# Who scores modern music? (assuming the band has not done it) **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Tags:** music\ **Created:** [May 21, 2023, 7:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366 "2023-05-21T19:34:11Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Richard\_Pearse](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/richard_pearse/32/13144_2.png) [@Richard\_Pearse](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Pearse)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 11:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/21 "2023-05-22T11:51:01Z")
Thanks. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 12:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/22 "2023-05-22T12:23:28Z")
Your career sounds amazingly cool. Thanks for the answer! ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 12:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/23 "2023-05-22T12:28:42Z")
Yeah, he’s got some interesting stories if you’re into the nitty gritty of that scene. I never addressed your OP, but if you’re also just simply asking who does the music notation for those Youtube videos, it’s typically the video producer themselves from what I can tell. (If they’re lucky, they may be able to already find a transcription, which is addressed in the other posts as to where those come from.) Yes, it’s a skill that can be learned and practiced and certain genres, like jazz, often require transcribing out solos as part of the learning process. Stuff like transcribing the rhythm in that Immigrant Song clip you linked to is fairly basic transcription and shouldn’t require tracking down a score or anything. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 12:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/24 "2023-05-22T12:34:49Z")
I have to say I am a bit confused how a drum part is put to sheet music. As mentioned before, drum kits can vary a lot. Look at the drum kit Neil Peart played versus almost anyone else. Peart had a HUGE drum setup. How do you write sheet music for Peart playing drums? (He’s an extreme case but we can walk it down to any drum kit which my differ from the next drum kit.) [![](https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2020/01/11/gettyimages-134591594-23d365ada00e44e9736f1d75d47df4c167801e3b.jpg) ](https://media.npr.org/assets/img/2020/01/11/gettyimages-134591594-23d365ada00e44e9736f1d75d47df4c167801e3b.jpg) ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 1:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/25 "2023-05-22T13:03:36Z")
> **[Drum Notation Guide - DrumKey | DRUM! Magazine](https://drummagazine.com/drum-notation-guide-2/)** > > Here's a drum notation guide lesson for drumkey that every music lover should know about. Learn about dotted notes, rest and a lot more! I read drum notation, and the above are the basics. You can always add notes for non-standard drums. ---
**Author:** ![bordelond](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bordelond/32/150_2.png) [@bordelond](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bordelond)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 2:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/26 "2023-05-22T14:14:22Z")
> [@Musicat](#): > > So the answer to “who scores modern music?” is _it depends_ . A follow-on question, inspired by the OP: Is it generally possible to research and determine who, specifically, scored a specific work of popular music? A credit to an “arranger” isn’t particularly uncommon on pre-1990s\*\* albums – could you count on a credited arranger, probably, being the one who transposed the from-the-head music to paper? Or else are there other approaches to tracking down the “_who scored it?_” for popular music – you just have to know where to look? … \*\* _“pre-1990s” is not meant to convey a meaningful cut-off. It just happensthat I’ve perused very few post-grunge album credits._ ---
**Author:** ![pjd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pjd/32/3009_2.png) [@pjd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pjd)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 2:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/27 "2023-05-22T14:26:31Z")
Scoring/transcribing these days is a lot easier thanks to DAWs (digital audio workstations). If you can get a tune into it (either directly inputting notes into an editor, or playing the music with a midi device (usually keyboard, but pretty much any instrument these days can output midi)), then you can print it out as sheet music. ---
**Author:** ![msmith537](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d9b06d/32.png) [@msmith537](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/msmith537)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 2:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/28 "2023-05-22T14:34:12Z")
> [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](#): > > > [@DPRK](#): > > > > IMO “modern pop, rock, etc.” is, music-theoretically, in the same wheelhouse as “classical music”, and that there absolutely should be, and actually is, sheet music. > > Many (if not most) Pop music writers can’t even read music let alone write it. That’s left up to arrangers (for the studio if necessary) or publishers (after the record is made). None of the Beatles ever needed sheet music, because they couldn’t even read it if they did. I don’t know anything about how music is actually created, but how does a band keep track of what they will play for a given song if they can’t read or write sheet music? Like how does John and Paul ask Ringo to play that bit on the drums he showed them a month ago? ---
**Author:** ![velomont](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/v/8491ac/32.png) [@velomont](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/velomont)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/29 "2023-05-22T14:35:19Z")
I was asking my guitar instructor this question a few days ago; I’m struggling through a Black Sabbath guitar solo, using a Hal Leonard tab book. My instructor, who’s also a professional musician and music professor, said that Tony (Iommi) more than likely just created his music basically straight off of the guitar and that others did the transcription as required. ---
