# White supremacists are the biggest ideological threat to American lives, by far **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [August 10, 2019, 12:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449 "2019-08-10T12:17:45Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 19
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 8:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/361 "2019-08-16T20:48:00Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Let us set up a ridiculous scenario designed to antagonize the target as much as possible, that has no basis in reality, then pretend to know what will happen next. > You sure showed _us_! Just trying to put some reality into a discussion. The writer said that on his drive south of Chicago there were all these small towns which he wanted to start dumping more refugees. I just wanted to ask people to think about it. BTW, sure. most small towns can handle a family or 2. They even welcome them. But we are talking millions at the borders and even more millions wanting to try and come across. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/362 "2019-08-16T20:50:09Z")
> [@Kearsen1](#): > > No one, not a single one of you, are willing to put aside the political differences to come together. Fence-sitting trash talk from those with no real solutions. Come together where? Which “political” differences do you propose each side put aside? What outcome should both sides strive for? ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 8:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/363 "2019-08-16T20:50:53Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > I was thinking about this last night and I will encourage you to try this: > > Please, stop in a few of those towns of around 2-3,000 people and find the town mayor or other leader. Inform him or her you represent the federal government and that they will in around 2 months, be the delivery point of about 100 refugees. All non english speaking and from a vastly different culture. Inform him/her that town will be REQUIRED to not only take them in but provide housing, food, sanitation, medical care, jobs, plus schooling for any children. > > Also inform him/her that in another year, or maybe less, there will be another busload of another 100. Then another. Then another. > > Just how will they take this news? You might try stopping in some of the towns of around that size around here and finding out how they react to having long-term valued farm workers hauled away in handcuffs. ---
**Author:** ![bobot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bobot/32/21622_2.png) [@bobot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bobot)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/364 "2019-08-16T20:53:29Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > I was thinking about this last night and I will encourage you to try this: > > Please, stop in a few of those towns of around 2-3,000 people and find the town mayor or other leader. Inform him or her you represent the federal government and … Mine was a response to your ludicrous claim that America was full. Not is it only not full, it is not even close. Now, you asked what I think about your crazy hypothetical scenario. Hmm. What would Illinois farmers think about a federal agent coming to town and telling them what to do? I’ll go way out on a limb and guess that they wouldn’t like it. Now, in reality, the feds (Trump) have told Illinois farmers that their soybeans are going to be much more expensive to export. I’m curious to see their reaction to that. We won’t know until we all get a say in 2020. ---
**Author:** ![Kearsen1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/3d9bf3/32.png) [@Kearsen1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kearsen1)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 8:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/365 "2019-08-16T20:55:57Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Fence-sitting trash talk from those with no real solutions. Come together where? Which “political” differences do you propose each side put aside? What outcome should both sides strive for? The economically feasible ones. Like cutting costs, and/or raising taxes. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 9:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/366 "2019-08-16T21:01:55Z")
> [@Kearsen1](#): > > The economically feasible ones. Like cutting costs, and/or raising taxes. Woah! Let’s not get into _too_ much detail, dude! :rolleyes: ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 9:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/367 "2019-08-16T21:32:00Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > …he wanted to start dumping more refugees. When it comes to people fleeing war and persecution - like ISIS murdering people just because they are Christians, among other atrocities - do you really have to use language that evokes images of those people being human garbage? ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/368 "2019-08-16T21:57:56Z")
> [@bobot](#): > > Mine was a response to your ludicrous claim that America was full. Not is it only not full, it is not even close. > Now, you asked what I think about your crazy hypothetical scenario. Hmm. What would Illinois farmers think about a federal agent coming to town and telling them what to do? I’ll go way out on a limb and guess that they wouldn’t like it. > Now, in reality, the feds (Trump) have told Illinois farmers that their soybeans are going to be much more expensive to export. I’m curious to see their reaction to that. We won’t know until we all get a say in 2020. Not try in changing the subject. So your saying those small towns will have no problem taking in 100 new immigrants? Then soon another 100? Then another 100? I really dont think you have walked around and actually talked to people and found out there feelings. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/369 "2019-08-16T22:27:30Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Not try in changing the subject. So your saying those small towns will have no problem taking in 100 new immigrants? Then soon another 100? Then another 100? > > I really dont think you have walked around and actually talked to people and found out there feelings. [Eyegor]Where feelings?[/Eyegor] ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/370 "2019-08-16T22:32:23Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Not try in changing the subject. So your saying those small towns will have no problem taking in 100 new immigrants? Then soon another 100? Then another 100? > > I really dont think you have walked around and actually talked to people and found out there feelings. Would these towns you’re talking about also object to white, English speaking people moving in? ---
