# Who decides “proper” pronunciation? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [June 2, 2025, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111 "2025-06-02T18:12:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [June 5, 2025, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/181 "2025-06-05T20:30:39Z")
> [@EinsteinsHund](#): > > And there is no single “Austrian” dialect, there are numerous changing with the region. Some Austrian dialects are similar to Bavarian (and there are different Bavarian dialects), some to Swiss German, and some genuine for the region. The people in Vienna talk nothing like the people in Carinthia, for instance. > > ETA: I googled and Schwarzenegger was born in the Steiermark. They have their own dialect. Johnny Carson “I did not know that”. Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [June 6, 2025, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/182 "2025-06-06T17:16:03Z")
Today on a “Diagnosis: Murder” rerun, I heard an actress pronounce “insurance” with the stress on the first syllable. I don’t recall the episode, but it was on the “Hallmark Mystery” channel. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 12:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/183 "2025-06-07T00:00:35Z")
Did that actress have an “backwoodsy” accent on other words (like Jethro talking about the CEment pond)? ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 12:18am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/184 "2025-06-07T00:18:57Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > Did that actress have an “backwoodsy” accent on other words For what it’s worth, as I noted upthread, “INsurance” is a pretty typical pronunciation of the word in the southeastern U.S., and is not just “backwoodsy.” ---
**Author:** ![Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/earl_snake-hips_tucker/32/3269_2.png) [@Earl\_Snake-Hips\_Tucker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Earl_Snake-Hips_Tucker)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 12:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/185 "2025-06-07T00:45:34Z")
Actress had a standard generic actor’s accent, and she was from New Jersey (Lynn Marta). ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 12:57am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/186 "2025-06-07T00:57:51Z")
Thank you. I apologize for my implication. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 3:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/187 "2025-06-07T03:33:37Z")
> [@Andy\_L](#): > > Did that actress have an “backwoodsy” accent on other words (like Jethro talking about the CEment pond)? Max Baer, Jr. didn’t naturally talk in a “backwoodsy” accent. Many other actors trying out for the role of Jethro could do the accent better. The reason that he got the part of Jethro was that he played the role as dimwitted, clumsy, and a little drunk in his audition. ---
**Author:** ![Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/q.q.switcheroo/32/5713_2.png) [@Q.Q.Switcheroo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Q.Q.Switcheroo)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 8:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/188 "2025-06-07T08:17:25Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > Max Baer, Jr. didn’t naturally talk in a “backwoodsy” accent. Nor does Diedrich Bader (who played Jethro in the 1993 BH movie). ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 11:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/189 "2025-06-07T11:03:58Z")
Thanks. I didn’t know that (Reminds me of how Mike Nesmith happened to wear a wool hat to his audition for “The Monkees” (because he got there by bicycle), and the producers loved the hat, leading to his use of it ever after) ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 6:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/190 "2025-06-07T18:27:28Z")
They actually planned to name the character “Wool Hat.” Makes chills run down one’s spine. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 6:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/191 "2025-06-07T18:43:06Z")
Seriously?!? Yikes ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 9:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/192 "2025-06-07T21:07:12Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > ctually planned to name the character “Wool Hat.” Makes chills run down one’s spine Note that they only thought of using the name “Wool Hat” for Nesmith’s character after seeing him in the auditions. They first thought of calling the character that. This would have been weird since the other characters would have had the names of the actors. Then they decided to just have him wear the wool hat and use his own name like the others. ---
**Author:** ![Kent\_Clark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kent_clark/32/105_2.png) [@Kent\_Clark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kent_Clark)\ **Post date:** [June 7, 2025, 9:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/193 "2025-06-07T21:15:46Z")
The other night I saw a news story from Ukraine where an obviously English reporter described a BARE-ahzh of artillery fire. Of course if he were American, some people would mock him as much as if he talked about a CEE-ment pond. ---
**Author:** ![Hatchie](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hatchie/32/3983_2.png) [@Hatchie](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Hatchie)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2025, 5:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/194 "2025-06-08T05:24:22Z")
A favorite pronunciation site is [Youglish](https://youglish.com/). It won’t settle any disputes, but it lets you listen to speakers of three Englishes (UK, US, Australian) say any word you like, in context, scoured from online lectures or instructional videos so spoken by fairly erudite speakers. There are plenty of words spoken one way uniformly in one group of speakers, a different way by another - try “gaseous”. Other words just seem to have no agreement as to what’s standard no matter who is saying them. It will break down your snootiness as to “correctness” in no time. Of course you will continue to do it your way in spite of that. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2025, 5:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/195 "2025-06-08T05:46:11Z")
