphonious\_Polemic](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/euphonious_polemic/32/3002_2.png) [@Euphonious\_Polemic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Euphonious_Polemic)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 4:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/24 "2016-12-30T04:23:08Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > (all bolding mine) > > Mr. Trump will be unable to credibly lay blame on anyone else’s lap. . Unfortunately, credibility is not meaningful anymore. in two years time, after Trump’s “policies” have led to a complete clusterfuck, Trump will merely have to spew out a tweet that blames Obama, and his people will eat it up with a spoon. It does not have to have an iota of truth, or any factual basis whatsoever; Fox news will repeat it verbatim as if it is completely true, Republican sycophants will fall over themselves to agree with it, and the usual suspects here will twist themselves in knots to give the tweet a covering of “truthiness”. ---
**Author:** ![GIGObuster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gigobuster/32/421_2.png) [@GIGObuster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GIGObuster)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 4:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/25 "2016-12-30T04:27:27Z")
> **[Trump On Russia Sanctions: It’s Time ‘To Move On To Bigger And Better Things’](https://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/trump-response-russian-sanctions)** > > President-elect Donald Trump issued a terse statement Thursday, presumably in response to new actions taken by the Obama administration against Russia for cyberattacks during the presidential campaign. [QUOTE=El Trompo] “It’s time for our country to move on to bigger and better things,” the statement read. “Nevertheless, in the interest of our country and its great people, I will meet with leaders of the intelligence community next week in order to be updated on the facts of this situation.” [/QUOTE] I do think that Obama and the intelligence community were also concerned about the reported lack of preparation Trump is showing by not attending the security briefings. I see the latest as a “Mr. Trump, you better RTFM!!” ---
**Author:** ![Morgenstern](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Morgenstern](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Morgenstern)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 5:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/26 "2016-12-30T05:01:52Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > [Trump On Russia Sanctions: It’s Time ‘To Move On To Bigger And Better Things’ - TPM – Talking Points Memo](http://talkingpointsmemo.com/livewire/trump-response-russian-sanctions) > I do think that Obama and the intelligence community were also concerned about the reported lack of preparation Trump is showing by not attending the security briefings. > > I see the latest as a “Mr. Trump, you better RTFM!!” We are so fucked. Thank Og he has Kellyanne Conway to provide clear and unambiguous counsel to him. Nothing like one dippy blonde counseling another about things they don’t comprehend. ---
**Author:** ![Grumman](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Grumman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grumman)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 5:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/27 "2016-12-30T05:13:26Z")
> [@Esox\_Lucius](#): > > Why you and all Americans aren’t enraged at Trump’s casual dismissal of Russia’s hacking the election is mystifying to those of us who value things like democracy, civil rights, little stuff like that. Democracy benefits from an informed populace. Keeping people in the dark about the dodgy bullshit being done by the front-runner is not helpful, and neither is the effort to mislead people with lines like “Russia’s hacking the election”. ---
**Author:** ![aldiboronti](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9fc348/32.png) [@aldiboronti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/aldiboronti)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 5:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/28 "2016-12-30T05:29:28Z")
Obama sternly announces sanctions. Trump says it’s time to move on. Really what is the point of Obama’s posturings in the dying days of his Presidency? He must know that Trump can, and probably will, reverse them all. Obama is simply humiliating himself. It’s embarrassing to watch. ---
**Author:** ![Esox\_Lucius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Esox\_Lucius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esox_Lucius)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 6:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/29 "2016-12-30T06:02:51Z")
> [@Grumman](#): > > Democracy benefits from an informed populace. Keeping people in the dark about the dodgy bullshit being done by the front-runner is not helpful, and neither is the effort to mislead people with lines like “Russia’s hacking the election”. It’s news to me that America’s intelligence agencies are misleading people. Where did you get that notion? ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/30 "2016-12-30T06:04:10Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > Obama sternly announces sanctions. Trump says it’s time to move on. Really what is the point of Obama’s posturings in the dying days of his Presidency? He must know that Trump can, and probably will, reverse them all. Obama is simply humiliating himself. It’s embarrassing to watch. I think your assessment is incorrect,. Obama has put sanctions on Russia. When Trump reverses them while Russia is being investigated for manipulating our election, it will cost him political capital. When Trump reverses the overtime provisions (assuming they get around the judge’s block) that causes him political capital. When Trump craters the peace talks, it costs him capital. Every little thing Obama can do that Trump has to undo makes Trump flake off supporters, and makes those on the edge about him teeter to dislike. It’s smart. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Mace](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/john_mace/32/185_2.png) [@John\_Mace](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Mace)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 7:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/31 "2016-12-30T07:18:09Z")
> [@Snowboarder\_Bo](#): > > The objective here, IMO, is to place Mr. Trump into a corner from which he cannot escape. It’s almost a certainty that he will roll back the sanctions almost immediately upon taking office. Why is that “almost certain”? What does Trump care? > [@](#): > > At that point, anything that happens is his fault, good or bad. Mr. Trump will be unable to credibly lay blame on anyone else’s lap. President Obama is setting him up so that there can be no denying that Mr. Trump’s actions are responsible for whatever happens regarding Russia during the next 4 years. > > This is baiting a trap and playing the long game, IMO. Even if he did, why would anything Russia did suddenly be Trump’s fault? Besides, Russia is more likely to take action against US interests while the sanctions are in place than when they are not. More to the point, though, if Obama is using sanctions against Russia in order to play a political gam against Trump, then that makes Obama worse than Trump in this instance. I, for one, don’t think Obama is worse than Trump. YMMV. ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 7:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/32 "2016-12-30T07:25:25Z")
