# Who is the greatest manager of all time?
**URL:** https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602
**Category:** The Game Room
**Created:** [March 13, 2012, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602 "2012-03-13T00:05:44Z")
**Posts on this page:** 20
**Page:** 1
### Author:  [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)
#### Post date: [March 13, 2012, 12:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/1 "2012-03-13T00:05:44Z")
A simple one vote poll and feel free to explain your vote or argue over others.
Alphabetical order. Should be someone for everyone.
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### Author:  [@FordTaurusSHO94](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FordTaurusSHO94)
#### Post date: [March 13, 2012, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/2 "2012-03-13T00:06:50Z")
Jim Cornette gets my vote. He always had great stables, could work a mic, and has some pretty funny shoots out there! There’s not a poll yet if you’re adding one though. 😉
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### Author:  [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)
#### Post date: [March 13, 2012, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/3 "2012-03-13T03:06:30Z")
I want to like **SHO** ’s post so bad it hurts.
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### Author:  [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)
#### Post date: [March 13, 2012, 5:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/4 "2012-03-13T17:28:02Z")
I like Billyball. Be aggressive on the bases and make the other team make the play defensively. Too many managers play for the bloop and the blast, not enough try to manufacture runs the way Billy did.
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### Author:  [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)
#### Post date: [March 13, 2012, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/5 "2012-03-13T17:32:43Z")
As a Yankee fan who saw a LOT of the Orioles over the years, I voted for Earl Weaver- the first manager to try to make effective use of stats, and the first to extol the virtues of pitching, defense and 3-run homers."
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### Author:  [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)
#### Post date: [March 14, 2012, 12:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/6 "2012-03-14T00:22:19Z")
The love for Weaver is killing me. I hated him. Not getting the Cox love either. To me Joe McCarthy & John McGraw are the 2 top ones. Though Martin will probably always be my favorite.
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### Author:  [@RickJay](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RickJay)
#### Post date: [March 14, 2012, 5:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/7 "2012-03-14T05:03:40Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#):
>
> The love for Weaver is killing me. I hated him. Not getting the Cox love either.
They won ballgames.
What else do you want in a manager?
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### Author:  [@Smapti](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Smapti)
#### Post date: [March 14, 2012, 5:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/8 "2012-03-14T05:37:26Z")
No option for Jimmy Hart? This poll title is FLAGRANTLY misleading.
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### Author:  [@Chicagojeff](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chicagojeff)
#### Post date: [March 14, 2012, 2:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/9 "2012-03-14T14:06:00Z")
> [@FordTaurusSHO94](#):
>
> Jim Cornette gets my vote. He always had great stables, could work a mic, and has some pretty funny shoots out there! There’s not a poll yet if you’re adding one though. 😉
Plus he could always call momma for more money.. and he worked a good tennis racquet!!
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### Author:  [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)
#### Post date: [March 14, 2012, 2:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/10 "2012-03-14T14:30:28Z")
> [@RickJay](#):
>
> They won ballgames.
>
> What else do you want in a manager?
But that still should lead to different votes. Neither is tops in wins or pct. Neither had success with more then one team.
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### Author:  [@astorian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astorian)
#### Post date: [March 14, 2012, 2:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/11 "2012-03-14T14:55:05Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#):
>
> But that still should lead to different votes. Neither is tops in wins or pct. Neither had success with more then one team.
Earl Weaver probably WOULD have had great records with multiple teams, but his FIRST team never saw any reason to fire him! Why would you hold THAT against him?
Again, I’m a Yankee fan, so it’s not as if I LIKED seeing the Orioles succeed! Earl Weaver irritated the crap out of me, in large measure BECAUSE he was so good!
As for Billy Martin… look, I admired Billy tremendously, but there’s a REASON he kept getting fired, and it’s not JUST that Steinbrenner was a jerk. Billy Martin could and DID regularly get teams to play over their heads. Billy could take a lousy team and get them to play .500, and he could take a mediocre team and have them flirting with the pennant. All that’s true.
But it’s ALSO true that he was a drunk, a bully and a racist who almost always alienated his players (especially the black ones) in the long run.
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### Author:  [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)
#### Post date: [March 14, 2012, 2:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/12 "2012-03-14T14:56:53Z")
I voted for Connie Mack mostly for being a pioneer. I know he had a losing record, but he did it forever and has 1000 more wins than the 2nd closest manager.
I do believe any manager can look good with a dream team roster. McCarthy, Stengel and Torre all had teams that could just blow everyone else out of the water. I don’t think it made a lot of difference who managed them.
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### Author:  [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)
#### Post date: [March 14, 2012, 3:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/13 "2012-03-14T15:16:54Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#):
>
> But that still should lead to different votes. Neither is tops in wins or pct. Neither had success with more then one team.
Cox was successful with Toronto.
