# Who is or was a "femme fatale"? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 9, 2013, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785 "2013-02-09T14:09:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 2:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/1 "2013-02-09T14:09:11Z")
We had a fair amount of fun identifying (and ranking) some “voluptuous” women recently. This time, with no examples from me to get it started, who do you think of when the term “femme fatale” is mentioned? Name as many as you like – but please link to picture(s) of your candidates. ---
**Author:** ![TheZenPaperboy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/a9a28c/32.png) [@TheZenPaperboy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TheZenPaperboy)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 2:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/2 "2013-02-09T14:43:26Z")
Jane Greer from Out of the Past. ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 2:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/3 "2013-02-09T14:51:07Z")
[Julie](http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/M/MV5BNTkwNzA5NDEyM15BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwNjg0NjEwMw%40%40._V1._SY314_CR23,0,214,314_.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0518728/&h=251&w=171&sz=1&tbnid=QL4jQgcOUsw3PM:&tbnh=186&tbnw=126&zoom=1&usg=__w6NO5Dr2dnpSsWmlm9a9AZKO3lw=&docid=p2oT_fk9nzPTmM&itg=1&sa=X&ei=XWEWUZn8KYWFiALix4DwDw&ved=0CIMBEPwdMAo) [London](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXg6UB9Qk0o). ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 2:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/4 "2013-02-09T14:54:51Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > [Julie](http://www.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/M/MV5BNTkwNzA5NDEyM15BMl5BanBnXkFtZTcwNjg0NjEwMw%40%40._V1._SY314_CR23,0,214,314_.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0518728/&h=251&w=171&sz=1&tbnid=QL4jQgcOUsw3PM:&tbnh=186&tbnw=126&zoom=1&usg=__w6NO5Dr2dnpSsWmlm9a9AZKO3lw=&docid=p2oT_fk9nzPTmM&itg=1&sa=X&ei=XWEWUZn8KYWFiALix4DwDw&ved=0CIMBEPwdMAo) [London](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DXg6UB9Qk0o). Mamacita, Bubba! Right on. ---
**Author:** ![Slithy\_Tove](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slithy_tove/32/18248_2.png) [@Slithy\_Tove](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slithy_Tove)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/5 "2013-02-09T15:02:54Z")
Really though? A femme fatale has her own nefarious agenda, like Mary Astor in the Maltese Falcon. Not to be confused with your basic **hard-bitten broad,** who may or may not have a heart of gold. ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/6 "2013-02-09T15:03:50Z")
Back before I was aware of the term, [Hedy Lamarr (1913–2000)](http://www.imdb.com/name/nm0001443/?ref_=sr_1) was the image I think of as my first encounter with the type. Damn, she would be 100 this year! ---
**Author:** ![Chefguy](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chefguy/32/138_2.png) [@Chefguy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chefguy)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 3:13pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/7 "2013-02-09T15:13:23Z")
> [@Slithy\_Tove](#): > > Really though? A femme fatale has her own nefarious agenda, like Mary Astor in the Maltese Falcon. Not to be confused with your basic **hard-bitten broad,** who may or may not have a heart of gold. Not necessarily. One of many definitions: > [@](#): > > a seductive woman who lures men into dangerous or compromising situations or > > a woman who attracts men by an aura of charm and mystery The first would be somebody like Mata Hari, but the second could be most anybody. ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 3:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/8 "2013-02-09T15:52:21Z")
A working definition – for purposes of this thread at least – can be found at [this Wikipedia article.](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Femme_fatale#20th-century_film_and_theatre) ---
**Author:** ![The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/the_other_waldo_pepper/32/12370_2.png) [@The\_Other\_Waldo\_Pepper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Other_Waldo_Pepper)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 3:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/9 "2013-02-09T15:54:36Z")
Barbara Stanwyck in Double Indemnity. (A mere link to an image won’t do it; you need to see her flirting with the big lug, and then half-orgasming while he offs her well-insured husband at her signal.) ---
**Author:** ![Mrs.Cake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/2acd7d/32.png) [@Mrs.Cake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mrs.Cake)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 3:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/10 "2013-02-09T15:56:57Z")
And likewise, Kathleen Turner in _Body Heat_. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/11 "2013-02-09T16:02:55Z")
