# Who were some early "famous" people (not kings or queens, etc)? **URL:** \ **Category:** Cafe Society\ **Created:** [February 8, 2025, 6:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054 "2025-02-08T18:39:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 4
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2025, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/61 "2025-02-10T20:53:59Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > I read that book too or a similar one. It was in the 90s. In addition Muhammad was a military leader who conquered territory much of which is still held by his adherents Yes, 90’s checks out. Do you remember what it was? ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2025, 8:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/62 "2025-02-10T20:56:36Z")
> [@Charlie\_Tan](#): > > The [Tel Dan Stele](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tel_Dan_stele) [about 840 BCE] mentions (the inscription is not complete) House of David as a royal line, although interpolating that to the existence of a king named David is stretching things. Hardly. It does certainly imply a King David, who was apparently kinda important. But the “Unified Israel” and the bible stories about him are all legend. Look, there are legends about good old geo Washington, but he was certainly real. As you go back in time, and the written records get more sparse- the books of the OT (Samuel) that talk about David were apparently written after that time. the legendary parts get more and more and the facts get less and less. There is also the **Mesha Stele** which MAY mention David. Also the Bubastite Portal may mention David. King Omri was mentioned quite a few times in ancient histories. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [February 10, 2025, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/63 "2025-02-10T21:02:36Z")
The earliest named author in the world is a woman, [Enheduanna](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Enheduanna) (fl. ca. 2300 BC). Get to know Enheduanna. ---
**Author:** ![Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/son_of_a_rich/32/5439_2.png) [@Son\_of\_a\_Rich](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Son_of_a_Rich)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2025, 1:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/64 "2025-02-11T13:09:24Z")
Thag Simmons. ---
**Author:** ![MrDibble](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mrdibble/32/114_2.png) [@MrDibble](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MrDibble)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2025, 2:35pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/65 "2025-02-11T14:35:40Z")
> [@griffin1977](#): > > I think singers and musicians were considered pretty low class and not considered “worthy” celebrities The earliest _known_ troubador was [literally the Duke of Aquitaine](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_IX,_Duke_of_Aquitaine). ---
**Author:** ![Charlie\_Tan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/charlie_tan/32/12582_2.png) [@Charlie\_Tan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Charlie_Tan)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2025, 3:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/66 "2025-02-11T15:17:30Z")
Well, I did quote @Aspidistra directly after where she said that king was more like a mayor with an army. And by that I implied, perhaps a bit flippantly, that calling David king, i.e. with the connotation of the word king from about the past 1200-1500 years, is a stretch. Chieftain might be a better word. > **OT** > > After all - and I know this is well before the time of David - the LORD was with them and they took the hills, but could not take the valley, because of the chariots of iron (Judges 1:19). That certainly implies that the Kingdom of Judea/City state of Jerusalem was not very powerful. Legend then has it that the same David was the mighty warrior that conquered all of Samaria/Israel to a unified kingdom. And as you yourself says: myth. ---
**Author:** ![Pleonast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/pleonast/32/1183_2.png) [@Pleonast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Pleonast)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2025, 3:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/67 "2025-02-11T15:30:25Z")
> [@Charlie\_Tan](#): > > After all - and I know this is well before the time of David - the LORD was with them and they took the hills, but could not take the valley, because of the chariots of iron (Judges 1:19). [See also the documentary series](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mad_Max). 😉 ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2025, 3:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/68 "2025-02-11T15:58:18Z")
Black Adder seemed to indicate Francis Drake was a huge celebrity. Was that based on something? ---
**Author:** ![PatrickLondon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/patricklondon/32/4422_2.png) [@PatrickLondon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PatrickLondon)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2025, 4:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/69 "2025-02-11T16:36:00Z")
He was certainly adopted by the Victorians as a legendary hero, and I would guess his part in the defeat of the Armada was celebrated not just at the time or in the high imperialist era. > **[Drake's Drum](https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drake's_Drum)** > > Drake's Drum is a snare drum that Sir Francis Drake took with him when he circumnavigated the world. Shortly before he died he ordered the drum to be taken to Buckland Abbey and vowed that if England were ever in danger and someone was to beat the drum he would return to defend the country. According to legend it can be heard to beat at times when England is at war or significant national events take place. > Drake is said to have taken the drum, emblazoned with his coat of arms, with him on his... ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2025, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/70 "2025-02-11T22:10:11Z")
