# Who should pay Reparations to African Americans? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 19, 2019, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753 "2019-06-19T16:52:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 1
**Author:** ![Clu-Me-In](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@Clu-Me-In](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clu-Me-In)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 4:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/1 "2019-06-19T16:52:29Z")
There is no question that compensation is due African American descendants of slaves but who should pay the reparations? The answer most definitely isn’t this one…[https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/18/politics/mitch-mcconnell-opposes-reparations-slavery/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/18/politics/mitch-mcconnell-opposes-reparations-slavery/index.html) ---
**Author:** ![Jasmine](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jasmine/32/2964_2.png) [@Jasmine](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jasmine)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 4:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/2 "2019-06-19T16:56:36Z")
Isn’t this more of a Great Debate than a General Question? ---
**Author:** ![UCBearcats](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/77aa72/32.png) [@UCBearcats](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UCBearcats)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/3 "2019-06-19T17:08:20Z")
> [@Clu-Me-In](#): > > There is no question that compensation is due African American descendants of slaves but who should pay the reparations? The answer most definitely isn’t this one…[https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/18/politics/mitch-mcconnell-opposes-reparations-slavery/index.html](https://www.cnn.com/2019/06/18/politics/mitch-mcconnell-opposes-reparations-slavery/index.html) There absolutely is a question regarding this. I do not see a need for yet another hand out. If it must be done, give each Black person a symbolic $1 amount. ---
**Author:** ![Clu-Me-In](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@Clu-Me-In](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clu-Me-In)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/4 "2019-06-19T17:14:21Z")
> [@UCBearcats](#): > > There absolutely is a question regarding this. I do not see a need for yet another hand out. If it must be done, give each Black person a symbolic $1 amount. Why is it a handout? It is compensation for years of damage inflicted on the Black community here in America and that damage is the reason Black Americans still cannot build wealth. ---
**Author:** ![engineer\_comp\_geek](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/engineer_comp_geek/32/504_2.png) [@engineer\_comp\_geek](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/engineer_comp_geek)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/5 "2019-06-19T17:14:33Z")
**Moderator Action** > [@Jasmine](#): > > Isn’t this more of a Great Debate than a General Question? I think so. Moving thread from GQ to GD. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/6 "2019-06-19T17:15:50Z")
This would be skipping several steps (i.e. determining who to pay, how much, how to verify and track, etc.), but IIRC Ta-Nehisi Coates argues that the US government should be the entity that pays, just as it did for Japanese-American internees. ---
**Author:** ![Machine\_Elf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/82dd89/32.png) [@Machine\_Elf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Machine_Elf)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/7 "2019-06-19T17:16:01Z")
Reported for forum change. (ninja’d by an actual forum change) :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/8 "2019-06-19T17:16:44Z")
Whoever owned the slave should pay reparations to that slave. Those who never owned slaves should not pay reparations to those who never were slaves. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/9 "2019-06-19T17:18:55Z")
I’d also like to point out that reparations isn’t just about slavery, but also about various forms of discrimination and oppression that continued well into the 20th century. I believe it would be most appropriate to start with the governmental policies and practices that have harmed living Americans, like Redlining, before dealing with the policies like slavery which did not involve any living Americans. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/10 "2019-06-19T17:27:56Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > I’d also like to point out that reparations isn’t just about slavery, but also about various forms of discrimination and oppression that continued well into the 20th century. I believe it would be most appropriate to start with the governmental policies and practices that have harmed living Americans, like Redlining, before dealing with the policies like slavery which did not involve any living Americans. The reason I don’t agree with reparations is related to this. I am concerned that a reparations program would be seen as a solution to the problems of racism. From that point on, any time a black person is victimized because of his race, there would be people saying “Suck it up. You got a check to compensate you for the effects of racism. So you’ve been paid for your suffering and we don’t owe you anything anymore.” We should be putting our efforts into eliminating racism not into compensating people for it. ---
