# Who Killed Jesus? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [March 29, 2009, 7:47am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168 "2009-03-29T07:47:12Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 11\ **Page:** 34
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2009, 2:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168/662 "2009-04-16T02:32:16Z")
> [@Lacunae\_Quell](#): > > Why do you try to make it look like I _actually_ believe bears or penguins helped create Eve? Why can’t you mention the fact I believe it was Extraterrestrial Biological Entities that helped create Eve from Adam’s rib with a cloning process that humankind still hasn’t perfected? Sheesh… bears and penguins cloning people is just silly. And EBEs are not? Now the problem is that we have no way of knowing what odd things you believe and what odd things you are going to scramble away from, crying “it was a joke.” Yes, I realized that the bears and penguins thing was a joke, but if the EBE thing is a joke it is a poor one and if it is not a joke it further indicates a really silly belief–and there is no way for any of us to distinguish which is which based on your posting history. You’ve gotten a lot more wrong about scripture than the Abraham/Isaac story and your claims about scripture trumping science are totally unsupported by anything you have posted–especially given the large number of Christians who belief in scripturte yet accept the facts presented by science. You have provided no reason for anyone to accept your 130 year old version of scripture over the older traditions of Christianity and Judaism. You simply post your beliefs in the midst of bad jokes and worse logic. You might want to consider the following comment from St. Augustine of Hippo in his examination of Genesis: > [@](#): > > Chapter 19 > > Usually, even a non-Christian knows something about the earth, the heavens, and the other elements of this world, about the motion and orbit of the stars and even their size and relative positions, about the predictable eclipses of the sun and moon, the cycles of the years and the seasons, about the kinds of animals, shrubs, stones, and so forth, and this knowledge he holds to as being certain from reason and experience. Now, it is a disgraceful and dangerous thing for an infidel to hear a Christian, presumably giving the meaning of Holy Scripture, talking non-sense on these topics; and we should take all means to prevent such an embarrassing situation, in which people show up vast ignorance in a Christian and laugh it to scorn. The shame is not so much that an ignorant individual is derided, but that people outside the household of the faith think our sacred writers held such opinions, and, to the great loss of those for whose salvation we toil, the writers of our Scripture are criticized and rejected as unlearned men. If they find a Christian mistaken in a field which they themselves know well and hear him maintaining his foolish opinions about our books, how are they going to believe those books in matters concerning the resurrection of the dead, the hope of eternal life, and the kingdom of heaven, when they think their pages are full of falsehoods on facts which they themselves have learnt from experience and the light of reason? Reckless and incompetent expounders of holy Scripture bring untold trouble and sorrow on their wiser brethren when they are caught in one of their mischievous false opinions and are taken to task by those who are not bound by the authority of our sacred books. For then, to defend their utterly foolish and obviously untrue statements, they will try to call upon Holy Scripture for proof and even recite from memory many passages which they think support their position, although “they understand neither what they say nor the things about which they make assertion.” The “mockery” you see is exactly what he claimed would happen to the Christian message when believers tried to impose religious beliefs on factual knowledge. The only ignorance being demonstrated is yours and you are using it to debase God’s word. ---
**Author:** ![Lacunae\_Quell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lacunae\_Quell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lacunae_Quell)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2009, 2:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168/663 "2009-04-16T02:34:53Z")
> [@GIGObuster](#): > > Yes, but then one has to learn to act from the new information, dropping the Apologetic Press as a cite would be a good beginning. > > There had been times where I was shown to be wrong here and in other threads, but I got better when I acknowledged the mistake and learned from it. I’m not using it for it’s scientific evidences anymore… I’m using it for it’s Biblical and Scriptural perspectives and truths. I’ve said from the very beginning I believe in evolution (to an extent) and that I believe the earth is billions of years old. I have stated I was using the “scientific evidence for a young earth” for the sake of argument. However, when Apologetic Press puts down the science books and picks up the Bible, they are right on. Just because they don’t know science doesn’t mean they don’t know God and His Word. ---
**Author:** ![Lacunae\_Quell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lacunae\_Quell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lacunae_Quell)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2009, 2:36am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168/664 "2009-04-16T02:36:07Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > Not bad for a first step, but why don’t you go ahead and scroll back up to the top of the page and read what it says under the words **THE STRAIGHT DOPE**. Let him who is without ignorance cast the first stone. ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2009, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168/665 "2009-04-16T02:42:48Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > You might want to consider the following comment from St. Augustine of Hippo in his examination of Genesis:The “mockery” you see is exactly what he claimed would happen to the Christian message when believers tried to impose religious beliefs on factual knowledge. (snort of feigned derision) Augustine? Catholic propaganda. 