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### Author:  [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)
#### Post date: [March 14, 2012, 6:57pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/14 "2012-03-14T18:57:39Z")
> [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#):
>
> I voted for Connie Mack mostly for being a pioneer. I know he had a losing record, but he did it forever and has 1000 more wins than the 2nd closest manager.
>
> I do believe any manager can look good with a dream team roster. McCarthy, Stengel and Torre all had teams that could just blow everyone else out of the water. I don’t think it made a lot of difference who managed them.
Check McCarthy’s record more, he gets my vote for what he did with his others teams. This is where he seems way better then Stengel or Torre as an example.
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### Author:  [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Barkis_is_Willin)
#### Post date: [March 14, 2012, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/15 "2012-03-14T19:31:00Z")
Other teams, meaning teams other than the Yankees? Did he take any other teams to a WS? His ridiculous run of championships, while quite impressive, was with pretty stacked Yankees teams.
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### Author:  [@What\_Exit](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/What_Exit)
#### Post date: [March 14, 2012, 11:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/16 "2012-03-14T23:17:52Z")
> [@Barkis\_is\_Willin](#):
>
> Other teams, meaning teams other than the Yankees? Did he take any other teams to a WS? His ridiculous run of championships, while quite impressive, was with pretty stacked Yankees teams.
> **[Joe McCarthy Managerial Record | Baseball-Reference.com](https://www.baseball-reference.com/managers/mccarjo99.shtml)**
>
> Joe McCarthy Managerial Record
Yes, he took the freaking Cubs to the World Series and the Red Sox to 2 seconds and a third losing out to the greatest of the Yankee runs.
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### Author:  [@RTFirefly](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/RTFirefly)
#### Post date: [March 15, 2012, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/17 "2012-03-15T15:14:55Z")
Here’s the difference between Billy Martin and Earl Weaver.
Martin would light a fire under a team to play WAY over their heads for a year, maybe two, then they’d burn out.
Weaver’s teams played several games over their heads, year after year. From the mid-1970s on, they had to, to compete with the Yankees.
Martin would be the perfect manager for trying to get a championship out of an aging team that you knew would be mediocre at best in 2-3 years. But you’d be crazy to give him the controls of a young team that had the potential to be contenders for years to come, because they might realize their potential this year and next, but never again.
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### Author:  [@FoieGrasIsEvil](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FoieGrasIsEvil)
#### Post date: [March 15, 2012, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/18 "2012-03-15T15:20:55Z")
Sparky Anderson.
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### Author:  [@Tom\_Scud](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Scud)
#### Post date: [March 15, 2012, 3:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/19 "2012-03-15T15:22:37Z")
> [@What\_Exit](#):
>
> [Joe McCarthy Managerial Record | Baseball-Reference.com](http://www.baseball-reference.com/managers/mccarjo99.shtml)
>
> Yes, he took the freaking Cubs to the World Series and the Red Sox to 2 seconds and a third losing out to the greatest of the Yankee runs.
That was before the Cubs were the Cubs, though; they were in the World Series twice more in the five years after he left and had a winning record three of the five years before he arrived. He wasn’t a total screw-up in his non-Yankee years, but it’s not like he was Bobby Cox turning the Blue Jays into perennial contenders, either.
ETA: and with that, a vote for Cox.
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### Author:  [@StusBlues](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/StusBlues)
#### Post date: [March 15, 2012, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-is-the-greatest-manager-of-all-time/615602/20 "2012-03-15T16:18:40Z")
> [@Tom\_Scud](#):
>
> That was before the Cubs were the Cubs, though; they were in the World Series twice more in the five years after he left and had a winning record three of the five years before he arrived. He wasn’t a total screw-up in his non-Yankee years, but it’s not like he was Bobby Cox turning the Blue Jays into perennial contenders, either.
Before Joe McCarthy managed him, Hack Wilson could barely stay in the league.
Under McCarthy for five years, the guy set records that are still standing into the steroid era.
After McCarthy left, Wilson disintegrated and was out of the league in under four seasons.
That’s the kind of manager McCarthy was, always getting superlative performances out of talented players. It’s harder to discern for his Yankee years because guys like DiMaggio played their entire careers for the guy–there’s no “control” group. Yes, he was blessed with managing Babe Ruth, Ted Williams, and Lou Gehrig, but you have to give the man some credit.
My favorite Joe McCarthy story comes from when he took over the Red Sox. McCarthy always enforced a strict dress code, and he was tasked with managing Ted Williams who steadfastly refused to wear a tie. McCarthy defused the situation by showing up to his first press conference in a sport shirt, saything “if I can’t get along with a .400 hitter, that’s my problem.”
McCarthy’s handling of Wilson and Williams was a lot like Phil Jackson’s handling of Dennis Rodman and Kobe Bryant. He didn’t give away the store to his superstars (he released Grover Cleveland Alexander for his unrepentant drinking habits), but he knew that he’d get much further with compromise than he would being a martinet.
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