> [@aldiboronti](#): > > Obama sternly announces sanctions. Trump says it’s time to move on. Really what is the point of Obama’s posturings in the dying days of his Presidency? He must know that Trump can, and probably will, reverse them all. Obama is simply humiliating himself. It’s embarrassing to watch. cos you know, he is President of the USA and it’s his job. Are you in favour of leaders of other countries running amok because an 8-year President is leaving office soon? ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 7:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/33 "2016-12-30T07:28:03Z")
> [@Esox\_Lucius](#): > > It’s news to me that America’s intelligence agencies are misleading people. Where did you get that notion? Riiiigt: paging Colin Powell. Has any evidence come forth in relation to this “hacking” or is it one of those GWB situations where they’d like to show you but just can’t? ---
**Author:** ![Gukumatz](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/74df32/32.png) [@Gukumatz](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gukumatz)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 8:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/34 "2016-12-30T08:47:42Z")
Eh. Political tripwire for Trump. The more stuff Trump ignores in favour of cultivating US - Russian relations (or Trump-Rubel relations) the deeper in it Trump’s going to be if Putin decides to emasculate him by pulling another stunt. Like another Crimea. Transnistria, maybe. (Moldova’s UN, but not NATO. So another middle finger to the international community while still not actually crossing any thick red lines.) Since bizarrely the Dems are now the anti-Russia party in the US (when did that happen?), the deeper “Trump luuuvs Russia” is engrained in the electorate the greater the potential fall. It might not stick. There may be no fall. But there’s really no cost to Obama in heaping it on real thick so Trump can’t wiggle out of it, while he still can. So what the hell, right? I expect the real deterrents are happening on another wavelength. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 10:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/35 "2016-12-30T10:33:49Z")
Inaguration Day is going to be embarrasing to watch. Trump is now open to being “updated on the facts”. "President-elect [Donald J. Trump](http://www.nytimes.com/topic/person/donald-trump?inline=nyt-per) edged away on Thursday from his dismissive stance on American assessments of Russian hacking, saying he would meet with intelligence officials next week “to be updated on the facts” after the Obama administration [announced sanctions against Moscow](https://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/29/us/politics/russia-election-hacking-sanctions.html). " [http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/29/us…hack.html?\_r=0](http://www.nytimes.com/2016/12/29/us/politics/donald-trump-russia-hack.html?_r=0) ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 10:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/36 "2016-12-30T10:57:13Z")
> [@Esox\_Lucius](#): > > The objective is to punish Russia without giving Putin an excuse to retaliate forcefully against American allies in Europe, that is, by the U.S. _not_ using force to begin with. If Trump is caught in the middle because he aligned himself with Russia, that’s his problem, not America’s. > > Why you and all Americans aren’t enraged at Trump’s casual dismissal of Russia’s hacking the election is mystifying to those of us who value things like democracy, civil rights, little stuff like that. In the name of global stability, there’s absolutely no reason for the U.S. to abandon its European allies for a psychopathic murderer. If that happens, you can flush Europe down the toilet. Putin will be all over it like flies on a corpse because, as ordained by God Hisself, [del]Putin’s[/del] Russia’s destiny is to rule the world, just like other psychopaths before him. > > In the name of personal enrichment with no regard for little folk like you and me, though, it makes perfect sense for the man who acts on behalf of oligarchs in Russia to join forces with the man who acts on behalf of wannabe oligarchs in the U.S. You should be thankful that Obama has the requisite testosterone and brains to do something about it while he still can. Russia doesn’t want to rule the world; however, it does want to feel secure in its ability to defend its political and economic interests. America’s behavior, with its meddling in the elections and political affairs of numerous other countries, its invasions or “interventions” in various parts of the world, and putting heavy military machinery on Russia’s doorstep has done little to allay Russia’s post-Cold War concerns that the US wants to dominate Russia the way it has attempted to dominate its other adversaries. The United States foreign policy playbook has become pretty predictable – America encircles Russia and attempts to take control of Arab oil and Afghanistan pipelines while trying to break Iran and cut them out of the oil game altogether until they completely lay prostrate before the US. This situation will escalate and become dire until there is meaningful dialogue and discussion about what Russia really wants, which is not global empire, as you say, but absolute protection of its political and other interests. ---
**Author:** ![even\_sven](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/dfb087/32.png) [@even\_sven](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/even_sven)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 12:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/37 "2016-12-30T12:11:58Z")
RN ---
**Author:** ![Grrr](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grrr/32/146_2.png) [@Grrr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Grrr)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 1:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/38 "2016-12-30T13:54:43Z")
I’m with **Bo**. I think Obama is trolling Trump with this move. (And it’s awesome) ---
**Author:** ![up\_the\_junction](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/f1d935/32.png) [@up\_the\_junction](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/up_the_junction)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 2:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/39 "2016-12-30T14:29:36Z")
I love that Putin’s reaction is ‘yeah,whatever’. ---
**Author:** ![Esox\_Lucius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/848f3c/32.png) [@Esox\_Lucius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Esox_Lucius)\ **Post date:** [December 30, 2016, 2:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863/40 "2016-12-30T14:32:25Z")
> [@up\_the\_junction](#): > > Riiiigt: paging Colin Powell. > > Has any evidence come forth in relation to this “hacking” or is it one of those GWB situations where they’d like to show you but just can’t? IIRC, the Bush administration did the misleading, not the CIA, which you seem to acknowledge by mentioning Powell and not the CIA. If you think Obama is deliberately misleading everyone, there’s this from WaPo: [“FBI in agreement with CIA that Russia aimed to help Trump win White House”](https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/clinton-blames-putins-personal-grudge-against-her-for-election-interference/2016/12/16/12f36250-c3be-11e6-8422-eac61c0ef74d_story.html) [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-announces-russian-sanctions/775863.md?page=3)