# White House wants to shut down London/ ban all protesting during Bush visit. **URL:** \ **Category:** The BBQ Pit\ **Created:** [November 10, 2003, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426 "2003-11-10T17:17:20Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/1 "2003-11-10T17:17:20Z")
[Scotland Yard](http://www.thisislondon.com/til/jsp/modules/Article/print.jsp?itemId=7602147) seems to be pretty annoyed at a list of arrogant, paranoid, controlling, fascistic, thin-skinned demands being made by the White House for Shrubby’s upcoming UK visit. > [@](#): > > White House security demands covering President George Bush’s controversial state visit to Britain have provoked a serious row with Scotland Yard. > > American officials want a virtual three-day shutdown of central London in a bid to foil disruption of the visit by anti-war protestors. They are demanding that police ban all marches and seal off the city centre. The Bushies are hiding behind “security” issues as an excuse, of course but it’s perfectly clear that the real reason is that they don’t want any protesters to be seen on television cameras. In the US they already routinely herd protesters away from cameras and out of ear and eye shot of Dumbya in flagrant disregard of the First Amendment. Now they think they have the right to stomp on protesters in other countries as well. UK posters, please tell me that you won’t cave in to this bullshit. Please tell me that the WH will not be sucessful in pursuing its Gestappo-like agenda. Please tell me that protesters will be hounding this little shit from the moment he steps off the plane until the moment he leaves. Please do not let your government accommodate a controlled, three-day PR event for the White House. Don’t let this little fucker, Bush (or more likely, Rove) tell you what you do and do not have the right to say in your own country or whwere you may or may not go in your own city. Start making those “Fuck Bush” signs right now. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/2 "2003-11-10T17:52:47Z")
If we don’t vote that fuck out, we only have ourselves to blame. ---
**Author:** ![SmackFu](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/53a042/32.png) [@SmackFu](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SmackFu)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/3 "2003-11-10T17:53:13Z")
Hey, there’s an episode of “Spooks” that has this plotline. ---
**Author:** ![owlstretchingtime](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/o/958977/32.png) [@owlstretchingtime](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/owlstretchingtime)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 6:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/4 "2003-11-10T18:00:47Z")
If you want to close down London all you have to do is threaten any single union staff member on the tube. That’ll do it. Snow has the same effect. Bush has been told to away and boil his head. We don’t have a gun cultuire here so the proximity of people who don’t like you is not _THAT_ dangerous. There will be demonstrations (the usual SWP wankers), but then there always are. The police are used to dealing with them. ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 6:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/5 "2003-11-10T18:07:38Z")
Jezuz, what a load of transparent crap. If assassination was their real concern, then whatever useless thing it is that Bush is scheduled to do, it could be done from inside a secure location. There’s no need to expose Bush to anything public. This is quite frightening, given the Bush administration’s poor judgment shown on other matters: > [@](#): > > But the Met and the US Secret Service have reportedly agreed “rules of engagement” allowing Bush bodyguards to shoot anyone they believe is clearly threatening the life of the President. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/6 "2003-11-10T18:16:34Z")
I guess they’ll be shooting “the truth” any moment now. ---
**Author:** ![TaxGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b19c9b/32.png) [@TaxGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TaxGuy)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/7 "2003-11-10T18:21:47Z")
Do not feed the **Reeder**. Oh wait . . . That article reads more like a gossip piece than a news piece. Unclebeer, you’re a fucking retard, too, by the way, if you take that quote to mean that the US Secret Service has free reign to shoot whoever they want to with no repercussions and no responsibility on their (or the US’s) part. It doesn’t say that, and anyone not jaded by their extreme hatred of Bush would realize that such an arragement is completely impossible. The quote is probably more about divvying up responsibility between US and UK security forces. ---
**Author:** ![World\_Eater](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f04885/32.png) [@World\_Eater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/World_Eater)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 6:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/8 "2003-11-10T18:31:42Z")
Hey **Taxguy** , why don’t you see if you can make as dramatic a splash leaving a thread as you can entering one. Sound like a good idea? ---
**Author:** ![Metacom](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ecae2f/32.png) [@Metacom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Metacom)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/9 "2003-11-10T18:41:01Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by TaxGuy \* > **Unclebeer, you’re a fucking retard, too, by the way, if you take that quote to mean that the US Secret Service has free reign to shoot whoever they want to with no repercussions and no responsibility on their (or the US’s) part.** Yeah! Stupid **UncleBeer**! Bush would _never_ consider himself or his administration above the law, and has a solid track record of respecting the civil rights–_especially_ the civil rights of foreign nationals! The man’s virtually a paragon of liberty: Under the Bush administration, no one has ever been held without trial, tried in a secret court, refused access to council, shipped off to another country to be tortured, or anything else bad like that! Does anyone else envision the episodes of South Park where Jimbo and Ned were out hunting? “Look, Ned, it’s coming right for us!” Now put Jimbo and Ned in suits and replace the deer and bunny rabbits with suspicious looking Arabs 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![UncleBeer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/977dab/32.png) [@UncleBeer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UncleBeer)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 6:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/10 "2003-11-10T18:46:34Z")
Well, that’s not exactly what I mean, TaxGuy, but thanks for the vote of confidence in my reasoning ability. Only a hyper-reactionary jerk would entertain even a fleeting notion that _anyone_ believed what you ask if I do. I merely think it exceedingly stupid to permit a group of men, armed with automatic weapons, to be permitted to fire into large crowds of innocent people under **any** circumstances. > [@](#): > > It doesn’t say that, and anyone not jaded by their extreme hatred of Bush would realize that such an arragement is completely impossible. Indeed; it does not say that. Nor did I claim that it did. What then, explains your knee-jerk assumption that I might believe such a thing possible? > [@](#): > > The quote is probably more about divvying up responsibility between US and UK security forces. Possibly. But then it does say “Rules of _Engagement_.” Which, from a military standpoint, are the rules governing conduct of the participants in an action. Rules of Engagment are most certainly **not** administrative in nature. And that article reads more like an _editorial_ than a gossip piece to me. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 6:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/11 "2003-11-10T18:56:35Z")
