# Who gets/got more hatred: Bush or Obama: **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 18, 2013, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635 "2013-01-18T17:45:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/61 "2013-01-19T04:13:15Z")
My own recollections have limited value, but I admit answers here surprise me. Although I thought the 2000 election was “stolen” I did not blame Bush for that, and gave him the benefit of the doubt on his policies from the beginning. After the attack on WTC, America largely rallied around him. The idea that he was _initially_ hated as much as Obama flabbergasts me. I certainly agree that there was much antipathy against him _after some huge blunders_, especially his Iraq adventure. Obviously some will disagree that these were huge blunders, but to pretend that any alleged mistakes by Obama deserve a comparable level of antipathy shows a very peculiar perspective. > [@Frankenstein\_Monster](#): > > Another data point would be comparing the number and quality of Obama-hating books to those bashing Bush. > > This link discusses almost 100 Obama hating books, many of them really bad: [The Obama Haters Book Club](http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2012/10/26/the-obama-haters-book-club-the-canon-swells.html) > > This link finds only about 10 Bush bashing books (and compares Bush bashing to Clinton hating): [Bush-Bashing Books](http://www.cbsnews.com/2100-215_162-586159.html) I think statistics like **Frankenstein Monster** ’s might be a way to address OP’s question objectively. On _a single page_, [Fox News’ opinion index](http://www.foxnews.com/opinion/index.html), right now I see > [@](#): > > Barack Obama – our imperial emperor in chief > > Illegal Alien: Thanks to ‘Obama’s Law’ ‘We’re Safe’ from Deportation > > Watch: Obama Supporters Gush After Seeing Inauguration That Hasn’t Happened Yet > > Two Washington grown-ups and Baby Obama > > Obama aims to associate himself with Abe, but can he live up to Lincoln’s words? Do conservatives think liberal opinion indexes 8 or 10 years ago would show a similar anti-Bush bias? ---
**Author:** ![Carmady](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/f04885/32.png) [@Carmady](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Carmady)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/62 "2013-01-19T05:17:52Z")
I think Bush came off as a decent, likeable fellow for the most part. Including to me. I think that is why he won two elections. It is also what confused people and helped him divide his opposition. By creating an image of a stupid, bumbling man causing extraordinary harm without any ill will, Bush stymied those who (probably more accurately) saw him as carrying out a deliberate, carefully destructive plan. So, I guess I’d say the problem is that people didn’t hate Bush when they should have. They hated what he did, but he was able to hide behind the image of innocent stupidity. Obama has no such shield against the hatred. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 5:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/63 "2013-01-19T05:19:49Z")
> [@Werekoala](#): > > I’m still waiting for Chimpy McBushHitlerBurton to suspend the 2004 elections and declare himself Dictator for Life with Cheney’s hand firmly up his ass pulling the strings. > > I always loved how the left couldn’t decide if Bush was a nearly brain-dead frat boy or a super-genius bent on world domination… Pick one. Nobody ever thought he was a supergenius bent on world domination – but, neither was he “The Decider” – we all knew, and still know, that Darth Cheney **was** pulling the strings. (According to [Ron Suskind,](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_One_Percent_Doctrine) the CIA’s codename for Cheney was “Edgar” – as in, Edgar Bergen.) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/64 "2013-01-19T05:25:58Z")
> [@BobLibDem](#): > > Remember all the fuss about how Bush wasn’t a real American and how he should produce his long-form birth certificate? Well, if he had, it might have proven he was born in Connecticut! That’s not part of the **real** America! ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 6:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/65 "2013-01-19T06:56:22Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Inspired by [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?p=15912416#post15912416) post of **Debaser’s** in [this](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=679337) thread on RW paranoia: > > Well, that ain’t how **I** remember it. > > Liberals gave Bush a **chance.** At the start of his term, their general attitude was, “Oh, well, the Pub stole the election, we wuz robbed, whatever, fresh blood, we were getting kinda tired of Clinton/Gore anyway, W doesn’t seem like he’s gonna do much of anything anyway, the country is thriving, maybe we just need a pleasant, stupid caretaker POTUS for a while.” And for the first months of his presidency it actually seemed it would work out that way. It took 9/11 and the W/Cheney Admin’s responses to it to start changing their minds, and it took a while – even liberals got swept up in the reactive hyperpatrioc anger/zeal for some time. > > But to RWs, Obama was the America-hating Nazi Communist Muslim Antichrist before he even took office. Birtherism [started even before the election](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Birtherism#Origins_of_the_claims) (and damn those few cranky Hillaryites for starting the whole thing, never mind, it was the RW that picked up that ball and ran with it). Liberals doubted Bush’s “legitimacy” as POTUS because the 2000 election smelled bad, but RWs seem to reject the "legitimacy’ of Obama in the same way they rejected Clinton’s, only cranked up to eleven. Somewhere along the way, they appear to have internalized the notion that the Reagan Revolution was once-and-for all and after that, no Dem **can** be a legitimate POTUS ever again, it seems to them an impossible reversal of history, like a Jacobite Restoration. Michael Moore’s _Fahrenheit 9/11_ was the most cautious and circumspect thing ever, compared to what Obama comes in for routinely these past four – no, five – years. Puuuuuuuhhhhhh-leeeeeezzzzzzz! ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 7:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/66 "2013-01-19T07:46:40Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > \*Obama actually encouraged this by not releasing his birth certificate at first because it helped him politically. Moderates are turned off by these sort of extreme conspiracy theories. It sort of backfired because it went on so long the fringe birthers became more vocal and large than anyone expected they would. You don’t know what you’re talking about. Obama released his BC in 2008 before the election. The “long form” thing was a bunch of dipshits asking for the archival version the government has that no one generally gets. You don’t just order one. What Obama initially provided was exactly what everyone else in the country has. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 7:50am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/67 "2013-01-19T07:50:18Z")