**Author:** ![Clu-Me-In](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/dfb087/32.png) [@Clu-Me-In](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Clu-Me-In)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/11 "2019-06-19T17:32:05Z")
America must talk about it and must acknowledge that it owes Black Americans payment for the damages it continues to do as a result of Slavery and all that pertains to slavery. The iron chains may be gone from our necks, hands and feet, but it remains on our pysche. Acknowledgement of this fact and Congress making some kind of allowance for African Americans = REPARATIONS Then America will be able to forgive itself for the atrocities that hang over it like an Albatross. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/12 "2019-06-19T17:32:50Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > The reason I don’t agree with reparations is related to this. I am concerned that a reparations program would be seen as a solution to the problems of racism. From that point on, any time a black person is victimized because of his race, there would be people saying “Suck it up. You got a check to compensate you for the effects of racism. So you’ve been paid for your suffering and we don’t owe you anything anymore.” > > We should be putting our efforts into eliminating racism not into compensating people for it. People already say this (or some equivalent). It’s nonsense now and it’d be nonsense then as well. [TNC makes the argument much better than I do](https://www.theatlantic.com/magazine/archive/2014/06/the-case-for-reparations/361631/) (if you haven’t read it, please do!), but the gist I get is that, for entirely legitimate reasons, there’s pretty much no chance of most black Americans seeing the country as a truly just and fair society until these past wrongs are addressed in a serious and good-faith way. The alternative is a permanent aggrieved underclass (which many Americans are obviously just fine with). ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/13 "2019-06-19T17:38:54Z")
I’ll also note that “reparations” doesn’t necessarily mean a check to black people. It could mean a variety of things including community investment, but what it requires is a serious and good-faith effort to address the governmental and societal wrongs against black people (and others, potentially!) that continued well into the 20th century on a national level. If I had a billion dollars (maybe it would only need a few hundrd million) I’d commission a long-term research study/experiment that would aim to, basically, execute reparations for a single small majority-black town in the Deep South, or a black neighborhood in a midwestern city like Chicago or St. Louis, with serious historical digging (records, statistics, interviews, and more) and then tracking for another few decades to see the medium and long-term impact. If it was successful (i.e. if the young people and later generations should significantly enhanced educational and financial achievement with lower rates of criminality, poverty, and similar), then it could be used as a model to demonstrate that reparations aren’t scary at all, and could indeed be very beneficial to communities. The goal of reparations isn’t to help black people – it’s to make the country better and stronger. ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:42pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/14 "2019-06-19T17:42:41Z")
> [@Clu-Me-In](#): > > There is no question that compensation is due African American descendants of slaves Sure there is. (Question, that is.) ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/15 "2019-06-19T17:45:25Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > The alternative is a permanent aggrieved underclass (which many Americans are obviously just fine with). If they’re aggrieved because I don’t want to give them money because of something somebody else did to their grandmother, yes, I would be fine with that. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Darren\_Garrison](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/darren_garrison/32/92_2.png) [@Darren\_Garrison](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Darren_Garrison)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/16 "2019-06-19T17:45:34Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > Whoever owned the slave should pay reparations to that slave. Those who never owned slaves should not pay reparations to those who never were slaves. This. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/17 "2019-06-19T17:45:56Z")
TNC’s latest words on reparations, delivered to the House today: [Ta-Nehisi Coates's Testimony to the House on Reparations - The Atlantic](https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2019/06/ta-nehisi-coates-testimony-house-reparations-hr-40/592042/) Highly recommended reading. It’s not just about slavery, not even close. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/18 "2019-06-19T17:47:14Z")
> [@Shodan](#): > > If they’re aggrieved because I don’t want to give them money because of something somebody else did to their grandmother, yes, I would be fine with that. That’s not why they’re aggrieved, according to my understanding of TNC’s argument. This is a very complicated issue, with a long and complex history, and flippant remarks like this are incapable of encapsulating it. If you’re curious, I hope you read TNC’s article and his latest words, linked in posts above. ---
