# Who gets/got more hatred: Bush or Obama: **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [January 18, 2013, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635 "2013-01-18T17:45:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2013, 7:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/81 "2013-08-13T19:37:01Z")
Bumping this thread because we can’t seem to reach any consensus in [this thread.](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=699289) ---
**Author:** ![Gerald\_II](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Gerald\_II](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gerald_II)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2013, 9:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/82 "2013-08-13T21:03:26Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > Obama gets more hatred from what I see. I think liberals hated Bush because of his policies (unnecessary war, plutocratic economic policies), conservatives hate Obama because of who he is. They hated him before he even had policies. > . They hate him because of what he was proposing, statements he made, and the policies he supported which were also Democratic policies. I’ve seen on Youtube Hitchens making some very vocal criticisms of Bush before he got elected. I think the hate is both strong but Obama gets a little more. Clint Eastwoods disrespectful talk with a chair is an example. Republicans and watermelon patch White House pictures. ---
**Author:** ![deltasigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e5b9ba/32.png) [@deltasigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/deltasigma)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2013, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/83 "2013-08-13T21:47:34Z")
I didn’t read the zombie part, but I think to get a true measure of Obama hate, you need to do something akin to a weighted average. I disliked Bush and thought many of his policies, to the extent he had actual pre-planned policies that is, were reckless, misinformed and/or myopic. But I didn’t have the seething, bowel-wrenching hatred that I’ve seen for Obama and I don’t recall seeing that to the same degree. Of course what I see or don’t see isn’t necessarily a representative sample, but I don’t think it would be that hard to get one by culling appropriate sources. I think if you did that though, you would see a difference in the level of intensity expressed. Now that I’m thinking about it, it shouldn’t be that hard to do so it’s sort of surprising that it hasn’t already been (or it has and no one has seen fit to post it yet). ---
**Author:** ![Gerald\_II](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/43a26b/32.png) [@Gerald\_II](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gerald_II)\ **Post date:** [August 13, 2013, 9:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/84 "2013-08-13T21:57:37Z")
> [@Dob](#): > > Clinton was everywhere for Obama! Bush? not so much… I thought that was because they felt it would hurt the campaign of McCain. Gore tried to distance himself from Clinton as well when running for pres. ---
**Author:** ![Age\_Quod\_Agis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d07c76/32.png) [@Age\_Quod\_Agis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Age_Quod_Agis)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/85 "2013-08-14T00:04:23Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > ETA – I also would add that I think that Obama is more liked in general, but Bush had a larger group of die-hards who simply loved him. I’m not sure I can agree with this. There’s an _enormous_ racial divide on Pres. Obama. [Pres. Obama’s approval rating is currently around 47%](http://www.examiner.com/article/racial-divide-may-shore-up-obama-approval-rating). But when you dig into those numbers, you find that a large portion of his support comes from black citizens. From 2011-13, the number of **whites** with a “great deal/quite a lot” of confidence in the Presidency was **23%**. [The number of **blacks** during the same timeframe with a “great deal/quite a lot” of confidence in the Presidency was **77%**](http://www.gallup.com/poll/163175/minorities-less-confident-police-small-business.aspx?utm_source=alert&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=syndication&utm_content=morelink&utm_term=All%20Gallup%20Headlines). This Zogby poll from July points out that during his 2nd election bid, [93% of the black community supported Obama](http://www.newsmax.com/Politics/zogby-obama-approval-rating/2013/07/15/id/515128). According to the same link, Obama’s approval rating among the black community has fallen to “only” 84%. I can’t think of a community that loved Pres. Bush as much as the black community loves Pres. Obama. ---
**Author:** ![Age\_Quod\_Agis](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/d07c76/32.png) [@Age\_Quod\_Agis](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Age_Quod_Agis)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 12:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/86 "2013-08-14T00:15:03Z")
> [@deltasigma](#): > > Of course what I see or don’t see isn’t necessarily a representative sample, but I don’t think it would be that hard to get one by culling appropriate sources. I think if you did that though, you would see a difference in the level of intensity expressed. Now that I’m thinking about it, it shouldn’t be that hard to do so it’s sort of surprising that it hasn’t already been (or it has and no one has seen fit to post it yet). When Gallup and other pollsters do Presidential job approval surveys, they tend to include “Strongly Approve,” “Approve,” “Disapprove,” and “Strongly Disapprove” categories. “Strongly Disapprove” might be the closest thing to what you’re talking about. My google-fu hasn’t been good enough to find averaged “Strongly Disapprove” ratings for Bush and Obama throughout their terms – and I’m not invested enough to compile the numbers on my own – but maybe you can figure that out. ---