Bush got a lot of hate. But as far as I can tell, most if it was justified. He was a terrible president. And he squandered the good will the world had for us after 911. I don’t think Bush was evil, just a middling talent that got browbeaten by Cheney and the neocons. The problems people had with Bush were due to his actions. No one had to make up shit to be angry at Bush for. Contrast that to Obama, the people who hate him, hate him for nonsense they make up. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/68 "2013-01-19T20:53:40Z")
> [@handsomeharry](#): > > Puuuuuuuhhhhhh-leeeeeezzzzzzz! No. Ask nicer. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 8:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/69 "2013-01-19T20:58:31Z")
> [@Lobohan](#): > > I don’t think Bush was evil, just a middling talent that got browbeaten by Cheney and the neocons. Who **are** evil. ---
**Author:** ![Lobohan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lobohan/32/79_2.png) [@Lobohan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lobohan)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/70 "2013-01-19T21:02:46Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > Who **are** evil. Oh no doubt. Cheney is a torturing piece of shit and the world will be better when he’s gone. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 9:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/71 "2013-01-19T21:33:20Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > The thing is, there’s quite a bit of white hot hatred for Obama. A smallish minority, but the level of hate is high. Meanwhile, The Shrub is generally despised by a larger %, but few hate him with that level of intensity. This may be. Anecdotally, I present myself. I actually agree with W on some things and sympathize with him on others, but thought he was promoted to the level of his incompetence as Prez, and grew to despise the party that mistook him for qualified. Also, he cut taxes while prosecuting two foreign wars. Total economic mismanagement. So I voted against his reelection in 2004, and was glad to see the back of him in 2008. I spent the four years between getting very angry and very radicalized. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [January 19, 2013, 9:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/72 "2013-01-19T21:44:57Z")
But I also consider Obama a disappointment. Rule of law isn’t just a partisan talking point for me. I just tend to take “Obama’s” side because I hate the present GOP leadership more. So that’s the underlying thing. Bush was a center-right mediocrity who was fiscally reckless, environmentally irresponsible, warmongering himself, broke the law for the Global War On Terror–and co-partisan to people even more despicable than he was, like hardline Anglo racists. Obama is not so fiscally reckless, insufficiently environmentally responsible to completely make up for the damage of the previous era, still warmongering, still broke the law for the GWOT, still kind of a Tory–but he’s not the co-partisan of DeLay, Cantor, and their type. He gets “lesser evil” cred. But it seems like moderates often _love_ Obama, and the far right often _despise_ him. :shrug: ---
**Author:** ![kaylasdad99](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kaylasdad99/32/3398_2.png) [@kaylasdad99](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kaylasdad99)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2013, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/73 "2013-01-20T02:55:37Z")
> [@Debaser](#): > > I didn’t bring the word “persecution” into the thread. The OP did. I was responding to that. And endorsing it. > [@Where does right-wing paranoia come from?](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/where-does-right-wing-paranoia-come-from/647551/48): > > Christians are persecuted in our society in some ways. White males certainly are. ---
**Author:** ![nachtmusick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/ac91a4/32.png) [@nachtmusick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nachtmusick)\ **Post date:** [January 20, 2013, 11:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/74 "2013-01-20T11:27:06Z")
> [@foolsguinea](#): > > But I also consider Obama a disappointment. Rule of law isn’t just a partisan talking point for me. I just tend to take “Obama’s” side because I hate the present GOP leadership more. > > So that’s the underlying thing. > > Bush was a center-right mediocrity who was fiscally reckless, environmentally irresponsible, warmongering himself, broke the law for the Global War On Terror–and co-partisan to people even more despicable than he was, like hardline Anglo racists. > > Obama is not so fiscally reckless, insufficiently environmentally responsible to completely make up for the damage of the previous era, still warmongering, still broke the law for the GWOT, still kind of a Tory–but he’s not the co-partisan of DeLay, Cantor, and their type. He gets “lesser evil” cred. > > But it seems like moderates often _love_ Obama, and the far right often _despise_ him. :shrug: I consider Obama to be the best we could hope for. However ineffectual he may be at foiling the schemes of the plutacracy, I think he strives towards the goals that I would strive for if I were in his place. ---
