# White House: Mission Accomplished **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [October 29, 2003, 5:28am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183 "2003-10-29T05:28:36Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![gobear](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/8dc957/32.png) [@gobear](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/gobear)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/41 "2003-10-30T16:51:57Z")
**Ec** This is 2003. It is far to late and utterly pointless to continue to bitch about the 2000 election, however right you might be. Focus on 2004, or get used to four more years of Shrub and his cabal. ---
**Author:** ![Otto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/bbe5ce/32.png) [@Otto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Otto)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/42 "2003-10-30T17:08:34Z")
> [@](#): > > I agree it’s ONE of the reasons. But one of the OTHER major reasons is that they present a united front. They do not attack one another. Often referred to as Ronald Reagan’s “Eleventh Commandment” - “Thou Shalt Not Attack Fellow Republicans.” > [@](#): > > This is 2003. It is far to late and utterly pointless to continue to bitch about the 2000 election, however right you might be. First off, welcome back **gobear**! This is the first I’ve seen you back so if you’ve been around for a while I’m sorry I missed you. Hope everything is going well for you. Second, I disagree to an extent that it is too late and without point to keep alive the memory of the 2000 elections. A full rehash of the events is probably not going to be helpful but remembering some aspects of it (say, the mass purging of voter rolls) will I think be useful in motivating certain segments of the Democratic base. While there may not be a direct effect on Bush vis-a-vis his campaign strategy, I have no problem at all with holding to the fire the feet of the future Kathy Harrises of the country so they know their actions are being carefully scrutinized. ---
**Author:** ![Andros\_X](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/49beb7/32.png) [@Andros\_X](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andros_X)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 5:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/43 "2003-10-30T17:20:12Z")
> [@](#): > > Every fucking issue under the sun on those marching banners and not a clue as to how to present a coherent, point-by-point opposition to the war itself; then was not the time to “demand” a Palestinian State or freedom for one-legged, eco-aware, Manchurian lesbians. I would have to agree that the protest movement, at times, seems unfocused. I imagine that part of this is because a lot of protesters believe that different issues are relevant, and should, therefore, be advertised; you will often see protests focusing on issues in the Middle East or Latin America. What also happens is that organizers of protest groups do not like to turn people away. Thus, you get protests with large numbers of people (always a good thing in the organizers’ view), but then you get people talking about many different issues at once. The movement needs to work on that. I will say, however, that this lack of focus is less common in non-national protests. Local protests are a lot better at this. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/44 "2003-10-30T18:12:37Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Evil Captor \* > \*\*Fuck you, too. There’s plenty of solid evidence that Bush stole the election. I’m sure the Pubbie partisans would like to be able to characterize everyone who has issues with the way the 2000 election was conducted as loons, but it won’t wash, asshole. \*\* The point, which whooshed right through your head, is that there is plenty of shit on Bush to lament about, without bring up that tired old 3-year-old chestnut. Even if it was proved, what the fuck are they going to do, immediately replace him with Gore? Who gives a shit? Let’s concentrate on getting Bush the fuck out of office, and let the past be the past. ---
**Author:** ![Sofa\_King](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/58956e/32.png) [@Sofa\_King](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sofa_King)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 6:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/45 "2003-10-30T18:49:42Z")
[2004 Republican] I’m sorry, but I don’t understand. What does any of this have to do with gay marriage, gay marriage, gay marriage, gay marriage? [/2004 Republican] ---
**Author:** ![rjung](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/45deac/32.png) [@rjung](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rjung)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 7:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/46 "2003-10-30T19:11:58Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Cervaise \* > I’m wondering, just how ballsy are these people going to get before the electorate starts to notice? Why do you think Bush is busy building up a projected, unprecedented, $450 million re-election war chest? You can buy a **lot** of bullstuff with $450 mil… ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/47 "2003-10-30T19:20:34Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by rjung \* > \*\*Why do you think Bush is busy building up a projected, unprecedented, $450 million re-election war chest? > > You can buy a **lot** of bullstuff with $450 mil… \*\* A sad reflection on the state of this country if you ask me. ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/48 "2003-10-30T19:28:10Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Mr. Moto \* > \*\*I gotta warn the more strident of you Bush haters, that harping on eighteen words is well into stark raving loony territory, and will just chase voters away. \*\* **7 months pass** **Dan Rather:** The president concluded his press conference today by stating that “Jesus told me not to tax the rich.” **Mr. Moto:** Fucking loony-ass liberals! All you can do is harp on 25 words! You’re just gonna chase the voters away! \*\*Meanwhile, in the present: \*\* Dude. The ratio of words contested to total words spoken is _completely irrelevant_. You can express very powerful and controversial ideas with few words… ---
**Author:** ![\_possum\_stalker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/_/b77776/32.png) [@\_possum\_stalker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/_possum_stalker)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 7:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/49 "2003-10-30T19:30:15Z")
[Can’t resist throwing this into the mix](http://www.villagevoice.com/issues/0341/sutton.php) ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/50 "2003-10-30T19:50:49Z")
