# Who, or what, is your favorite villain? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [July 2, 2023, 3:56am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435 "2023-07-02T03:56:52Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Eclipse\_Chaser](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/5daacb/32.png) [@Eclipse\_Chaser](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eclipse_Chaser)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2023, 4:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/101 "2023-07-03T16:50:08Z")
I have to admit to a fondness for Gul Dukat from Deep Space Nine. His voice! ---
**Author:** ![Encinitas](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/ee7513/32.png) [@Encinitas](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Encinitas)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2023, 9:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/102 "2023-07-03T21:31:34Z")
The Shrike The Grinch ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2023, 9:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/103 "2023-07-03T21:51:27Z")
I would kill to see that crossover - “How the Shrike Stole Christmas”. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2023, 10:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/104 "2023-07-03T22:27:09Z")
Has Christoph Waltz’ **Hans Landa** from _Inglourious Basterds_ been mentioned yet? ---
**Author:** ![Roderick\_Femm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/roderick_femm/32/14875_2.png) [@Roderick\_Femm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Roderick_Femm)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2023, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/105 "2023-07-03T23:27:15Z")
> [@John\_DiFool](#): > > Also a bit surprised that Saruman is also MIA. Saruman is certainly a much more hate-able villain than Sauron (or, to my mind, Morgoth). Saruman did bad because he wanted to. He was jealous and spiteful of anything that was kind and gentle and good – he tried to destroy such things, not because they were in the way of his quest for power, but because they offended him. Even after losing nearly everything in his defeat, he did his best to poison the well for the least of those who defeated him. > [@Encinitas](#): > > The Shrike From Hyperion? I thought it was more or less an automaton set up by someone somewhen to do some specific task (I forget what exactly, it had to do with the time tombs and whatnot). Was it supposed to have been self-directing? I sure missed that, if so. Those first two books were very hard for me to parse. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2023, 11:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/106 "2023-07-03T23:37:56Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I would kill to see that crossover - “How the Shrike Stole Christmas”. I now see all the inhabitants of Whoville impaled and writhing on a tree of thorns for eternity. Yet somehow, despite the anguish, singing a happy song of peace and goodwill. Sadly though, I don’t think the Shrike’s heart will grow any sizes that or any other day. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2023, 11:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/107 "2023-07-03T23:45:28Z")
> [@MrDibble](#): > > Jareth from _Labyrinth_. A favorite character of mine, but I’d be hard pressed to consider him a villain. After all, he’s (arguably) fey, and not taking any action of his own volition. After all, as he repeatedly pointed out, he just did what was asked of him… But this is not a fair nitpick, after all, the OP did say _any_ definition of villain, and he’s certainly the main antagonist of the story. > [@The\_Stainless\_Steel\_Rat](#): > > Ok, I’ll go there. Thanos is the best type of villain as while he is a mass murder on a Galactic scale, there is a central purpose to his actions and a…call it a philosophy…that he is dedicated too, as monstrous as we think it is. He truly believes what he is doing is for the greater good of the universe and that is goal is not to rule, but to retire. There is…humanity, for lack of a better word, in his villainly. IMHO as always. Which brings me to something I disliked intensely in Endgame. The Thanos that shows true emotion in killing his own beloved, adopted daughter but manages it for the theoretical greater good, and who retires with few concerns after accomplishing his goals is replaced with a version just a few years younger that shows none of the nuance. He’s just there to grab the power, with little to no mention of his goals, or even wondering on how those involved may actually know if his goals were successful or (as they would in any rational understanding) rife with unforeseen consequences. The thinking villain replaced with a brute as it were. Of course, I often joked that the OG Thanos was part of the worst self-projection of a smart, whiney, self-absorbed teen in the middle of his first crush. He loves someone (Death) and uses all of his considerable intellect to impress her, despite Death’s total ignorance or care for his existence. And he keeps on doing it! ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 12:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/108 "2023-07-04T00:23:46Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > I would kill to see that crossover - “How the Shrike Stole Christmas”. Okay, this is weird: > Kassad was traumatised by this experience, he decided to retreat military service and came back to Hyperion in order to kill the Grinch and Moneta. > **[Fedmahn Kassad](https://hyperioncantos.fandom.com/wiki/Fedmahn_Kassad)** > > Colonel Fedmahn Kassad was a soldier serving under the FORCE and a main character in Hyperion and The Fall of Hyperion as one of the Seven Pilgrims to engage in the Final Shrike Pilgrimage on the planet of Hyperion. Kassad was born on Mars,... Bottom of the page. ---
**Author:** ![Railer13](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/railer13/32/9742_2.png) [@Railer13](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Railer13)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 12:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/109 "2023-07-04T00:34:28Z")
Cersei Lannister. ---
**Author:** ![silenus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/silenus/32/166_2.png) [@silenus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/silenus)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 1:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/110 "2023-07-04T01:10:09Z")
> [@Alessan](#): > > and in general dragged the city kicking and screaming into the Century of the Fruitbat. And later into the Century of the Anchovy. Hardly a villain. Often an antagonist, however. My faves: Angelus, Spike and Dru The New Firm The Eternal Emperor Niska Alfred Bester The Shadows & the Vorlons ---
