# Who Was the Greatest President of All Time? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [June 25, 2014, 7:20am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593 "2014-06-25T07:20:44Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![Buck\_Godot](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/buck_godot/32/6573_2.png) [@Buck\_Godot](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Buck_Godot)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 3:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/21 "2014-06-25T15:14:58Z")
Another vote for FDR. Individually either the New Deal or WWII would put him in the vicinity of the greats, taking them both together puts him over the top. ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 3:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/22 "2014-06-25T15:15:37Z")
Lincoln gets it just for saving the Union, clinches it with freeing the slaves. Isaac Asimov once called him “undoubtedly the greatest American who ever lived,” not just the greatest POTUS. ---
**Author:** ![DJ\_Motorbike](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/90ced4/32.png) [@DJ\_Motorbike](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DJ_Motorbike)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 3:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/23 "2014-06-25T15:40:51Z")
Washington could have been king. Had anyone else been in his shoes US citizens would now be subjects to a monarch. None are above Washington. ---
**Author:** ![Itself](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/d07c76/32.png) [@Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Itself)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 3:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/24 "2014-06-25T15:45:54Z")
I don’t think you’ll have much luck dethroning Washington, Lincoln, or either Roosevelt with Nixon, even ignoring Watergate. Still, you could make the argument that Nixon was the last great statesman to be president. Reagan, Clinton, and Obama were elected largely on their personal magnetism (and despite Reagan’s foreign policy successes, he wasn’t a wonk like Nixon); Ford and Carter was non-entities; the elder Bush did have foreign policy chops but was more of a party apparatchik (as opposed to Nixon, who had a mercurial, love-hate relationship with his party, and particularly with Eisenhower); and the younger Bush is not up for nomination as the greatest post-war statesman. Whether deserved or not (I personally think it was, though it was admittedly overblown), Nixon had a reputation as a foreign policy expert and statesman even while he was vice president and overshadowed by Eisenhower. > [@Jim\_B](#): > > He appointed Harry Blackmun to the court (a jurist some people still mistakenly believe was a liberal [he in-fact was a conservative, a proponent of the death penalty and obscenity, and a Republican, when he was appointed]). Blackman wasn’t a proponent of obscenity. You’re thinking of the late Earl Warren, who was both Chief Justice of the Supreme Court and a sleazy male stripper. [/simpsons] ---
**Author:** ![BobLibDem](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/boblibdem/32/3149_2.png) [@BobLibDem](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BobLibDem)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 3:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/25 "2014-06-25T15:55:29Z")
> [@Batistuta](#): > > No love for Lyndon Johnson? I’ve always found him to be better than people give him credit for. Great when it came to getting legislation through Congress, he skillfully passed the key 1964 Civil Rights Act along with a few other social measures. He was also witty as hell, which gives him extra points in my book. It’s a shame that he messed up the Vietnam situation, but I’m sure all other presidents made similar mistakes at some point. > > Granted, I’m looking at this from across the Atlantic so I may well have missed something True, LBJ was a giant. I would put him behind FDR as second greatest 20th century president. Could the Civil Rights Act have passed if JFK had picked a different successor? I’m not sure. Between the Civil Rights Act and Medicare, LBJ was a true visionary. ---
**Author:** ![jfreakofkorn](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/ecc23a/32.png) [@jfreakofkorn](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jfreakofkorn)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/26 "2014-06-25T16:02:56Z")
washington ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 4:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/27 "2014-06-25T16:09:38Z")
Lincoln by a nose, with Washington a close second, followed by FDR. ---
**Author:** ![The\_Second\_Stone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/bbe5ce/32.png) [@The\_Second\_Stone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Second_Stone)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 4:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/28 "2014-06-25T16:19:51Z")
It is a discussion/debate between Washington, Lincoln and FDR. Modern America is FDR’s America with Reagan and the right trying to tug it back to the Robber Baron era. As for jurisprudence, Potter Stewart is the best jurist of all time for coming up with the one prong obscenity test: “I know it when I see it.” ---
**Author:** ![Stringbean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Stringbean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringbean)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 4:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/29 "2014-06-25T16:20:36Z")
“If he does that, he will be the greatest man in the world.” ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 4:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/30 "2014-06-25T16:51:53Z")
LBJ. > [@Stringbean](#): > > “If he does that, he will be the greatest man in the world.” Herbert Hoover was also a great man, but like Washington he was not a great POTUS (and it takes a pretty narrow focus to adjudge any slaveowner “a great man”.) ---
**Author:** ![Stringbean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d6d6ee/32.png) [@Stringbean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Stringbean)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 5:03pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/31 "2014-06-25T17:03:07Z")
> [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](#): > > LBJ. > > Herbert Hoover was also a great man, but like Washington he was not a great POTUS (and it takes a pretty narrow focus to adjudge any slaveowner “a great man”.) Yet you nominate a man known for exposing his genitals. Good call. ---