**Author:** ![deltasigma](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e5b9ba/32.png) [@deltasigma](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/deltasigma)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 12:38am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/87 "2013-08-14T00:38:10Z")
> [@Age\_Quod\_Agis](#): > > . . . . I’m not invested enough to compile the numbers on my own – but maybe you can figure that out. IDK, I think I should probably organize my sock drawer. 😃 ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 1:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/88 "2013-08-14T01:29:28Z")
> [@Age\_Quod\_Agis](#): > > I can’t think of a community that loved Pres. Bush as much as the black community loves Pres. Obama. “Some people call you the elites; I call you my base.” I daresay **that** community loved him. ---
**Author:** ![WillFarnaby](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/willfarnaby/32/514_2.png) [@WillFarnaby](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WillFarnaby)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 2:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/89 "2013-08-14T02:23:21Z")
Both are/were hated in less than healthy amounts, but Obama is hated slightly more. ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 5:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/90 "2013-08-14T05:00:17Z")
I’m not sure which of the two was “hated” more; the huge divergence comes on _Why_ they were hated. Many think that GWB was, objectively, by far the worst President ever. Many of us pity, rather than hate, him for being way past his depth, and direct the hatred against key advisers like Cheney, Rove and Rumsfeld. And please note, as I did in #61 above, that huge antipathy against the Cheney-Rove Administration did not develop until their incompetence and hypocrisy became clear. Hatred against Obama, on the other hand, is more irrational and largely racist. It’s utterly impossible to imagine that anyone repeating the peculiar memes that he is considered “the Messiah” or that he “humiliated Marines holding an umbrella” is not a racist. While two numbskulls might constitute only “anecdote” rather than “data,” a [quote by two Teabaggers I’ve posted before] ([http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15084002&postcount=23](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15084002&postcount=23)) is worth reading. (Its the _“Look, you either are or you aren’t,” she says; “And he aren’t,” Ron says, nodding with relief_ from a Taibbi article.) [Here’s a prior post](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showpost.php?p=15763992&postcount=40) pointing to evidence that the 2008 election would have been a far huger landslide than it was, were Obama white. (BTW, that post also has a quote from the relatively rational and sober Wm. F. Buckley Jr. defending suppression of minority voters.) ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 5:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/91 "2013-08-14T05:17:54Z")
> [@septimus](#): > > Hatred against Obama, on the other hand, is more irrational and largely racist. It’s utterly impossible to imagine that anyone repeating the peculiar memes that he is considered “the Messiah” or that he “humiliated Marines holding an umbrella” is not a racist. You know I’d storm Baghdad to kick Saddam’s butt Swim to Havana bring home Castro’s beard For my buddies throw my body on a live grenade I guess I just don’t know the meaning of fear But please Please Please please please please please Don’t make me cover a Turk with a brolly Not a brolly – that’s just folly 'Cause holding it is so degrading Degrading – honor fading – Fred Small (paraphrased) ---
**Author:** ![marshmallow](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/df705f/32.png) [@marshmallow](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/marshmallow)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 10:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/92 "2013-08-14T10:40:11Z")
Did anyone outside the Gore campaign staff hate Bush pre-terror war? At most I remember people chuckled at his struggle with the English language. And his monkey faces. ---
**Author:** ![glee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b5a626/32.png) [@glee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/glee)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 11:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/93 "2013-08-14T11:20:00Z")
Outside the US, there is a clear answer: ‘The annual “Trans-Atlantic Trends” study found that 77 per cent of European Union citizens back Mr Obama’s handling of international affairs, compared with only 19 per cent who thought the same of President George W Bush. Overall, 75 per cent of Europeans have confidence in Mr Obama’s ability to combat terrorism and two thirds now have a favourable view of America. The popular view of American leaders has been transformed in the last 12 months. In Germany, Mr Obama enjoys an approval rating of 92 per cent, compared with only 12 per cent for Mr Bush. In Britain, 82 per cent approve of Mr Obama, while only 17 per cent felt the same about his predecessor.’ This comes from a **right-wing** UK newspaper. ---
**Author:** ![Bridget\_Burke](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7cd45c/32.png) [@Bridget\_Burke](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bridget_Burke)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 12:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/94 "2013-08-14T12:59:59Z")
> [@marshmallow](#): > > Did anyone outside the Gore campaign staff hate Bush pre-terror war? At most I remember people chuckled at his struggle with the English language. And his monkey faces. “Hate” is too strong a word, but plenty of us in Texas failed to find Bush Jr amusing. Here’s [a 2003 article](http://www.motherjones.com/politics/2003/11/uncompassionate-conservative) by the Late Great Molly Ivins. > [@](#): > > In order to understand why George W. Bush doesn’t get it, you have to take several strands of common Texas attitude, then add an impressive degree of class-based obliviousness. What you end up with is a guy who