**Author:** ![Balthisar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/balthisar/32/2825_2.png) [@Balthisar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Balthisar)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 1:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/111 "2023-07-04T01:22:26Z")
Darth Vader. Perhaps it’s the juvenile choice, but I was five years old when I got to know the fellow. ---
**Author:** ![ParallelLines](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/parallellines/32/3575_2.png) [@ParallelLines](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ParallelLines)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/112 "2023-07-04T02:06:07Z")
I approve of your B5 choices, both in the clear and spoiler-vision! ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 5:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/113 "2023-07-04T05:15:47Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > A favorite character of mine, but I’d be hard pressed to consider him a villain If the wannabe-kiddie-fuckery doesn’t make him a villain in your eyes, I can’t help you there. > [@ParallelLines](#): > > After all, he’s (arguably) fey …and? Let’s see, I know this one “Elves are terrific - they beget terror”. Fey can be very, very villainous. > [@ParallelLines](#): > > After all, as he repeatedly pointed out, he just did what was asked of him… Yeah, ask the Nazis how that defence holds… ---
**Author:** ![Stanislaus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/stanislaus/32/3391_2.png) [@Stanislaus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stanislaus)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 8:29am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/114 "2023-07-04T08:29:03Z")
JP from Bad Sisters. If you haven’t seen it, it’s a bleakly comic drama about 5 sisters, that opens with the funeral of JP, husband of one sister. The other four sisters are extremely nervous, we find, about the life insurance company asking questions about how he died. The parallel flashback/present day structure reveals to us that 6 months ago they made a pact to kill JP. And tehy did this because he was a monster. It is an amazing performance by Claes Bang, in that he makes a character who is utterly hateable. JP is a proper sociopath - superficially charming, highly manipulative, devoid of empathy and utterly ruthless. As you go through the series you learn just how much he hates women, in particular his wife, his sisters in law and even his own daughter. He only very rarely employs even the threat of violence against his wife - but through mental abuse, constant undermining and emotional manipulation is well on the way to destroying her as a person. It becomes clear that the decision to kill him is essentially an act of desperation - he is so good at manipulation and cruelty that there is no legitimate to way to confront or attack him. Those who do lash out in anger and frustration find themselves publicly embarrassed to no good end, and usually looking like they are crazy, jealous or dangerous. He easily manipulates authority to get away with his campaigns of cruelty. He is, in short a total bastard who provokes in the audience and other characters only hate and fear and whose ultimate comeuppance is entirely satisfying. Which is everything you need from a villain. ---
**Author:** ![outlierrn](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/outlierrn/32/3005_2.png) [@outlierrn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/outlierrn)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 9:34am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/115 "2023-07-04T09:34:08Z")
**The Operative** from Serenity **Hud** Upvoting **Hans Landa, Hans Gruber** and **Hannibal Lecter** ---
**Author:** ![Knowed\_Out](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/knowed_out/32/7380_2.png) [@Knowed\_Out](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knowed_Out)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 11:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/116 "2023-07-04T11:33:27Z")
I don’t remember which movie, but I remember a clip of Sherlock Holmes’s archenemy Moriarity just after his butler shaved him. I’m paraphrasing here, but the ensuing conversation went something like this: Moriarity: Hodgkins, why didn’t you slice my neck? Butler: Sir? Moriarity: I was at my most vulnerable state and you could have ended my life in seconds. Butler: Why sir, I would never… Moriarity: I mistreat you, I constantly abuse and belittle you, yet you do nothing. Butler: But sir… Moriarity: It’s because you’re sheep. You’re a weak, spineless minion who’s only purpose in life is to be the object of my scorn. Butler: Yes, sir. Moriarity: Face it Hodgkins. You have as much hatred for me as I have contempt for you. Butler: Yes, sir. Moriarity: Now get out of my sight. You disgust me. Butler: Of course, sir. ---
**Author:** ![nicky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f0a364/32.png) [@nicky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nicky)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 12:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/117 "2023-07-04T12:30:39Z")
The mighty mighty MONARCH ---
**Author:** ![nicky](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/f0a364/32.png) [@nicky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/nicky)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 12:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/118 "2023-07-04T12:31:56Z")
Oh and yeah, “keyser soze” doesnt exist. He is a bogeyman invented by a fraudster to scam criminals. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 2:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/119 "2023-07-04T14:02:24Z")
> [@ParallelLines](#): > > A favorite character of mine, but I’d be hard pressed to consider him a villain. After all, he’s (arguably) fey, and not taking any action of his own volition. After all, as he repeatedly pointed out, he just did what was asked of him… Villainy by doing just exactly what mortals want is kind of the trademark move of fey. ---
**Author:** ![Projammer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/projammer/32/559_2.png) [@Projammer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Projammer)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2023, 3:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435/120 "2023-07-04T15:09:05Z")
I’m going to have to go with Loki. It’s all about the attitude. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-or-what-is-your-favorite-villain/986435.md?page=7)