# Who is the "Face of the Franchise" for each major sports team in your city? **URL:** \ **Category:** The Game Room\ **Created:** [October 27, 2012, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-face-of-the-franchise-for-each-major-sports-team-in-your-city/639058 "2012-10-27T17:50:54Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 7\ **Page:** 7
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2012, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-face-of-the-franchise-for-each-major-sports-team-in-your-city/639058/121 "2012-12-22T17:59:49Z")
I’m going to be a bit daring and suggest that the unspoken assumptions behind this thread - that the face of a franchise is its best player, and that he’s best picked out by fans of that team - are flawed. If we were discussing the best “X” of all time, yes; but the “face” of a team, I posit, is the player who is brought to mind when that team is mentioned to a non-fan. For example, someone upthread listed Len Dawson as the all time face of the Kansas City Chiefs. Great QB, yes, but when I think of the Chiefs (because I’m not a Chiefs fan) I think of Christian Okoye. Likewise, an Oriole fan upthread discounted Cal Ripken since he mainly played on crappy teams, and voted for Jim Palmer. But I suspect that if you asked Joe Sixpack in Detroit to name a famous Oriole, he’s going to say Iron Cal. I _am_ a Cleveland Browns fan, so I might pick Lou “The Toe” Groza or Ozzie Newsome as the face of the Brownies, but I completely agree that a non-Browns fan will say Jim Brown. ---
**Author:** ![RickJay](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/bb73d2/32.png) [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2012, 6:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-face-of-the-franchise-for-each-major-sports-team-in-your-city/639058/122 "2012-12-22T18:36:15Z")
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#): > > I’m going to be a bit daring and suggest that the unspoken assumptions behind this thread - that the face of a franchise is its best player, and that he’s best picked out by fans of that team - are flawed. If we were discussing the best “X” of all time, yes; but the “face” of a team, I posit, is the player who is brought to mind when that team is mentioned to a non-fan. For example, someone upthread listed Len Dawson as the all time face of the Kansas City Chiefs. Great QB, yes, but when I think of the Chiefs (because I’m not a Chiefs fan) I think of Christian Okoye. It usually IS the best player. There are exceptions, but there’s going to be a pretty strong correlation. In the case of Cal Ripken, I agree the fact he played on many poor teams isn’t relevant; he is by far the most famous Oriole ever, even more so than Brooksie. But the thing is, it’s not because he was just a nice guy. Ripken actually WAS the best Oriole ever. ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2012, 6:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-face-of-the-franchise-for-each-major-sports-team-in-your-city/639058/123 "2012-12-22T18:38:14Z")
> [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](#): > > I’m going to be a bit daring and suggest that the unspoken assumptions behind this thread - that the face of a franchise is its best player, and that he’s best picked out by fans of that team - are flawed. If we were discussing the best “X” of all time, yes; but the “face” of a team, I posit, is the player who is brought to mind when that team is mentioned to a non-fan. For example, someone upthread listed Len Dawson as the all time face of the Kansas City Chiefs. Great QB, yes, but when I think of the Chiefs (because I’m not a Chiefs fan) I think of Christian Okoye. > > Likewise, an Oriole fan upthread discounted Cal Ripken since he mainly played on crappy teams, and voted for Jim Palmer. But I suspect that if you asked Joe Sixpack in Detroit to name a famous Oriole, he’s going to say Iron Cal. > > I _am_ a Cleveland Browns fan, so I might pick Lou “The Toe” Groza or Ozzie Newsome as the face of the Brownies, but I completely agree that a non-Browns fan will say Jim Brown. Certainly, locals and outsiders can have very different perceptions of the “face” of a team. Sometimes, locals form a deep (and irrational) love for certain players that outsiders don’t grasp or appreciate. Example? Well, back in 1993 or 1994, if you were asked “Who’s the most beloved current Dallas Cowboy,” you might have thought it was Troy Aikman or Emmitt Smith, right? Wrong! It was Bill Bates. Many/most of you would scratch your heads and ask either “Who the hell is Bill Bates?” or “Wait… you’re telling me a special teams guy and occasional nickel back was the face of the best team in football?” Yes. It makes no sense at all, logically, but it’s true. In any locality, the “face” of the franchise CAN be a guy who’s not even all that good! It’s not necessarily the guy outsiders think of. ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2012, 7:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-face-of-the-franchise-for-each-major-sports-team-in-your-city/639058/124 "2012-12-22T19:23:34Z")
**astorian** -I assume the Bates love was because he was the last link to Landry? ---
**Author:** ![astorian](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/ad7895/32.png) [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)\ **Post date:** [December 22, 2012, 8:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-face-of-the-franchise-for-each-major-sports-team-in-your-city/639058/125 "2012-12-22T20:34:43Z")
> [@etv78](#): > > **astorian** -I assume the Bates love was because he was the last link to Landry? It COULD be that. it COULD be the perception of him as a scrappy, gritty, undertalented guy who got to the NFL and stayed their mainly through tenacity and hard work. And the fact that he was a… (hate to say this) white good ol’ boy probably had something to do with it, too. Personally, as a transplanted Yankee, I never got the Bates love. He was a TERRIBLE cover guy. I admire hard work and tenacity as much as anyone, but I’d MUCH rather have Deion Sanders giving a half-hearted effort and occasionally taking plays off than Bill Bates giving his all on every play. ---
**Author:** ![RTFirefly](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/c77e96/32.png) [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 3:14am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-face-of-the-franchise-for-each-major-sports-team-in-your-city/639058/126 "2012-12-23T03:14:17Z")
> [@DCnDC](#): > > All-time, that’s where it all gets less clear: > > Redskins: John Riggins, maybe Joe Theissman or Sonny Jurgensen? > Wizards: probably Wes Unseld > Capitals: still Ovechkin > Nationals: still Zimmerman > DC United: I’m going to go with Marco Etcheverry Senators, v.1.0: Walter Johnson Senators, v.2.0: Frank Howard ---
**Author:** ![etv78](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/d78d45/32.png) [@etv78](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/etv78)\ **Post date:** [December 23, 2012, 5:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-face-of-the-franchise-for-each-major-sports-team-in-your-city/639058/127 "2012-12-23T05:45:21Z")
All-time Redskin has to be Baugh! [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-face-of-the-franchise-for-each-major-sports-team-in-your-city/639058.md?page=6)