# Who, Like Joe Paterno, Has Suffered Posthumous Disgrace? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [August 2, 2012, 12:19am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124 "2012-08-02T00:19:47Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Gyrate](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gyrate/32/3588_2.png) [@Gyrate](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gyrate)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/21 "2012-08-02T12:50:13Z")
Hitler! ---
**Author:** ![Lunar\_Saltlick](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/977dab/32.png) [@Lunar\_Saltlick](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lunar_Saltlick)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 12:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/22 "2012-08-02T12:50:34Z")
I have to go with JFK. I don’t think anyone has bit the posthumous dust in quite so complete a fashion as JFK. Even his greatest sympathizers can’t deny what a sleaze bucket he was. Read the latest issue of The Atlantic where one of his great admirers pens an article admitting what an absolutely atrocious person he was, but she loves him nonetheless because of the way he looked lovingly at his kids! Honestly, I was born in the mid-sixties, and JFK worship was one of the principles of my youth. But today? Christ, there isn’t an article or book written about him that doesn’t detail behaviour more sordid than the last article or book. It’s astonishing how far he’s fallen. The only other name in this thread where the person was positively idolized is Paterno, and as noted, he fell in stature before passing. ---
**Author:** ![minlokwat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/minlokwat/32/2844_2.png) [@minlokwat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/minlokwat)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 1:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/23 "2012-08-02T13:33:50Z")
> [@The\_Surb](#): > > My vote is David Carradine. I liked him in Kill Bill. I’ve read his autobiography and he seemed to be a fairly interesting person. I just wish he would have croaked in a bit more dignified manner. First one I thought of. That death by accidental auto-erotic asphyxiation thing is by far the most humiliating way to be found dead. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/24 "2012-08-02T14:26:09Z")
Walter Cronkite-a prejudiced, lying creep-and cheap to boot! Along with JFK-the entire Kennedy family-closest thing to a Mafia crime family . The odd thing-the family was revered for years-till the truth started coming out. The latest action: the family “gave” the Hyannisport House (built by Joe Kennedy) to a foundation controlled by the family. This means that: -the family got a tremendous tax write-off for the value of the property -the Town of Hyannis now loses $50,000/year in property taxes -the taxpayers of MA now pay to maintain the place -the Kennedy family gets to use it for free! Such a generous gift! ---
**Author:** ![Viridiana](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/ebca7d/32.png) [@Viridiana](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Viridiana)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 6:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/25 "2012-08-02T18:10:15Z")
Chris Benoit? Admittedly the pre-disgrace loving tribute didn’t last long, but I distinctly remember seeing some! ---
**Author:** ![GrandWino](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/grandwino/32/67_2.png) [@GrandWino](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GrandWino)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 9:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/26 "2012-08-02T21:00:03Z")
[Alfred Hitchcock has been getting some pretty bad press](http://www.cinemablend.com/new/Tippi-Hedren-Calls-Alfred-Hitchcock-Evil-Talks-Sexual-Harassment-32271.html) recently due to stories Tippi Hedren has told about him. > [@](#): > > Tippi Hedren, who starred in the classic Hitchcock horrors The Birds and Marnie, bad-mouthed the famed director during a panel discussion sponsored by HBO (via TheWrap). Describing Hitch as “sad,” Hedren went on to say: > “We are dealing with a brain here that was an unusual genius, and evil, and deviant, almost to the point of dangerous, because of the effect that he could have on people that were totally unsuspecting.” > > The panel was being held on behalf of The Girl, director Julian Jarrold’s recounting of the time spent on the set of The Birds, with Sienna Miller playing Hedren and Toby Jones cast as the Master of Suspense. The movie makes all sorts of accusations, claiming Hitchcock forced a kiss on Hedren in the back seat of a car and made work conditions hazardous by forcing her to work with live birds for days on end. Hedren, 82, claims, “He ruined my career but he didn’t ruin my life. If this had happened today i would be a very rich woman.” ---
**Author:** ![Kasper1014](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/c89c15/32.png) [@Kasper1014](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Kasper1014)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/27 "2012-08-02T22:32:43Z")
Charles Kuralt. After he died, it came out he had a second, secret family no one knew about. ---
**Author:** ![Tapiotar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3be4f8/32.png) [@Tapiotar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapiotar)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 10:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/28 "2012-08-02T22:41:29Z")
Lenin. It took a long time before the statues started coming down. ---
**Author:** ![Tapiotar](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/3be4f8/32.png) [@Tapiotar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tapiotar)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 10:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/29 "2012-08-02T22:43:41Z")
> [@Diceman](#): > > He _was_ a philandering sleaze. That has been well-documented and is beyond question. As for the mob connections, there have always been rumors that the Kennedy family fortune came from bootlegging during Prohibition. Yup. Not retconning. Much was already known about him/the family back in his day. Media still kept private life somewhat private. There was some roman a clef novel modeled on the Kennedy family and Joe’s ambitions for his descendents… ---