sees himself as a perfectly nice fellow – and who is genuinely disconnected from the impact of his decisions on people… > > Bush’s lies now fill volumes. He lied us into two hideously unfair tax cuts; he lied us into an unnecessary war with disastrous consequences; he lied us into the Patriot Act, eviscerating our freedoms. But when it comes to dealing with those less privileged, Bush’s real problem is not deception, but self-deception. [Molly’s book](http://www.amazon.com/Shrub-Short-Happy-Political-George/dp/0375757147/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1376484912&sr=8-1&keywords=shrub) on Bush was published before the election–but people didn’t pay attention. (In her memory, [The Texas Observer](http://www.texasobserver.org/)collected many articles on Why Perry Should Not Be President, rendered unnecessary once he opened his mouth in public.) Nobody who really knew Bush Jr thought he’d be a good president. Even after everybody’s eyes were opened, he still didn’t get the hate that Obama has just because he was not white & won the election. Fairly. Twice. ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 1:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/95 "2013-08-14T13:53:58Z")
None of this supposed “hate” against Obama counts, so it is obviously Bush. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 2:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/96 "2013-08-14T14:11:58Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > None of this supposed “hate” against Obama counts, so it is obviously Bush. > > Regards, > Shodan If significant numbers of people, six months into Obama’s second term and for no good reasons at all, still believe/insist that Obama is a Muslim, or a Communist, or the Antichrist, or born in a foreign country (and, yes, significant numbers do, we’ve been over that before), doesn’t that count as hate? If the Secret Service has to deal with significantly more death threats against Obama than they did with Bush or any POTUS previous (and, yes, they do, we’ve been over that before), doesn’t that count as hate? ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 2:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/97 "2013-08-14T14:13:55Z")
No. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 2:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/98 "2013-08-14T14:16:07Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > No. Then what would? ---
**Author:** ![elninost0rm](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ed655f/32.png) [@elninost0rm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elninost0rm)\ **Post date:** [August 14, 2013, 5:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/99 "2013-08-14T17:17:17Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > No. > > Regards, > Shodan Orly? ---
**Author:** ![NotfooledbyW](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f475e1/32.png) [@NotfooledbyW](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/NotfooledbyW)\ **Post date:** [August 15, 2013, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635/100 "2013-08-15T01:34:55Z")
> [@XT](#): > > But to seriously say that right wing hatred is on par with the campaign of hate the left launched against Bush for pretty much his whole presidency? :dubious: The point appears to be that right wing hatred of Obama is not based much on anything Obama has done, deserving hatred or ridicule. And indeed, Obama won a clear cut election probably led by the total financial collapse and McCain’s seemingly out of touch campaign, and of course his terrible choice for his running mate. But everything Obama did during his first two years in office was quite legit and fundamentally sound and more in accordance with the right than the hard core lefties. Afghanistan, bugged the left. Letting Iraq go on through Bush’s SOFA agreement bugged the left. Not fighting for single payer bugged the left. So on foreign policy. When Obama kept several Bush appointees on Defense etc, it Bugged the left. So the rightwing hatred that was strong and exceptionally extreme against Obama was not based upon something that the right had any severe problem with. So that should be the perspective. Bush pretty deserved being despised at the start, because of the Florida fiasco and his brother Jeb was Governor. I was never too worked up against Bush from the start. But I disagreed with all those 90% who gave Bush so much support right after 9/11. You can’t tell me that had a Dem President taken the 9/11 hit on his or her watch that this contemporary crowd of Republicans would have rallied to his or her support bumping approval up to 90% in just a matter of days from somewhere in the fifties. Just look at the stink Republicans are making about Benghazi, and what Romney did the night it happened. Going on the air attacking Obama before the flames had died down and the bodies of four Americans were cold. The hatred against Obama is equal to that of Bush, but Bush deserved most of it when he went off the irrational deep end and invaded Iraq. Even at that just before the invasion of Iraq, nearly six of ten Americans wanted Bush to let inspections continue. But once Bush decided to end inspections, the popular support for Bush and his stupid invasion went up dramatically. I don’t think Obama could ever get such ‘patriotic ferver’ for whatever Obama had to do. They don’t give Obama cover for 'three times the Bush Iraq surge ’ to bring the war in Afghanistan to a responsible end. Three months in office and Obama approved the largest air to ground U.S. Marine assault since the Vietnam War into Helmand Province of Afghanistan. Barely a Republican praised that act of Presidential commitment to finishing a war that Bush couldn’t. Hatred for Obama by the righties is way over the tap, and it has no basis anything close to Bush’s decision to invade Iraq when he did and his complete incompetence on managing the occupation that his Admin perceived would be akin to something such as ‘being greeted as liberators’. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-gets-got-more-hatred-bush-or-obama/647635.md?page=4)