😉 \<–if my parenthetical comment weren’t enough) ---
**Author:** ![dropzone](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/dropzone/32/7515_2.png) [@dropzone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/dropzone)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2009, 2:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168/666 "2009-04-16T02:45:56Z")
> [@Lacunae\_Quell](#): > > Let him who is without ignorance cast the first stone. Dude. Really, dude. Some people accept that the are ignorant about some things while others spray-paint whole message boards with their ignorance. You are showing all of the signs of being one of the latter. I hope you SIT DOWN AND SHUT UP long enough to figure out that the former is the more profitable place to be. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2009, 3:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168/667 "2009-04-16T03:30:04Z")
**Lacunae Quell** , whenever you are confronted, you quote scripture as supporting your position as if this was the final word, the Word Of God, and cannot be challenged. What you seem to be unable to understand is there are many of us who do not think that scripture is any more valid, holy, accurate or worthy of our attention than any other woefully ignorant book, a product of its primitive time, laughable in its pretention, unoriginal in its content, and offensive in its morals. So your quotes are worthless in our eyes. Now you may be right, or we may be right, but if the only arguments you can make are scripture quotes, we will continue to scoff and point at the abysmal ignorance on display. So if you want to be taken seriously, you will try to prove, _from non self-referential quotes,_ that this ridiculous book should be taken seriously anywhere at all. And even if there is one small element of truth in the Bible that we can all agree on – and there probably is – that doesn’t make the rest any more worthy of consideration without corresponding rigorous proof. In short, you are basing your entire argument on something that you believe without offering any proof. Your assertions carry absolutely no weight with the scientific community because they are only psychotic assertions. ---
**Author:** ![Locrian](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/locrian/32/14146_2.png) [@Locrian](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Locrian)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2009, 3:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168/668 "2009-04-16T03:40:23Z")
> [@Lacunae\_Quell](#): > > Let him who is without ignorance cast the first stone. And a woman picked up a large rock,threw it at the accused and the accused died a bloody death. Jesus turned to the woman and said, “You REALLY know how to piss me off, MOM!” ---
**Author:** ![tomndebb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/b9e5f3/32.png) [@tomndebb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tomndebb)\ **Post date:** [April 16, 2009, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168/669 "2009-04-16T12:34:56Z")
I guess I should have gone back and re-read the thread after I hit Submit on my last post.: > [@Lacunae\_Quell](#): > > **Trolling** – > > Definition: > . . . > > B.) Please note the bold italics. That is describing you, my friend. > . . . > Z.) There are plenty of “trolls” posting in this thread and I am not one of them. I guess no one has noticed I’m a pacifist, but I will defend myself, and though I try not to resort to the mockery and insults the majority of the people here use, I am a product of my environment, and if you can dish it out I would most certainly expect you to be able to digest the same thing when it’s force fed to you. The truth is it’s not very pleasant… is it? > > EFGHIJKLMNOPQRSTUVWXY.) The golden rule is a bitch, ain’t it? **Quell** , you are out of line. If you wish to accuse other posters of trolling, the ONLY forum where that is permitted is the **BBQ Pit**. Do not do this again. [/Moderating] ---
**Author:** ![Lacunae\_Quell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lacunae\_Quell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lacunae_Quell)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2009, 1:45am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168/670 "2009-04-17T01:45:13Z")
> [@tomndebb](#): > > I guess I should have gone back and re-read the thread after I hit Submit on my last post.: > **Quell** , you are out of line. If you wish to accuse other posters of trolling, the ONLY forum where that is permitted is the **BBQ Pit**. > > Do not do this again. > > [/Moderating] please forgive me… I didn’t know that was not allowed. However, I was just defending myself when someone called me a “troll” and I was defining it to show that it did not describe me. I notice now that the person who said I was trolling sent me a link to the BBQ pit. I am really sorry… thank you for the warning. ---
**Author:** ![Lacunae\_Quell](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lacunae\_Quell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lacunae_Quell)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2009, 1:53am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168/671 "2009-04-17T01:53:36Z")
Scratch the last part of my last post that says “I notice now that the person who said I was trolling sent me a link to the BBQ pit”… They actually said that to me in this thread and just sent a link to that post… I now remember that person getting a warning for posting that, but I didn’t remember it when I posted the definition of “trolling”. Again… thank you for the warning, **Tom** , and I won’t let it happen again. ---
**Author:** ![FinnAgain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/finnagain/32/12500_2.png) [@FinnAgain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/FinnAgain)\ **Post date:** [April 17, 2009, 2:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168/672 "2009-04-17T02:08:18Z")
Simply for the record, I did not post any accusations in this thread, the accusations are in the Pit which is the proper place for them. I also received no warning, as the Pit is the proper place to discuss such behavior. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-killed-jesus/491168.md?page=33)