**Author:** ![Dave\_Hartwick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/7feea3/32.png) [@Dave\_Hartwick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dave_Hartwick)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2013, 12:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/75 "2013-01-21T00:46:28Z")
To me, it’s clear that Obama is the more threatened president, at least when looking at threats emanating from within the US. I’m not sure if that equates exactly to hated, but surely they are close. As already cited, Obama reportedly receives more death threats than any US president, ever. > [@](#): > > Since Mr Obama took office, the rate of threats against the president has increased 400 per cent from the 3,000 a year or so under President George W. Bush, according to Ronald Kessler, author of In the President’s Secret Service. > **[Barack Obama faces 30 death threats a day, stretching US Secret Service](https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/barackobama/5967942/Barack-Obama-faces-30-death-threats-a-day-stretching-US-Secret-Service.html)** > > US President Barack Obama is the target of more than 30 potential death threats a day and is being protected by an increasingly over-stretched and under-resourced Secret Service, according to a new book. Obama appears to also be more threatened than Clinton, in terms of conspiracists aligned against him-- so-called patriot groups. > [@](#): > > From 149 groups in 2008, the number of Patriot organizations skyrocketed to 512 in 2009, shot up again in 2010 to 824, and then, last year, jumped to 1,274. That works out to a staggering 755% growth in the three years ending last Dec. 31. Last year’s total was more than 400 groups higher than the prior all-time high, in 1996. > **[Dangerous Liaisons](https://www.splcenter.org/resources/reports/dangerous-liaisons-2/)** > > Losing at home, U.S. religious-right groups are working furiously to keep gay sex criminalized in Belize and beyond The article claims that the economy plays a major role in the expansion of pseudo patriots, but politics must as well. 1996 was a relatively good year, economically. The economy turned much worse in 2001-- nearly into recession, in terms of US [per capita GDP](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:US_GDP_per_capita_change.PNG)– yet there was no expansion in “patriots”. On the contrary, the number of such groups declined in both 2001 and 2002. In case you’re not familiar: [Patriot movement - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Patriot_movement) Qin made a good point that could use some expansion. Suspicion and fear of Bush, particularly after a swell of sympathy and good will following the 9/11 attacks abated, was much worse outside the US than negative opinions I recall of Obama. Pew Research agrees with my observations-- see the section “Overall Ratings for U.S. Mostly Positive”. [Global Opinion of Obama Slips, International Policies Faulted | Pew Research Center](http://www.pewglobal.org/2012/06/13/global-opinion-of-obama-slips-international-policies-faulted/) Even though international confidence in Obama has declined, he still polls much higher than Bush. This chart shows the difference: [http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2012/06/USIMAGE0044.png](http://www.pewglobal.org/files/2012/06/USIMAGE0044.png) So, by my lights, Bush was the more disliked of the two by far if international opinion is considered. However, in terms of attention from hate groups within the United States, Obama “gets more hatred”. ---
**Author:** ![computergeek](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/e56c9b/32.png) [@computergeek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/computergeek)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2013, 3:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/76 "2013-01-21T03:19:00Z")
I would say Obama probably gets more \*irrational \*hatred than Bush did. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2013, 4:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/77 "2013-01-21T16:10:50Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > No. Ask nicer. Preeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeetttttttttyyyyyyyyyyyyyyy Puuuuuuuhhhhhh-leeeeeezzzzzzz! (I ain’t coming up with the "WiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiithSuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuuugarrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr on it till I have to. I ain’t cheap.) ---
**Author:** ![tagos](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@tagos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tagos)\ **Post date:** [January 21, 2013, 4:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/78 "2013-01-21T16:27:25Z")
> [@computergeek](#): > > I would say Obama probably gets more \*irrational \*hatred than Bush did. Quite. Bush earned his. ---
**Author:** ![Dob](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Dob](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dob)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2013, 7:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/79 "2013-01-23T19:24:40Z")
if we are talking about the present, then I think Bush is the more hated. Both left and right seem to have a disdain for him and his presidency. I mean, they didn’t even invite him to the Republican Party convention! Clinton was everywhere for Obama! Bush? not so much… ---
**Author:** ![Steener122](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b9e5f3/32.png) [@Steener122](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Steener122)\ **Post date:** [January 23, 2013, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/80 "2013-01-23T20:02:26Z")
They both get/got alot of hate. I think the difference is a lot of the hate towards Obama has little to do with things he’s done. They accuse him of not really being born in the US. They claim he’s a Muslim. They make the hate racial, saying he’s out only to help black Americans. They hate they have towards him started before he was ever even elected. With the exception of the anger over the whole election stealing debacle, the liberals didn’t have any real issues with Bush until he started messing up. And the whole election anger thing was more directed at the SCOTUS not Bush himself. The total obsession with hating Obama is what I think sets it apart. Those who HATE him seem obsessed with it. Their lives seem consumed by it, like Orly Tate. Bush had more than his fare share of people who didnt like him. And had tons and tons of jokes about him, but most of them weren’t so evil, so consumed by total hatred and obsession. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635.md?page=5)