**Author:** ![Sicks\_Ate](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/258eb7/32.png) [@Sicks\_Ate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sicks_Ate)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 10:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/371 "2019-08-16T22:37:22Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Would these towns you’re talking about also object to white, English speaking people moving in? Anecdote… I get to visit a lot of little towns in Missouri (which is right next to Kansas, you know) and I’ve made a game of seeing not if, but how many confederate flags I see as I’m driving though. ---
**Author:** ![Voyager](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/voyager/32/133_2.png) [@Voyager](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Voyager)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/372 "2019-08-16T23:15:38Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Not try in changing the subject. So your saying those small towns will have no problem taking in 100 new immigrants? Then soon another 100? Then another 100? > > I really dont think you have walked around and actually talked to people and found out there feelings. Maybe they’d replace the white kids who moved away. I can imagine what the discussion would be if we were debating relaxing the old restrictive immigration laws. “Imagines what would happen when the Chinese and Indians come streaming in.” What happened? Silicon Valley happened. Billions or trillions of dollars of new wealth happened. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 16, 2019, 11:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/373 "2019-08-16T23:18:11Z")
> [@Voyager](#): > > What happened? Silicon Valley happened. Billions or trillions of dollars of new wealth happened. More importantly, our cuisine improved. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2019, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/374 "2019-08-17T13:33:08Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Would these towns you’re talking about also object to white, English speaking people moving in? It depends. There was a place where just that happened. Sort of. In Potsville Iowa. Some orthodox jews from isreal and some from orthodox communities in New York, moved into a small Iowa town where they bought a local meat packing plant and turned it into a kosher plant. Now the locals were open to them but the problem here was the jews had a different culture with their black robes, beards, and different diets and such plus had never lived in a similar community where they are expected to mingle and be friendly with neighbors. Top it all off they made a point of isolating themselves (ex. kids went to a private school and no mingling in scouts, sports, or clubs) so had almost no contact with locals. Locals would try to talk to their new neighbors but they were rebuffed. So yes, it can cause problems. Then the packing plant brought in many illegals to work and that lead to an ICE raid and many things changed. They did end up bringing in Somalian refugees. [An article on the raid.](https://www.wbur.org/hereandnow/2018/07/30/postville-iowa-immigration-raid-documentary) From what I read about half the orthodox families moved away and those left made it a point to be more friendly and part of the community. ---
**Author:** ![Urbanredneck](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ea5d25/32.png) [@Urbanredneck](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Urbanredneck)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2019, 1:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/375 "2019-08-17T13:34:28Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > Anecdote… I get to visit a lot of little towns in Missouri (which is right next to Kansas, you know) and I’ve made a game of seeing not if, but how many confederate flags I see as I’m driving though. Yes, I have seen that to and I dont like it. ---
**Author:** ![asahi](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/asahi/32/8693_2.png) [@asahi](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/asahi)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2019, 2:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/376 "2019-08-17T14:00:10Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > It depends. > > There was a place where just that happened. Sort of. In Potsville Iowa. Some orthodox jews from isreal and some from orthodox communities in New York, moved into a small Iowa town where they bought a local meat packing plant and turned it into a kosher plant. Now the locals were open to them but the problem here was the jews had a different culture with their black robes, beards, and different diets and such plus had never lived in a similar community where they are expected to mingle and be friendly with neighbors. Top it all off they made a point of isolating themselves (ex. kids went to a private school and no mingling in scouts, sports, or clubs) so had almost no contact with locals. Locals would try to talk to their new neighbors but they were rebuffed. So yes, it can cause problems. Then the packing plant brought in many illegals to work and that lead to an ICE raid and many things changed. They did end up bringing in Somalian refugees. > > [An article on the raid.](https://www.wbur.org/hereandnow/2018/07/30/postville-iowa-immigration-raid-documentary) > > From what I read about half the orthodox families moved away and those left made it a point to be more friendly and part of the community. It’s not just immigrant migration that can cause tensions in smaller communities; migration of any kind can present challenges. What about the North Dakota boom towns that have sprung up over the past 25 years? There are similar complaints, not so much complaints about the lack of cultural assimilation, but about how once small and peaceful communities have been overrun by rowdy young men. I won’t deny that immigrant migration can can be a source of friction in the community, but that doesn’t mean that America’s full; it just means that people living in those communities have to find ways to bridge cultural divides. I agree