Probably right too, 'possum. ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 7:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/51 "2003-10-30T19:57:05Z")
That would be 26 words, **Metacom**. The ratio is irrelevant, I agree. But the Democrats have got to come up with some suggestions of their own on how to improve our security situation, rather than just criticizing someone else’s plan. ---
**Author:** ![Hyperelastic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a3d4f5/32.png) [@Hyperelastic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hyperelastic)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/52 "2003-10-30T20:05:50Z")
Whoa…whoa. I thought the dustup over “Mission Accomplished” was that Bush said the sailors made the poster whereas there was some evidence that his flacks made it. The whole notion that the Mission had really been Accomplished was discredited a long time ago, which is why he is trying to distance himself from the poster to begin with. If the sailors really did come up with the idea for the poster, and the White House merely printed it (and I’m not saying that’s what happened, but I haven’t seen anyone contradict it), wouldn’t that give Bush a legitimate excuse for blaming the poster on the sailors? Blaming it on the sailors may be piss-poor leadership and craven cowardice in the face of criticism, but factually, the guy may be right. Disclaimer: When Dean whups the tar out of Bush in 2004, I’ll be beating the bass drum in the victory parade. Hey **Mr. Moto** , I checked some of the Dems’ websites for positive ideas on security, and I found a lot of detailed proposals. You might not agree with them, and the press, or the candidates themselves, may not be getting the word out, but it’s not quite fair to say that they are only criticizing and not trying to fix the problem. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/53 "2003-10-30T20:06:03Z")
**MM** , if you don’t think there are other approaches being vigorously discussed and asserted, you’re not paying attention at all. Hell, that’s obvious from your thinking the Bush lies and delusions were only about uranium from Niger. ---
**Author:** ![ElvisL1ves](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@ElvisL1ves](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ElvisL1ves)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 8:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/54 "2003-10-30T20:14:52Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by Hyperelastic \* > If the sailors really did come up with the idea for the poster, and the White House merely printed it (and I’m not saying that’s what happened, but I haven’t seen anyone contradict it), wouldn’t that give Bush a legitimate excuse for blaming the poster on the sailors? No. Bush’s White House printed it, and stage-directed the photo op to show it prominently. He gratefully adopted it as his own. It depends on what the meaning of “accomplished” is, right? ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 8:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/55 "2003-10-30T20:32:01Z")
**Evil** sweetie - you obviously missed in my post that **I** didn’t call you a ‘loon’, just suggested that pulling in a totally unrelated comment into the mix (even if it’s true, but especially in this case, since the opposition contends that it’s false), **allows _them_** (note word choice “them” not us, **them** ) to write your entire point off as coming from a loon. For example - If I’m having a discussion w/ a coworker about how to best deal with a particular project, and while we’re arguing point/counterpoint about that project, they suddenly interject with “and 3 years ago, when **you** misfiled that paper, that was really fucked up” (when I believe that I didn’t misfile the paper, they had mislabeled the file), I can immediately write them off as some one who cannot put together a logical, coherant position, therefore pretty much any suggestion won’t be given much consideration. But, if you feel righteous in allowing any potential points you’re making to be immediately dismissed, I’m sure there’s some thread around where you can scream “Chad Chad Chad” and they’ll counter with “Perjury **PLUS** blowjob”. While it may be fun for the rest of us to watch, I suspect nothing more productive than shouting past each other will result. **xeno** - good to see you! have some Chablis? ---
**Author:** ![Tars\_Tarkas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Tars\_Tarkas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tars_Tarkas)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/56 "2003-10-30T20:34:38Z")
No, there is an “is” in M **is** sion, so that is what is causing the confusion! ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/57 "2003-10-30T20:56:23Z")
Anyone who doesn’t believe that was one of the most meticulously choreographed photo OPs in modern times is a fucking idiot. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [October 30, 2003, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/58 "2003-10-30T21:36:39Z")
Don’t worry, **Mr. Moto** , we’ve been raking Bush & Co. over the coals for their numerous lies this past several months. The 18 words you mention hardly begins to cover it. Where have you been? ---
**Author:** ![Mr.Moto](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/9de0a6/32.png) [@Mr.Moto](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mr.Moto)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/59 "2003-10-31T00:58:40Z")
Oh, I’ve been around. But what some people consider to be cosmic lying seems to me nitpicking over small points of rhetoric that in the long run don’t really matter. The current administration isn’t perfect, and it would be foolish to expect it to be. But it is a model of good government compared to the Clinton administration, and it is trying to address out pressing national security needs instead of sweeping them under the rug. Someone mentioned North Korea. We had Madeline Allbright over there several years ago sipping wine with Kim Jong-Il and agreeing to give them food aid and oil, while knowing that not only had Kim pursued nukes in the past, he was doing so then and would do so in the future even as the Clinton administration insisted in public that they weren’t Compared to this, “Mission Accomplished” arguments really are nitpicking. ---
**Author:** ![Desmostylus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c57346/32.png) [@Desmostylus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Desmostylus)\ **Post date:** [October 31, 2003, 1:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183/60 "2003-10-31T01:17:03Z")
**Mr. Moto** ’s right. North Korea demanded urgent attention. That’s precisely why Bush decided to _do_ something about it, and invade Iraq. So what if they’re two entirely different countries? That’s just nitpicking again. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-mission-accomplished/210183.md?page=4)