# Who suggested demonstrations of atomic weapons before 1945? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [December 31, 2014, 5:38pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-suggested-demonstrations-of-atomic-weapons-before-1945/708629 "2014-12-31T17:38:16Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 9\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a8b319/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_wuzzy)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2015, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-suggested-demonstrations-of-atomic-weapons-before-1945/708629/21 "2015-01-01T20:39:40Z")
There was the Szilard Petition: [http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Szil%C3%A1rd\_petition](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Szil%C3%A1rd_petition) “It was circulated in July 1945 and asked President Harry S. Truman to consider an observed demonstration of the power of the atomic bomb first, before using it against people. However, the petition never made it through the chain of command to President Truman. It also was not declassified and made public until 1961.” ---
**Author:** ![Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/a8b319/32.png) [@Fuzzy\_wuzzy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fuzzy_wuzzy)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2015, 8:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-suggested-demonstrations-of-atomic-weapons-before-1945/708629/22 "2015-01-01T20:52:11Z")
Sorry, I just noticed the op asked for examples _before_ 1945. ---
**Author:** ![bonzer](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/45deac/32.png) [@bonzer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bonzer)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2015, 8:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-suggested-demonstrations-of-atomic-weapons-before-1945/708629/23 "2015-01-01T20:59:41Z")
Wrote that last post without digging out my copy of P.D. Smith’s _Doomsday Men_ (Allen Lane, 2007), which is good on just this sort of stuff. On the explosion in _Public Faces_, Smith’s version is that it was _intended_ as a harmless demonstration by renegade elements in the military, albeit with the intention of intimidating all the non-British powers, but which then goes horribly wrong. Smith also discusses _The Man Who Rocked the Earth_, a 1915 novel by Arthur Train and Robert Williams Wood. This involves a mysterious inventor of an atomic weapon (and uranium-powered flying saucers!) who issues an ultimatum to mankind calling for the abolition of war. As a peaceful demonstration of his power, he uses the weapon to destroy the Atlas Mountains. A few locals are caught up in the demo and die a lingering death akin to radiation sickness. The doesn’t entirely work and do he then has to resort to threatening to knock the Earth off its axis, hence the title. That threat is enough and universal peace is achieved. Smith also covers all the other works mentioned in the thread. Except Chamber’s novel. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2015, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-suggested-demonstrations-of-atomic-weapons-before-1945/708629/24 "2015-01-01T21:36:45Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > It’s right here: > > [The Great War Syndicate](http://www.gutenberg.org/files/427/427-h/427-h.htm) Thanks for the link. The “motor-bomb” is definitely used in a demonstration that destroys the fortress of Caerdaff. > [@bonzer](#): > > Nice find, **Exapno** > > One possible lead might be Harold Nicolson’s 1932 novel _Public Faces_. It’s out of print and I haven’t read it, but it does seem to have been widely read in the Thirties and it was then re-issued post-1945 (with Churchill as one of its readers). An extremely important work. The Franklin book mentioned earlier states that Szilard ordered two books for the library - that one and Wells’ _The World Set Free_, about the invention of atomic weapons. Franklin’s account of the former says that while the politicos were dithering the Air Ministry tests the bomb, engulfing Charleston, SC. I’ll have to check about how accidental this might have been, but Nicolson’s point is that all such weapons must be destroyed because of the consequences. He calls it, with historic irony, “this Manhattan of responsibility.” The Nicolson novel was published in America by Houghton Mifflin in early 1933, so Weisinger could easily have read it - a mainstream sf novel was an event in the day - or read a review, although the Times book review doesn’t mention that part of the plot. Even so, it’s a sophisticated first story by an 18-year-old. _Public Faces_ was reprinted in paperback with [this cover](http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51SSvEO1tDL.jpg). Words fail me. I see bonzer’s post made while I was researching mine. The Train/Wood novel has a “lavender ray” run by atomic power. Cal, did you have that one on your list? It’s apparently a single genius who figures all this out, not a country, typical of the day. ---
**Author:** ![md2000](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/73ab20/32.png) [@md2000](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/md2000)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2015, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-suggested-demonstrations-of-atomic-weapons-before-1945/708629/25 "2015-01-02T17:21:32Z")
Just a side note to this discussion - the short story _By the Waters of Babylon_ by Stephen Vincent Benét is often nowadays taken to be just another post-atomic apocalypse story (my assumption too when I first read it); but was published in the 1930’s and imagined a world where war had destroyed civilization to the point where inhabitants of the New York area(?) had reverted to primitive hunter-gatherer tribal culture. ---
