# White Privilage **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 9, 2018, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511 "2018-02-09T14:26:57Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/21 "2018-02-09T15:16:01Z")
> [@thatbpguy](#): > > Yes, I am a Saltine American. > > My understanding is that in the highest echelons of Fortune 500 companies non whites are still not making headway, but non whites have 100% equal opportunity in education and trade work, starting businesses… I can make a case that non whites and women now have a better chance of obtaining jobs. We see more non white males in politics, government jobs… > > I have been turned down flat for 2 jobs and was told straight up it is because I’m a white male. So I think non white males have excellent opportunity now. It’s just a matter of taking advantage of it. Underline added. Really, you think it’s 100% equal out there? That’s like saying 100% of white men making over $100,000 per year are Republican. I like hearing people get all fired up and say extreme things, but that doesn’t mean we have to believe everything we hear. And you know what? I’m sure I didn’t get into some schools that would have taken me if I wasn’t a white male. Harvard Law School, for example. But (partly) because I’m a white male, I had lots of other options and came out on top. White Privilege in action. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/22 "2018-02-09T15:16:31Z")
> [@thatbpguy](#): > > Yes, I am a Saltine American. > > My understanding is that in the highest echelons of Fortune 500 companies non whites are still not making headway, but non whites have 100% equal opportunity in education and trade work, starting businesses… I can make a case that non whites and women now have a better chance of obtaining jobs. We see more non white males in politics, government jobs… > > I have been turned down flat for 2 jobs and was told straight up it is because I’m a white male. So I think non white males have excellent opportunity now. It’s just a matter of taking advantage of it. Okay, I think that’s an incredibly weak case, based on nothing more than anecdotal evidence. Here’s some contrary evidence: > **[Are Emily and Greg More Employable Than Lakisha and Jamal? A Field Experiment...](https://www.aeaweb.org/articles?id=10.1257%2F0002828042002561)** > > (September 2004) - We study race in the labor market by sending fictitious resumes to help-wanted ads in Boston and Chicago newspapers. To manipulate perceived race, resumes are randomly assigned African-American- or White-sounding names. White names... This study in 2004 found that names more associated with white Americans got more callbacks for job interviews than names associated with black Americans with identical qualifications. > **[Discrimination in the Credential Society: An Audit Study of Race and College...](https://academic.oup.com/sf/article-abstract/93/4/1451/2332119?redirectedFrom=fulltext)** > > Abstract. Racial inequality in economic outcomes, particularly among the college educated, persists throughout US society. Scholars debate whether this ine This one found that black graduates of prestigious schools like Harvard had about the same chance of getting job interviews as white graduates of state schools like UMass Amherst. ---
**Author:** ![thatbpguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/258eb7/32.png) [@thatbpguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thatbpguy)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 3:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/23 "2018-02-09T15:23:59Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Underline added. Really, you think it’s 100% equal out there? That’s like saying 100% of white men making over $100,000 per year are Republican. I like hearing people get all fired up and say extreme things, but that doesn’t mean we have to believe everything we hear. > > And you know what? I’m sure I didn’t get into some schools that would have taken me if I wasn’t a white male. Harvard Law School, for example. But (partly) because I’m a white male, I had lots of other options and came out on top. White Privilege in action. I will disagree, respectfully. Getting into a trade school or university is now “governed” by ability and meeting standards- not the color of ones skin. Those days are past. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 3:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/24 "2018-02-09T15:29:58Z")
> [@thatbpguy](#): > > I will disagree, respectfully. > > Getting into a trade school or university is now “governed” by ability and meeting standards- not the color of ones skin. Those days are past. Depends on the school I guess. I was a member of a University Board of Trustees for about 10 years (2006-2016) We certainly encouraged the admissions staff to seek a diverse student body. For most institutions, more applicants “meet standards” then they have room for, so choices have to be made. ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 3:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/25 "2018-02-09T15:31:07Z")
> [@thatbpguy](#): > > I will disagree, respectfully. > > Getting into a trade school or university is now “governed” by ability and meeting standards- not the color of ones skin. Those days are past. Life doesn’t begin at 18, with a college application. Those 18 years are filled with racial disparities in poverty rates, school quality, and de facto segregation. Not everyone gets the same chance to develop abilities and meet standards. ---