> [@Hatchie](#): > > There are plenty of words spoken one way uniformly in one group of speakers, a different way by another - try “gaseous”. Other words just seem to have no agreement as to what’s standard no matter who is saying them. It will break down your snootiness as to “correctness” in no time. Of course you will continue to do it your way in spite of that. I admit to a bias, but it’s not the bias of believing that “the way I’ve always heard it” is necessarily the most appropriate way to pronounce words. As an avid reader since early childhood, who often saw words in print long before he heard them pronounced, to me the printed word is paramount, even if I acknowledge that historically language has worked rather the other way around. So the bias I have is a preference for the pronunciation that comes closest to the way a word is standardly spelled. In many cases that puts North American pronunciation, particularly the usually neutral Canadian accents (which is why numerous US television anchors are Canadian imports) ahead of both US regionalisms and the pronunciations in England, the home of the English language. These are, after all, the folks who turned “Worcestershire” into “Wooster”, and the name “Featherstonehaugh” into “Fanshawe”! I mean, at this point you may as well abandon the printed word altogether, along with all standard rules of pronunciation. ---
**Author:** ![Beckdawrek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/beckdawrek/32/3647_2.png) [@Beckdawrek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beckdawrek)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2025, 6:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/196 "2025-06-08T06:27:51Z")
It took me a scary long time to get the _IN-surance_ one. Still not sure I can choke it out. I’ve decided to now just inquire about my _policy_. (I’ll try very hard not to say “poh-LEE-cy”) 😊 ---
**Author:** ![DPRK](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/4491bb/32.png) [@DPRK](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DPRK)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2025, 7:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/197 "2025-06-08T07:43:48Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > So the bias I have is a preference for the pronunciation that comes closest to the way a word is standardly spelled. I guess it is too bad that for many, many words there is no one standard spelling nor standard pronunciation. ---
**Author:** ![Wendell\_Wagner](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/8491ac/32.png) [@Wendell\_Wagner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Wendell_Wagner)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2025, 11:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/198 "2025-06-08T11:37:43Z")
> [@wolfpup](#): > > numerous US television anchors are Canadian imports This is no more surprising than that there are numerous American actors who grew up in Canada. Many Canadians at some point in their life decided that they could make more money in the U.S., so they took a job there. The accents are close enough that they could get rid of any small amount of difference in their accents that they had. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2025, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/199 "2025-06-08T14:02:39Z")
> [@DPRK](#): > > > [@wolfpup](#): > > > > So the bias I have is a preference for the pronunciation that comes closest to the way a word is standardly spelled. > > I guess it is too bad that for many, many words there is no one standard spelling nor standard pronunciation. Variations in English spelling (at any given time) are minimal and mostly come down to the difference between American and British spelling, with Canada somewhere in between but tending more towards the British, and few if any of those spelling differences of common words reflect different pronunciations. Whereas regional and national pronunciation differences are all over the map. There can be more variants than it’s possible to keep track of! ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [June 8, 2025, 2:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111/200 "2025-06-08T14:07:59Z")
> [@Wendell\_Wagner](#): > > > [@wolfpup](#): > > > > numerous US television anchors are Canadian imports > > This is no more surprising than that there are numerous American actors who grew up in Canada. Many Canadians at some point in their life decided that they could make more money in the U.S., so they took a job there. The accents are close enough that they could get rid of any small amount of difference in their accents that they had. Money and opportunity are certainly a factor, but my point was about the neutrality of the Canadian “accent”. The US, in contrast, has many distinctive regional accents. Some guy from New Jersey will not sound at all like someone from Arkansas. And for all the jokes about how Canadians pronounce “out” and “about”, the difference from a neutral American pronunciation is actually fairly subtle. This is from a Google overview (emphasis mine): > American TV networks often seek out Canadian anchors due to several factors, including: a perceived “neutral” or less regionalized accent, access to a wider talent pool, and a reputation for high-quality journalism. The “neutral” accent can make anchors more adaptable to various markets and less likely to be perceived as having a regional bias. Additionally, Canada has a strong journalistic tradition and many talented individuals who are seeking opportunities in larger markets. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-decides-proper-pronunciation/1019111.md?page=11)