**Author:** ![SpoilerVirgin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/4491bb/32.png) [@SpoilerVirgin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SpoilerVirgin)\ **Post date:** [August 2, 2012, 10:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/30 "2012-08-02T22:58:05Z")
[António Egas Moniz](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ant%C3%B3nio_Egas_Moniz), who won the Nobel prize for developing lobotomy as a cure for mental illness. After his death in 1955, the procedure was rapidly discredited, and his reputation along with it. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 2:35am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/31 "2012-08-03T02:35:48Z")
> [@panache45](#): > > J. Edgar Hoover. Notoriously homophobic and racist . . . until the whole “dressing up” thing came out. He was a meglomaniac, no doubt. But the cross-dressing thing is a base canard. ---
**Author:** ![Gleena](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/b3f665/32.png) [@Gleena](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gleena)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 3:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/32 "2012-08-03T03:44:53Z")
> [@ralph124c](#): > > Walter Cronkite-a prejudiced, lying creep-and cheap to boot! Could you help me with how you formed this opinion? ---
**Author:** ![tellyworth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/977dab/32.png) [@tellyworth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tellyworth)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 4:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/33 "2012-08-03T04:05:30Z")
> [@antonio107](#): > > Has it? We study Freudian theories while doing cultural theory stuff; it’s dated, sure, but it laid the framework for a lot of the hard science psychology that came after it. I didn’t know that he was outright despised or reviled by anyone in or outside of psychology, unless I’m missing something… Not outright reviled, but [largely discredited](http://www.nytimes.com/2007/11/25/weekinreview/25cohen.html?_r=4&ref=education&oref&oref=slogin) as far as modern psychology is concerned. ---
**Author:** ![MandaJo](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/ac91a4/32.png) [@MandaJo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MandaJo)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 8:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/34 "2012-08-03T08:23:59Z")
Mary Wollstonecraft was a well-respected writer until her husband published a memoir of her posthumously. He was motivated by sincere affection and admiration, but the details of her rather unorthodox life (affairs, a daughter born out of wedlock, suicide attempts) ruined her reputation for a couple hundred years. ---
**Author:** ![Koxinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/4af34b/32.png) [@Koxinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Koxinga)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 9:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/35 "2012-08-03T09:34:56Z")
Many if not most Roman emperors. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [August 3, 2012, 4:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/36 "2012-08-03T16:29:33Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > Stephen Ambrose. It seems as though the great popular historian was also a great popular plagiarist. That and he fabricated having access and interviewing Eisenhower. Eisenhower’s papers keepers have detailed records of whom he met and when, and Ambrose’s stuff does not match up. It may be that they never show any meetings/interviews as I recall. That said, Ambrose plagarized sections, not whole chapters. He was an entertaining writer. As for JFK being a philanderer, I could care less. I’m 50 and have known about it since the early 70s. Man cheats on wife is a failing, but not on a Joe Paterno level. And I’m sorry about how David Carradine died. It doesn’t make me think less of him, other than that it was stupid. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 1:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/37 "2012-08-04T01:34:05Z")
> [@The\_Second\_Stone](#): > > As for JFK being a philanderer, I could care less. I’m 50 and have known about it since the early 70s. Man cheats on wife is a failing, but not on a Joe Paterno level. . Right, men in power are horndogs. Big deal. JFK was one of our greatest presidents. I think the GOP has embarked on another of their disinformation campaigns here. ---
**Author:** ![Superhal](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/b4bc9f/32.png) [@Superhal](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Superhal)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 3:03am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/38 "2012-08-04T03:03:43Z")
I don’t think David Carradine counts because the point of this thread was “someone who fell from grace after death.” In other words, you have to be highly regarded first before you can fall. If you’re already scraping the bottom of the barrel, it’s not a fall. It would be like Paris Hilton, the Kardashians, or one of the previous winners of Survivor being caught in a child molestation scandal. Overall though, I don’t think there’s anybody who became really hated after their death (with the prerequisite of being loved during their lives) because there’s always die-hard fans who will love them forever and history tends to forget the worst of what they did. My vote would be for Thomas Jefferson. I think having sex with your slaves is one of the worst things someone can do. Oh, thought of more: Todd Bridges and Dana Plato, although their later actions could have been caused by childhood trauma. ---
**Author:** ![astro](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/9dc877/32.png) [@astro](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/astro)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 4:30am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/39 "2012-08-04T04:30:43Z")
I think the documented [sexual orgies and affairs](http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2011/08/02/fbi-director-hoover-s-dirty-files-excerpt-from-ronald-kessler-s-the-secrets-of-the-fbi.html)Martin Luther King indulged in did put a bit of tarnish on the man as a moral leader, although his civil rights legacy is paramount in his historical impact. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [August 4, 2012, 4:43am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124/40 "2012-08-04T04:43:12Z")
> [@Superhal](#): > > My vote would be for Thomas Jefferson. I think having sex with your slaves is one of the worst things someone can do.. That’s what is called “Presentism”= judging the heroes of the past by the standards of today. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-like-joe-paterno-has-suffered-posthumous-disgrace/630124.md?page=3)