**Author:** ![thatbpguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/258eb7/32.png) [@thatbpguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thatbpguy)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 3:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/26 "2018-02-09T15:43:54Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Okay, I think that’s an incredibly weak case, based on nothing more than anecdotal evidence. > > Here’s some contrary evidence: > > [Are Emily and Greg More Employable Than Lakisha and Jamal? A Field Experiment on Labor Market Discrimination - American Economic Association](https://www.aeaweb.org/articles?id=10.1257/0002828042002561) > > This study in 2004 found that names more associated with white Americans got more callbacks for job interviews than names associated with black Americans with identical qualifications. Interesting. I would be more inclined to think names wouldn’t be a barrier for black/white. but more so for people with religious names. As a side note, I talked to a couple of non white males today at work (in fact, just now) and they tell me that anyone, regardless of race, who is willing to work for what they want in this country, can achieve it. You just have to make a choice between working for it or not. ---
**Author:** ![thatbpguy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/258eb7/32.png) [@thatbpguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thatbpguy)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 3:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/27 "2018-02-09T15:44:56Z")
> [@Human\_Action](#): > > Life doesn’t begin at 18, with a college application. Those 18 years are filled with racial disparities in poverty rates, school quality, and de facto segregation. Not everyone gets the same chance to develop abilities and meet standards. They do if they are willing to work for it. ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/28 "2018-02-09T15:45:50Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > Depends on the school I guess. I was a member of a University Board of Trustees for about 10 years (2006-2016) We certainly encouraged the admissions staff to seek a diverse student body. For most institutions, more applicants “meet standards” then they have room for, so choices have to be made. Whoosh ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/29 "2018-02-09T15:47:13Z")
> [@thatbpguy](#): > > I will disagree, respectfully. > > Getting into a trade school or university is now “governed” by ability and meeting standards- not the color of ones skin. Those days are past. Do you have actual countrywide statistical evidence of this, not just your own personal opinion or the couple of guys you talked to? That’s been much of the challenge in recent years. People - especially whites who are used to privilege - use their own experiences to judge how much change is happening. And they are apt to run those through a filter: every boost for people of color is noticed while any similar advantage for whites is ignored. And they assume a zero sum game, that it’s not possible that whites and others can both simultaneously increase. When people of color shout about the thousands of ways they are still slighted in their everyday lives they should be taken seriously. It’s natural to want to disbelieve, because of the onus that puts on one’s self, but the reality of white privilege, whether or not it’s finally on decline, is overwhelmingly true. Complaints by people of color should be thought of as a MeToo movement that’s been going on for decades. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 3:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/30 "2018-02-09T15:47:21Z")
> [@thatbpguy](#): > > They do if they are willing to work for it. So your position is that the current disparities in income and quality of life between different groups primarily reflect that minorities are generally lazier than white people? Why do you think that is? ---
**Author:** ![Human\_Action](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/ac91a4/32.png) [@Human\_Action](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Human_Action)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 3:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/31 "2018-02-09T15:48:07Z")
> [@thatbpguy](#): > > They do if they are willing to work for it. Even if that’s true, if the non-whites have to work much harder and overcome more obstacles than whites, then that’s not equal opportunity, is it? ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/32 "2018-02-09T16:03:39Z")
> [@thatbpguy](#): > > As a side note, I talked to a couple of non white males today at work (in fact, just now) and they tell me that anyone, regardless of race, who is willing to work for what they want in this country, can achieve it. You just have to make a choice between working for it or not. This, and your description of the contents of her talk and the resulting response from the audience makes me want to see some sort of confirmation of your version of what went down. I have read her poetry and some articles by her (for example [this article from NY Times Magazine](https://www.nytimes.com/2015/06/22/magazine/the-condition-of-black-life-is-one-of-mourning.html?_r=0)) and I have never read anything by her that was as blunt as what you have described. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/33 "2018-02-09T16:43:10Z")