Was it[this book?](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_100:_A_Ranking_of_the_Most_Influential_Persons_in_History) I’m a little shocked by wiki’s claim that the author is a White nationalist. Especially considering how he ranked Muhammad above Jesus. I read it about ten years ago, and I don’t remember any White nationalist vibe. ---
**Author:** ![GuanoLad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guanolad/32/42_2.png) [@GuanoLad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GuanoLad)\ **Post date:** [February 11, 2025, 11:27pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/71 "2025-02-11T23:27:54Z")
Not Francis Drake, but Walter Raleigh. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2025, 1:23am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/72 "2025-02-12T01:23:10Z")
> [@F.U.Shakespeare](#): > > Was it[this book?](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_100:_A_Ranking_of_the_Most_Influential_Persons_in_History) I’m not sure. The rankings look close, but I swear it went: 1. Mohammad 2. Jesus of Nazareth 3. Paul the Apostle ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2025, 2:01am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/73 "2025-02-12T02:01:28Z")
Me too and it was definitely that book. There have apparently been a few revisions and I think we saw an earlier one. ---
**Author:** ![Johanna](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/johanna/32/8318_2.png) [@Johanna](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Johanna)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2025, 2:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/74 "2025-02-12T02:06:47Z")
Enheduanna was the earliest of them all. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2025, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/75 "2025-02-12T02:46:28Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > Me too and it was definitely that book. There have apparently been a few revisions and I think we saw an earlier one. Might have been later if this was 1992. I saw it around 1996-1999. I see a copy from 2000 online, but it has the same order. It’s possible I am just remembering the order wrong. ---
**Author:** ![hajario](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/hajario/32/171_2.png) [@hajario](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/hajario)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2025, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/76 "2025-02-12T03:06:33Z")
Yes, later. I saw it no earlier than 1993. Although the odds of both of us being wrong are pretty remote. ---
**Author:** ![F.U.Shakespeare](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/aca169/32.png) [@F.U.Shakespeare](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/F.U.Shakespeare)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2025, 3:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/77 "2025-02-12T03:17:28Z")
> [@hajario](#): > > Me too and it was definitely that book. There have apparently been a few revisions and I think we saw an earlier one. Yes, the version I read was apparently a revision. It had the top three as @Mahaloth remembers. IIRC it also listed Cai Lun, the 2nd-century Chinese inventor of paper, as more influential than Johannes Gutenberg. The reason being that movable type would not have been nearly as big an advance over woodblock printing if paper had not existed. ---
**Author:** ![Mahaloth](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/mahaloth/32/1079_2.png) [@Mahaloth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mahaloth)\ **Post date:** [February 12, 2025, 3:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/78 "2025-02-12T15:20:22Z")
> [@F.U.Shakespeare](#): > > IIRC it also listed Cai Lun, the 2nd-century Chinese inventor of paper, as more influential than Johannes Gutenberg. The reason being that movable type would not have been nearly as big an advance over woodblock printing if paper had not existed. I do see Buddha listed in the other version and Confucious as well, both important/influential people. I assume they really existed. I believe Bach was somewhat of a celebrity in his local area. However, it was for his incredible organ playing skills, not his compositions. I believe the story, which I don’t know is true or not, the church he played at had to make a rule for people not to get up and leave once his organ playing was done at the start of service. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 12:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/79 "2025-02-13T00:04:12Z")
The **late** Thag Simmons. ---
**Author:** ![Sooner](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sooner/32/7875_2.png) [@Sooner](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sooner)\ **Post date:** [February 13, 2025, 12:12am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054/80 "2025-02-13T00:12:10Z")
The Venerable Bede 673–735 AD Assume I have just given away my course of studies. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054.md?page=3) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-were-some-early-famous-people-not-kings-or-queens-etc/1014054.md?page=5)