**Author:** ![CalMeacham](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/calmeacham/32/35_2.png) [@CalMeacham](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/CalMeacham)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2015, 6:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-suggested-demonstrations-of-atomic-weapons-before-1945/708629/26 "2015-01-02T18:02:40Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > Thanks for the link. The “motor-bomb” is definitely used in a demonstration that destroys the fortress of Caerdaff. > An extremely important work. The Franklin book mentioned earlier states that Szilard ordered two books for the library - that one and Wells’ _The World Set Free_, about the invention of atomic weapons. > > Franklin’s account of the former says that while the politicos were dithering the Air Ministry tests the bomb, engulfing Charleston, SC. I’ll have to check about how accidental this might have been, but Nicolson’s point is that all such weapons must be destroyed because of the consequences. He calls it, with historic irony, “this Manhattan of responsibility.” > > The Nicolson novel was published in America by Houghton Mifflin in early 1933, so Weisinger could easily have read it - a mainstream sf novel was an event in the day - or read a review, although the Times book review doesn’t mention that part of the plot. Even so, it’s a sophisticated first story by an 18-year-old. > > _Public Faces_ was reprinted in paperback with [this cover](http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51SSvEO1tDL.jpg). Words fail me. > > I see bonzer’s post made while I was researching mine. The Train/Wood novel has a “lavender ray” run by atomic power. Cal, did you have that one on your list? It’s apparently a single genius who figures all this out, not a country, typical of the day. Afraid not. I’ll have to update my Ray Gun lecture again (I’m giving it again later this month). You _always_ find something you missed previously. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2015, 6:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-suggested-demonstrations-of-atomic-weapons-before-1945/708629/27 "2015-01-02T18:12:39Z")
> [@md2000](#): > > Just a side note to this discussion - the short story _By the Waters of Babylon_ by Stephen Vincent Benét is often nowadays taken to be just another post-atomic apocalypse story (my assumption too when I first read it); but was published in the 1930’s and imagined a world where war had destroyed civilization to the point where inhabitants of the New York area(?) had reverted to primitive hunter-gatherer tribal culture. I’m sorry, but I don’t see the relevance to this thread. It’s a standard post-apocalypse story, there is no mention of atomic power, and even if there were there’s zero mention of demonstrations of weapons. Bleiler doesn’t even bother to log it, though he lists plenty of other post-apocalypse stories including Miles J. Breuer’s “The Time Valve,” from the July 1930 _Wonder Stories_, which actually features an atomic bomb. Am I missing something? > [@CalMeacham](#): > > Afraid not. I’ll have to update my Ray Gun lecture again (I’m giving it again later this month). You _always_ find something you missed previously. It’s a continuing nightmare. ---
**Author:** ![Andy\_L](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/c67d28/32.png) [@Andy\_L](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Andy_L)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2015, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-suggested-demonstrations-of-atomic-weapons-before-1945/708629/28 "2015-01-02T18:39:39Z")
This is not quite on topic, but it’s so interesting I thought I’d mention it. In 1945, just months after Hiroshima, Louis Ridenour wrote “The Pilot Lights of the Apocalypse” [http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=9EUaAAAAIBAJ&sjid=MCMEAAAAIBAJ&pg=4175,3954599](http://news.google.com/newspapers?id=9EUaAAAAIBAJ&sjid=MCMEAAAAIBAJ&pg=4175,3954599) a short play which features all the tropes of an atomic war story: massive proliferation, paranoid worries about a first strike, ambiguity about determining which foe is responsible for an attack, etc. It’s well worth the few minutes required for reading it. Here’s a brief article about it as well. ---
**Author:** ![John\_Bredin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/96bed5/32.png) [@John\_Bredin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/John_Bredin)\ **Post date:** [January 2, 2015, 7:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-suggested-demonstrations-of-atomic-weapons-before-1945/708629/29 "2015-01-02T19:36:20Z")
> [@Captain\_Amazing](#): > > It’s right here: > > [The Great War Syndicate](http://www.gutenberg.org/files/427/427-h/427-h.htm) I know it says above that the story was written in 1889, but it was still deeply odd to read a story with superweapons but no radio, so that ships that could essentially drop a pocket nuke on a fort had to communicate by smoke or launching a boat. :dubious: Which actually affects the story at times, making this also the _ur_-“how would this story work with [del]cell phones[/del] wireless” story. 😛 [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-suggested-demonstrations-of-atomic-weapons-before-1945/708629.md?page=1)