> [@thatbpguy](#): > > She stated that children of mixed parents are ashamed of the black parent and love the white parent more, yet couldn’t bring themselves to establish a relationship with them as they are white. Perhaps she is speaking from personal experience here, rather than statistically. AFAICT her husband is white, and she has a daughter, although I can’t find out if it was with her husband or someone else. But maybe that is her experience. > [@](#): > > Her final part was that during the Obama administration more white males committed suicide than in any prior Presidential administration and this was due to an inability to live with a black as President. She hoped the trend would continue. Good thing she is a poet rather than a statistician. > [@](#): > > The suicide rate for middle-aged women, ages 45 to 64, jumped by 63 percent over the period of the study, while it rose by 43 percent for men in that age range, the sharpest increase for males of any age. The overall suicide rate rose by 24 percent from 1999 to 2014, according to the National Center for Health Statistics, which released the study on Friday. [Cite](https://www.nytimes.com/2016/04/22/health/us-suicide-rate-surges-to-a-30-year-high.html). Notice that the trend upward started from a historic low in 1999. I don’t recall any black Presidents then. Left-wing fruitcake blames everything on white supremacy. Film at eleven. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![puddleglum](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/puddleglum/32/137_2.png) [@puddleglum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/puddleglum)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/34 "2018-02-09T16:43:19Z")
White privilege is a motte and bailey argument. There is majoritarian advantage. More products are made for right handers than left hander, for gentiles than jews, and for whites than blacks. That is just the result of numbers. However, that does not mean that white people get all the opportunity or that it is a huge advantage to live a good life. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/35 "2018-02-09T17:03:05Z")
> [@thatbpguy](#): > > Interesting. I would be more inclined to think names wouldn’t be a barrier for black/white. but more so for people with religious names. > > As a side note, I talked to a couple of non white males today at work (in fact, just now) and they tell me that anyone, regardless of race, who is willing to work for what they want in this country, can achieve it. You just have to make a choice between working for it or not. More anecdotal evidence. Just as convincing as if I said that I happened to speak to 74 thousand non-white people and they all agreed that there are, in fact, differences in opportunity based on race and other factors unrelated to merit. ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 5:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/36 "2018-02-09T17:10:57Z")
I believe very firmly that 1. White privilege is real, it is a problem, it needs to be corrected, and we have a long way to go, and 1. Democrats do a disservice to our cause by talking about it too much. _Work_ behind the scenes to level the playing field. Don’t _talk_ so much about it publicly. It just alienates white voters _whose votes we need to win._ We don’t need to pander to racists, we just gotta avoid rustling white peoples’ jimmies too much in the upcoming election, or else we get 8 years of Trump. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/37 "2018-02-09T17:11:43Z")
> [@Jacquernagy](#): > > I believe very firmly that > > 1. White privilege is real, it is a problem, it needs to be corrected, and we have a long way to go, > > and > > 1. Democrats do a disservice to our cause by talking about it too much. _Work_ behind the scenes to level the playing field. Don’t _talk_ so much about it publicly. It just alienates white voters _whose votes we need to win._ We don’t need to pander to racists, we just gotta avoid rustling white peoples’ jimmies too much in the upcoming election, or else we get 8 years of Trump. Which Democrats are talking about it too much? ---
**Author:** ![Clothahump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/51bf81/32.png) [@Clothahump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clothahump)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/38 "2018-02-09T17:14:58Z")
> [@thatbpguy](#): > > GREAT QUESTION!!! > > My wife is a poet and writer and she wanted to hear her. I wasn’t given a choice. Well, there is that. 😃 Happy wife, happy life - that’s worth the money paid. ---
**Author:** ![Lamoral](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lamoral/32/16078_2.png) [@Lamoral](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lamoral)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/39 "2018-02-09T17:21:16Z")
There aren’t any Democratic politicians I’m aware of who are making a big issue out of it. It’s individual people on the small scale; local people, college lecturers, activists of all stripes. Their intentions are good. The problem is that today, no rhetoric exists in a vacuum, and a drop can cause a ripple. With the internet and social media being what it is, one person’s outlandish statement can be easily spun by the conservative machine as being representative of the Democratic and liberal view as a whole. Then, once that happens, once people have accumulated an arsenal of public controversies to bring up during debates - eventually the bigger politicians _will_ get asked about it and have to discuss it in public, and it has the potential to reflect badly on their platform and distract from issues that have more potential to bring people together rather than drive them apart. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2018, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511/40 "2018-02-09T17:21:32Z")
> [@Clothahump](#): > > Well, there is that. 😃 > > Happy wife, happy life - that’s worth the money paid. And there’s always value in listening to points of view you don’t agree with. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-privilage/808511.md?page=3)