It still sounds scary, **Taxguy**. It’s also a little fuzzy on what constitutes “threatening the life of the president,” don’t you think? I notice you haven’t really addressed the substance of the piece other than to dismiss it as “gossip.” Do you think it’s acceptable for the WH to demand that all marching be banned and that all access to Central london should be shut down? Do you really think it’s all about “security,” especially given the dubious tactics which have been employed against peaceful protesters in the US and the Bushitas’ almost psychotic need to control any and every aspect of Bush’s public appearances. These are the same people who ordered that the USS Lincoln be turned around before Bush’s flight suit stunt so that the San Diego shoreline would not be visible to televison cameras (this exposing the charade that the tailhook landing was somehow necessary because the carrier was too far off shore for a helicopter landing). There was no “security” reason for that, it was done purely to filter out an image which might be politically embarrassing. Why should we believe that the WH demands _vis-a-vis_ the London visit are any different? ---
**Author:** ![lno](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/a8b319/32.png) [@lno](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lno)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 6:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/12 "2003-11-10T18:59:39Z")
> [@](#): > > White House officials have already vetoed the traditional drive in an open carriage along the Mall. They fear it would make Mr Bush too vulnerable to attack or confrontations over British support for the US in Iraq. God forbid someone present a contrary opinion to him. ---
**Author:** ![London\_Calling](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/49beb7/32.png) [@London\_Calling](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/London_Calling)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/13 "2003-11-10T19:05:21Z")
A State Visit from the president of the US at a time like this . . . honestly, it’s going to be chaos. It’s not gossip, it’s an interview with the Met Commissioner. He’s the Police boss man in London. I hestitate to say it but I fear it could be like the last [Poll Tax riots.](http://www.caliach.com/paulr/news/polltax/)Dear oh dear, I just wish he’d go away . . . for a very long time. ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/14 "2003-11-10T19:09:33Z")
By Golly, \*\*Ino]/b], I think you’re on to something! A _faith-based_ protection! The Sacred Service! Just imagine the political impact if, like, a whole wad of left wankers is marching in protest and _whamm-o_ - they are smitten with boils and a plague of frogs and all thier first born turn gay, or something! Would certainly give me a moment of pause to consider my political opinions vis-a-vis Divine Will! ---
**Author:** ![wring](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/838e76/32.png) [@wring](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wring)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 7:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/15 "2003-11-10T19:12:38Z")
sorry, I’m just cowering over in the corner at the _very idea_ of some one using such a razor sharp quip as “you’re a fucking retard”. Oooooh. the pit is a very very scarey place! ---
**Author:** ![jayjay](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jayjay/32/6765_2.png) [@jayjay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jayjay)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 7:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/16 "2003-11-10T19:17:56Z")
> [@](#): > > \*Originally posted by London\_Calling \* > \*\*Dear oh dear, I just wish he’d go away . . . for a very long time. \*\* So do we, **London\_Calling** , so do we… ---
**Author:** ![elucidator](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/8edcca/32.png) [@elucidator](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elucidator)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 7:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/17 "2003-11-10T19:20:16Z")
Still plenty of room in the corn field… ---
**Author:** ![dantheman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dantheman/32/9421_2.png) [@dantheman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dantheman)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/18 "2003-11-10T19:26:25Z")
I think they want to prevent hooliganism. You saw what happened to David Blaine! Why, they’re just being far-sighted. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/19 "2003-11-10T19:35:15Z")
These sorts of unreasonable demands are not new. When Clinton came to Uganda, the country was asked to suspend all commercial flights within eight hours of his approach and departure. Yeah, right… ---
**Author:** ![Larry\_Mudd](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/f14d63/32.png) [@Larry\_Mudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Larry_Mudd)\ **Post date:** [November 10, 2003, 7:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426/20 "2003-11-10T19:35:45Z")
> [@](#): > > But the Met and the US Secret Service have reportedly agreed “rules of engagement” allowing Bush bodyguards to shoot anyone they believe is clearly threatening the life of the President. The PMO made the same allowances for the President’s security during the APEC conference in Vancouver in 1998. Oh, wait, that was [President _Suharto_](http://www.tv.cbc.ca/newsinreview/nov98/apec/)… > [@](#): > > The RCMP knew the UBC site could present security problems. They also became increasingly concerned about some of the security measures being implemented in Canada by the staff of visiting dignitaries, most notably the armed bodyguards of President Suharto of Indonesia. As a result, the force with which the RCMP subsequently carried out its security duties on November 25, 1997, became headline news. Many regarded the officers’ actions as unwarranted. Almost 50 protestors were arrested, and scores of people were pepper-sprayed, including a television cameraman. The protestors say the force was excessive; the RCMP say it was necessary because of the difficulty in securing the site and the need to protect the protestors themselves from possible violence at the hands of the armed Indonesian bodyguards who had hinted they would shoot anyone who got too close to Suharto. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-house-wants-to-shut-down-london-ban-all-protesting-during-bush-visit/212426.md?page=2)