**Author:** ![pkbites](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pkbites/32/204_2.png) [@pkbites](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pkbites)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 5:24pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/32 "2014-06-25T17:24:31Z")
FDR was probably the worst for the nation. His psuedocommie agenda continues to hamper the prosperity and freedoms of us all. The economy was still in the diaper pail when we got into WW2. Nationalization will crutch an economy momentarily but not permanently. What really helps against unemployment is to have a lot of able bodied men get killed in combat. Nixon was the biggest asshole to ever step inside the white House, including any other pols or tourists. Moderate my ass. “Price controls” is an idea that only Marx could love. Even some of his actions before he assumed office may have been treasonous. I’m thinking the guy was severely mentally ill. LBJ may have been the greatest seeing there is no poverty in the USA and all the trillions of dollars spent to fight it were justified. Plus he kept the pacific rim free by spending billions on our presence in Vietnam. He was the only one with the vision to know winning such a conflict was possible! Lincoln? Had to make tough choices but many of them were tyrannical. I have to go with Washington. First, even before he was POTUS he had the balls to stand up against tyranny and the most powerful military on Earth, and he was key in kicking their ass. Remember, had we lost he more than likely would have been tortured and hung! Then, he could have been an emperor or king, but humbly settled for “President”. He could have presided until his dying day but served only 2 terms and then graciously stepped aside. Then he made whiskey. Whatta guy! ---
**Author:** ![Sitnam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/6a8cbe/32.png) [@Sitnam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sitnam)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/33 "2014-06-25T17:40:02Z")
Our nation was never as close to utter destruction as it was those first 20 years, within that time formed institutions and traditions that helped carry us though tough times ahead. Until then it required great noble humble men. You can’t beat Washington, mostly because we never demanded as much from any president. ---
**Author:** ![lost4life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/c4cdca/32.png) [@lost4life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lost4life)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 5:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/34 "2014-06-25T17:40:34Z")
President Camacho, mainly for the way he handled the french fry and burrito covering shortage. Brought to you by Carl’s, Jr. ---
**Author:** ![KarlGauss](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/karlgauss/32/3713_2.png) [@KarlGauss](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/KarlGauss)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 5:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/35 "2014-06-25T17:43:41Z")
I would like to nominate **James Garfield** as the ‘greatest president who never got the chance to be great’. Alas, he was shot by a madman only four months into his term and, after suffering horribly, succumbed to his wound after six (helped along mightily by his “physicians”). Garfield was a polymath who, among other things spoke multiple languages (both ancient and modern), was a college president at age 25, came up with a _new_ proof of the Pythagorean Theorem while a congressman, and served as a major-general during the Civil War. During the 120 days of his (effective) presidency, he made real advances in monetary reform, ‘civil rights’ (i.e. appointed African-Americans to substantive federal positions), championed “universal education” (or some similar term that escapes me), and played the pivotal role in getting the Navy on a path toward its rebuilding and resurgence. Imagine what he could have done in 1500 days. ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 5:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/36 "2014-06-25T17:46:48Z")
> [@KarlGauss](#): > > I would like to nominate **James Garfield** as the ‘greatest president who never got the chance to be great’. > > Alas, he was shot by a madman only four months into his term and, after suffering horribly, succumbed to his wound after six (helped along mightily by his “physicians”). > > Garfield was a polymath who, among other things spoke multiple languages (both ancient and modern), was a college president at age 25, came up with a _new_ proof of the Pythagorean Theorem while a congressman, and served as a major-general during the Civil War. > > During the 120 days of his (effective) presidency, he made real advances in monetary reform, ‘civil rights’ (i.e. appointed African-Americans to substantive federal positions), championed “universal education” (or some similar term that escapes me), and played the pivotal role in getting the Navy on a path toward its rebuilding and resurgence. > > Imagine what he could have done in 1500 days. Don’t forget he installed the first elevator in the White House. ---
**Author:** ![Batistuta](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/58956e/32.png) [@Batistuta](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Batistuta)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/37 "2014-06-25T17:51:41Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > Don’t forget he installed the first elevator in the White House. He took the position of US President to new heights. I’ll grab my coat… ---
**Author:** ![YogSothoth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/8edcca/32.png) [@YogSothoth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/YogSothoth)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 5:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/38 "2014-06-25T17:56:18Z")
Lincoln, Washington, and FDR, in that order ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/39 "2014-06-25T17:59:54Z")
> [@Jim\_B](#): > > And Nixon was probably one of the last great moderate politicians, when he was elected. (This was sadly before the Republican party became so polarized.) The guy who implemented the [Southern Strategy](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Southern_strategy) gaining political capital by preying on racial tensions is moderate? :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![septimus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/septimus/32/410_2.png) [@septimus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/septimus)\ **Post date:** [June 25, 2014, 6:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593/40 "2014-06-25T18:20:49Z")
Qin Shi Huangdi started a [Presidential Elimination Game thread](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=533286) almost four years ago. The top ranked, in order, were: 1 Washington 2 Lincoln 3 Teddy Roosevelt 4 Franklin Roosevelt 5 Truman 6 Eisenhower 7 Polk 8 Jefferson 9 Cleveland 10 Monroe 11 Clinton 12 LBJ If Cleveland’s rank seems high, realize the early stages of the elimination were based on “First, Did No Harm.” My top 12 would not include Clinton, whose results were degraded by obstructionist GOP, nor LBJ, whose adventure in Vietnam became a series of blunders. What strikes me is the way FDR, _definitely_ the best President not on Mt. Rushmore, was followed by Truman and Eisenhower (perhaps not 5,6 as ranked by Dopers but certainly both in the Top 10). Three of the very best Presidents right in a row! They were followed by JFK (near-great but serious flaws), LBJ (near-great plagued by big mistake), Nixon (could have been great if less criminal). After those three (I call them the Jekyll-and-Hyde Presidents), it went downhill. Among Presidents since Nixon, only Clinton and perhaps Reagan and Bush-41 are clearly above average. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-was-the-greatest-president-of-all-time/691593.md?page=3)