**Author:** ![Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/elmer_j.fudd/32/1211_2.png) [@Elmer\_J.Fudd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elmer_J.Fudd)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 3:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/30 "2023-05-22T15:03:53Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I don’t know anything about how music is actually created, but how does a band keep track of what they will play for a given song if they can’t read or write sheet music? Like how does John and Paul ask Ringo to play that bit on the drums he showed them a month ago? Their own records. That’s the same way they learned other people’s songs. And touring/ gigging musicians pick up a lot from the repetition of playing the same thing concert after concert. ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 3:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/31 "2023-05-22T15:07:09Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I don’t know anything about how music is actually created, but how does a band keep track of what they will play for a given song if they can’t read or write sheet music? Like how does John and Paul ask Ringo to play that bit on the drums he showed them a month ago? As a person who used to read sheet music, but stopped and let that skill atrophy decades ago because it wasn’t useful to communicate with the musicians I worked with: memory and recordings become very important. I’ve been in the habit of recording our practices and writing sessions for quite some time. Also, if you can halfway play their instrument, you can sit down and demonstrate what you want them to play. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/32 "2023-05-22T15:40:42Z")
Can a computer really sort this out? For example, I saw Natalie Merchant in concert at the Chicago Theater last Friday. Her band was a piano, drummer, cello, viola and two violins and a guitarist and bassist. How can a computer discern who is doing what? Particularly the string instruments? (as in the violins from the viola and cello) ---
**Author:** ![scabpicker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/scabpicker/32/8268_2.png) [@scabpicker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scabpicker)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/33 "2023-05-22T16:20:08Z")
The key in that situation is whether the instrument is outputting MIDI signals. It’s true that most any instrument can output MIDI if it is properly equipped (a hex pickup on a guitar, for example), but very few instruments that aren’t primarily used as a synthesizer controller are actually equipped to do so. ---
**Author:** ![pjd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pjd/32/3009_2.png) [@pjd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pjd)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 4:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/34 "2023-05-22T16:35:30Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Can a computer really sort this out? Not quite (yet !) I was referring to music already entered into a DAW. Although, it could be achieved with midi pickups attached to the individual instruments. I guess they were already reading notes though, so there wouldn’t be much point ! ---
**Author:** ![alovem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@alovem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alovem)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/35 "2023-05-22T17:42:16Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Like how does John and Paul ask Ringo to play that bit on the drums he showed them a month ago? In a video interview, Paul McCartney said The Beatles, as a band, never used sheet music. They’d rely on their memories and, at most, would refer to their hand-written lyrics. My guess is that they’d sometimes do that at the initial stages of putting together a particular song. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/36 "2023-05-22T17:51:30Z")
> [@alovem](#): > > In a video interview, Paul McCartney said The Beatles, as a band, never used sheet music. They’d rely on their memories and, at most, would refer to their hand-written lyrics. M My understanding is that they couldn’t read sheet music, and various articles seem to indicate that McCartney still doesn’t/can’t. > [@](#): > > Legendary musician [Paul McCartney](https://globalnews.ca/tag/paul-mccartney/) sat down with _60 Minutes_ correspondent Sharyn Alfonsi for an in-depth chat about his new album, _Egypt Station_, and he revealed something rather contradictory: he is unable to read or write music, and neither could any of his Beatles bandmates. > > Despite his songwriting success, the 76-year-old admitted he was embarrassed about the fact that he doesn’t understand music theory. > > “I don’t see music as dots on a page. It’s something in my head that goes on.” > **[Paul McCartney admits he and the Beatles can’t read or write music - National...](https://globalnews.ca/news/4503916/paul-mccartney-cant-read-music/)** > > Paul McCartney admitted he was embarrassed about not being able to read music, but said, "We did some good stuff though." ---
**Author:** ![pulykamell](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pulykamell/32/3166_2.png) [@pulykamell](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pulykamell)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/37 "2023-05-22T17:52:14Z")
In the several rock bands I played in and recorded with, that was exactly the case. Nobody wrote down actual music. If somebody want to tell the drummer to do a particular fill, they’d describe it or vocalize it out, and the drummer would catch on. As a keyboardist, I would just learn by watching. In one of the bands, I had a lyric sheet and just wrote my own notes out, like the chords, and any place where I might want to do some kind of fill (like “play decending fill here!” or something like that.) It’s really not all that complex for most popular music. You just sit down, learn your part, and remember it. Or you take notes in whatever way you can (if you don’t read sheet music) to jog your memory. I read and write music reasonably well, but I would never ever write out my parts. I don’t need to. I can remember the part. I mean, is it necessary to read to be able to learn a speech? No. You can listen to the speech over and over just as well. ---
**Author:** ![alovem](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/b38774/32.png) [@alovem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alovem)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 5:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/38 "2023-05-22T17:52:35Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > My understanding is that they couldn’t read sheet music,… Yes, mine too. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/39 "2023-05-22T17:54:51Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > My understanding is that they couldn’t read sheet music, and various articles seem to indicate that McCartney still doesn’t/can’t. Totally an aside: I seem to remember the Beatles being asked if Ringo was the best drummer ever and one of the band members quipped he was not even the best drummer in the Beatles. ---
**Author:** ![kenobi\_65](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kenobi_65/32/13178_2.png) [@kenobi\_65](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kenobi_65)\ **Post date:** [May 22, 2023, 5:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366/40 "2023-05-22T17:55:15Z")
Jeff Lynne, of Electric Light Orchestra, is another who never learned to read traditional sheet music notation. In the 1970s, when ELO was recording music with a full string section in the studio, he worked with Louis Clark to do the arranging of the songs for the musicians in the string section. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-scores-modern-music-assuming-the-band-has-not-done-it/984366.md?page=3)