that some of that responsibility lies with the migrants who are looking for a new home, but there’s a shared responsibility to help them fit in. ---
**Author:** ![QuickSilver](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/quicksilver/32/7832_2.png) [@QuickSilver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/QuickSilver)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2019, 2:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/377 "2019-08-17T14:05:33Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > If you would have driven out to the suburbs you would have seen how full we are getting. In my hometown of Overland Park houses for single family home have skyrocketed and almost all the new construction are apartments or condominiums. They tore down one golf course and built a massive apartment complex plus multi family homes. On Metcalf they tore down old buildings and are building apartments. Heck everywhere I look is apartments, apartments, apartments. > > So while we dont currently have the homeless problem of other cities I can see we are barely keeping up. And you don’t see this as a sign of economic growth and prosperity? It’s my understanding that real estate developers are not in the business of loosing millions and millions of dollars. They don’t build out of the goodness of their kind hearts. They build because there is money to be made. People who buy or rent these new properties are there because there are jobs available in the area. That’s economic growth. In my conversations with the Kansas City clients, they observed the same as you but most of them took it as a positive sign of growth in the metro area. Nobody loved the idea of more traffic and that’s a problem they all acknowledged that needs solving, along with other infrastructure improvements. But most took pride in the fact that their part of “fly over country” was showing signs of economic growth and revitalization. I personally, would love to see those beautiful office buildings in downtown K.C. full and thriving instead of being fully shuttered. They deserve to be maintained and enjoyed. > [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Traffic is really getting bad and our mass transit options are limited. > > Now could we keep expanding and keep slapping more apartments on farmland? I suppose. But thats getting to be more and more expensive plus you must also then expand services like water and sewers plus the new places are further from job centers. This is an infrastructure problem across the entire nation and improving it would benefit everyone and contribute to the economy. I don’t see it as a problem caused by immigration. ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2019, 2:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/378 "2019-08-17T14:58:52Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > In my hometown of Overland Park houses for single family home have skyrocketed and almost all the new construction are apartments or condominiums. They tore down one golf course and built a massive apartment complex plus multi family homes. On Metcalf they tore down old buildings and are building apartments. Heck everywhere I look is apartments, apartments, apartments. > > So while we dont currently have the homeless problem of other cities I can see we are barely keeping up. > > Traffic is really getting bad and our mass transit options are limited. Your argument in this thread is that we as a country already have too many people and therefore we shouldn’t accept more immigrants. You are using your hometown of Overland Park as an example of how increased population is putting a burden on housing and infrastructure. I’m looking at the numbers for Johnson County, where Overland Park is located. As of 2017, JoCo had a population of just under [600,000](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Johnson_County,_Kansas). This makes it the most populous county in the state. But there were just [11,000](https://www.migrationpolicy.org/programs/data-hub/charts/us-immigrant-population-state-and-county) immigrants in the county. So while your point about a booming population in your hometown causing problems is certainly well taken, attempting to use it an argument against immigration is not. ---
**Author:** ![Ravenman](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ravenman/32/2929_2.png) [@Ravenman](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ravenman)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2019, 5:01pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/379 "2019-08-17T17:01:00Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > It depends. Ok, so foreigners are not good neighbors. Jews are not good neighbors. Can I ask these towns if black Americans are okay neighbors? What would they say? ---
**Author:** ![k9bfriender](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/k9bfriender/32/3283_2.png) [@k9bfriender](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/k9bfriender)\ **Post date:** [August 17, 2019, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449/380 "2019-08-17T17:25:51Z")
> [@Urbanredneck](#): > > Not try in changing the subject. So your saying those small towns will have no problem taking in 100 new immigrants? Then soon another 100? Then another 100? > > I really dont think you have walked around and actually talked to people and found out there feelings. Yeah, you go to these small towns of 4,000, and you say, “You used to be a town of 5,000, but many of your younger generation went off to college and moved away. Many of your businesses are closed or are closing, your farmers are going bankrupt because they don’t have anyone to work their fields, services are strained, as businesses can’t hire employees to staff them. Would you like some help?” If it turns out that they are too xenophobic to take the help of foreigners, then go to the next town. There are around 35,000 such towns around the US. If each just took 100, that’s 3.5 million right there. You keep thinking that we would just select a single town to dump everyone in, but that would not be the case at all. The US is much bigger than you give it credit for. We could let in millions of people a year, put them _all_ into small towns, and still be adding less than 100 to each one of them. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449.md?page=18) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/white-supremacists-are-the-biggest-ideological-threat-to-american-lives-by-far/838449.md?page=20)