**Author:** ![Walmarticus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/f9ae1b/32.png) [@Walmarticus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Walmarticus)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/19 "2019-06-19T17:49:25Z")
> [@Little\_Nemo](#): > > The reason I don’t agree with reparations is related to this. I am concerned that a reparations program would be seen as a solution to the problems of racism. From that point on, any time a black person is victimized because of his race, there would be people saying “Suck it up. You got a check to compensate you for the effects of racism. So you’ve been paid for your suffering and we don’t owe you anything anymore.” > > We should be putting our efforts into eliminating racism not into compensating people for it. I feel like the people who’d say that about reparations are already saying it about other things: “Suck it up, you just had a black president”, “Suck it up, Jim Crow was half a century ago”, “Suck it up, affirmative action already exists”. They feel like blacks are already over compensated. And I think it’s just permanent part of the American mindset. Three hundred years ago they thought America was doing them a favor by kidnapping them from Africa and that if anyone owed anything, it was black people. So I totally understand your thoughts but I don’t think it’s any reason to not do it. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [June 19, 2019, 5:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753/20 "2019-06-19T17:50:15Z")
Not sure if this is allowed, but perhaps it is because it’s not a long statement – here are TNC’s opening words today: [ > [@](#): > > Yesterday, when asked about reparations, Senate Majority Leader Mitch McConnell offered a familiar reply: America should not be held liable for something that happened 150 years ago, since none of us currently alive are responsible. This rebuttal proffers a strange theory of governance, that American accounts are somehow bound by the lifetime of its generations. But well into this century, the United States was still paying out pensions to the heirs of Civil War soldiers. We honor treaties that date back some 200 years, despite no one being alive who signed those treaties. Many of us would love to be taxed for the things we are solely and individually responsible for. But we are American citizens, and thus bound to a collective enterprise that extends beyond our individual and personal reach. It would seem ridiculous to dispute invocations of the Founders, or the greatest generation, on the basis of a lack of membership in either group. We recognize our lineage as a generational trust, as inheritance, and the real dilemma posed by reparations is just that: a dilemma of inheritance. It is impossible to imagine America without the inheritance of slavery. > > As historian Ed Baptist has written, enslavement “shaped every crucial aspect of the economy and politics” of America, so that by 1836 more than $600 million, almost half of the economic activity in the United States, derived directly or indirectly from the cotton produced by the million-odd slaves. By the time the enslaved were emancipated, they comprised the largest single asset in America. Three billion in 1860 dollars, more than all the other assets in the country combined. > > The method of cultivating this asset was neither gentle cajoling nor persuasion, but torture, rape, and child trafficking. Enslavement reigned for 250 years on these shores. When it ended, this country could have extended its hallowed principles—life, liberty, and the pursuit of happiness—to all, regardless of color. But America had other principles in mind. And so for a century after the Civil War, black people were subjected to a relentless campaign of terror, a campaign that extended well into the lifetime of Majority Leader McConnell. > > It is tempting to divorce this modern campaign of terror, of plunder, from enslavement, but the logic of enslavement, of white supremacy, respects no such borders and the guard of bondage was lustful and begat many heirs. Coup d-états and convict leasing. Vagrancy laws and debt peonage. Redlining and racist G.I. bills. Poll taxes and state-sponsored terrorism. We grant that Mr. McConnell was not alive for Appomattox. But he was alive for the electrocution of George Stinney. He was alive for the blinding of Isaac Woodard. He was alive to witness kleptocracy in his native Alabama and a regime premised on electoral theft. Majority Leader McConnell cited civil-rights legislation yesterday, as well he should, because he was alive to witness the harassment, jailing, and betrayal of those responsible for that legislation by a government sworn to protect them. He was alive for the redlining of Chicago and the looting of black homeowners of some $4 billion. Victims of that plunder are very much alive today. I am sure they’d love a word with the majority leader. > > What they know, what this committee must know, is that while emancipation dead-bolted the door against the bandits of America, Jim Crow wedged the windows wide open. And that is the thing about Senator McConnell’s “something”: It was 150 years ago. And it was right now. > > The typical black family in this country has one-tenth the wealth of the typical white family. Black women die in childbirth at four times the rate of white women. And there is, of course, the shame of this land of the free boasting the largest prison population on the planet, of which the descendants of the enslaved make up the largest share. The matter of reparations is one of making amends and direct redress, but it is also a question of citizenship. In H.R. 40, this body has a chance to both make good on its 2009 apology for enslavement, and reject fair-weather patriotism, to say that this nation is both its credits and debits. That if Thomas Jefferson matters, so does Sally Hemings. That if D-Day matters, so does Black Wall Street. That if Valley Forge matters, so does Fort Pillow. Because the question really is not whether we’ll be tied to the somethings of our past, but whether we are courageous enough to be tied to the whole of them. Thank you. ]([https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/19/us/ta-nehisi-coates-reparations.html](https://www.nytimes.com/2019/06/19/us/ta-nehisi-coates-reparations.html)) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-should-pay-reparations-to-african-americans/835753.md?page=2)