[Faye Dunaway](https://lh5.googleusercontent.com/-b3fSPV-VnXk/TYKk522X-2I/AAAAAAAAEEU/X_RzIgn_SHE/s1600/faye-dunaway-bonnie-and-clyde.jpg) as Bonnie Parker or Milady de Winter. ---
**Author:** ![charmstr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/53a042/32.png) [@charmstr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/charmstr)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 4:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/12 "2013-02-09T16:03:14Z")
> [@Chefguy](#): > > The first would be somebody like Mata Hari, but the second could be most anybody. Which is a pretty good indication that the second is a lousy definition. Most femme fatales (that we know of) are fictional. [Hedy Lamarr](http://ia.media-imdb.com/images/M/MV5BMjA0MjU1MjMyMl5BMl5BanBnXkFtZTYwMTI5MDI2._V1._SX341_SY432_.jpg) in _Samson and Delilah_ (and others I think. _White Cargo,_ maybe?) [Barbara Stanwyck](http://thecatsandtheberries.blogspot.com/2011/09/lovely-ladies-of-past-barbara-stanwyck.html) in Double Indemnity [Kathleen Turner](http://www.celebrities.pl/kathleen_turner/kathleen7.jpg) in _Body Heat_ [Theresa Russell](http://www.nitrovideo.com/trial/content/upload/black_widow/vidthumbs/toad_0770_theresa_russell-black_widow-03.jpg) in _Black Widow_ Just about any film noir dame who plays the protagonist for a sap, and just about anyone who has the title role in a [film](http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0039193/?ref_=fn_al_tt_6) called _Black Widow_. ---
**Author:** ![charmstr](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/53a042/32.png) [@charmstr](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/charmstr)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 4:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/13 "2013-02-09T16:04:16Z")
That’s what I get for being slow. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/14 "2013-02-09T16:16:01Z")
[Michelle Pfeiffer,](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J0IFrc7-3nw) Makin’ Whoopie [Why Don’t You Do Right,](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yy5THitqPBw) Jessica Rabbit ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/15 "2013-02-09T16:52:49Z")
> [@charmstr](#): > > That’s what I get for being slow. Two of those links are funky. The other two okay. ---
**Author:** ![Don\_Draper](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b2d939/32.png) [@Don\_Draper](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Don_Draper)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 5:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/16 "2013-02-09T17:11:08Z")
[Natasha Nogoodnik](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQhggbxh9og)! And her modern day analogy - Elizabeth Jennings (Keri Russell) on [the Americans](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQhggbxh9og) ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 5:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/17 "2013-02-09T17:39:15Z")
Rita Hayworth, The Lady From Shanghai ---
**Author:** ![mbh](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a6a055/32.png) [@mbh](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/mbh)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/18 "2013-02-09T18:32:36Z")
> [@Don\_Draper](#): > > [Natasha Nogoodnik](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQhggbxh9og)! > > And her modern day analogy - Elizabeth Jennings (Keri Russell) on [the Americans](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WQhggbxh9og) And the real-world counterpart, [Anna Chapman](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anna_Chapman). ---
**Author:** ![Ranchoth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ranchoth/32/1066_2.png) [@Ranchoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ranchoth)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/19 "2013-02-09T19:58:16Z")
[The Baroness](http://dvdmedia.ign.com/dvd/image/article/100/1005305/gi-joe-a-real-american-hero-the-complete-series-collectors-set-20090719094859206-000.jpg). 'Nuff said. ---
**Author:** ![Zeldar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/z/b77776/32.png) [@Zeldar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Zeldar)\ **Post date:** [February 9, 2013, 8:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785/20 "2013-02-09T20:08:31Z")
Summarizing through Post #19: Jane Greer from Out of the Past. Julie London. Mary Astor in the Maltese Falcon. Hedy Lamarr (2) in Samson and Delilah Mata Hari Barbara Stanwyck (2) in Double Indemnity. Kathleen Turner (2) in Body Heat. Faye Dunaway as Bonnie Parker Milady de Winter Theresa Russell in Black Widow Michelle Pfeiffer – Makin’ Whoopie Jessica Rabbit – Why Don’t You Do Right, Natasha Nogoodnik! Elizabeth Jennings (Keri Russell) on the Americans Rita Hayworth, The Lady From Shanghai Anna Chapman. The Baroness. [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-or-was-a-femme-fatale/649785.md?page=2)