# Who would be king or queen of an independent Scotland? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [February 14, 2014, 9:59am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318 "2014-02-14T09:59:49Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 4:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/21 "2014-02-14T16:16:23Z")
James VI of Scotland became also James I of England, wouldn’t the line of succession follow the same for both kingdoms from that point on? This would make Elizabeth II the rightful Queen of Scotland. BTW, in a year and 208 days Elizabeth II will pass Victory for the longest reigning monarch in Britain. I believe I’ve heard that Prince Charles is now the longest King-in-Waiting as well. All very confusing to me … ---
**Author:** ![Siam\_Sam](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/d78d45/32.png) [@Siam\_Sam](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Siam_Sam)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 4:18pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/22 "2014-02-14T16:18:11Z")
What’s Sean Connery doing these days? ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/23 "2014-02-14T16:25:31Z")
> [@psychonaut](#): > > That would be interesting. But is there anyone in the current line of succession, or in any pretending line of succession, who speaks Gaelic? No, but I’m sure it would not be difficult to construct a genealogy going back to a past king of Scotland. ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 4:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/24 "2014-02-14T16:43:28Z")
The better question is, if Scotland decides to grant the rest of the UK their independence, what monarch would England et al choose? It seems to me that since the Union consisted of the guy who was already King of Scotland becoming the King of England as well, it was Scotland conquering England, not the other way around. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 5:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/25 "2014-02-14T17:00:20Z")
If we are pushing for a Scottish noble, are there any that are really pushing for independence enough to be rewarded for their efforts with the monarchy? If we consider going back to the Stuarts, could we go further back and find the descendents of Robert Bruce? ---
**Author:** ![Mississippienne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/d2c977/32.png) [@Mississippienne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Mississippienne)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 5:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/26 "2014-02-14T17:49:55Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > If we consider going back to the Stuarts, could we go further back and find the descendents of Robert Bruce? The Stuarts ARE descended from Robert Bruce. Robert II of Scotland’s mother was Marjorie, eldest daughter of Robert [the] Bruce. I guess we could retroactively legitimate Charles II’s illegitimate son James Scott, the one who claimed that his mother was legally married to Charles II and was beheaded for trying to depose his uncle James II. In this case, the heir would appear to be Richard Scott, 10th Duke of Buccleuch and 12th Duke of Queensberry (his heir is 30-year-old Walter Scott, earl of Dalkeith). I doubt he speaks Gaelic, but he’d be a Scott for Scotland! ---
**Author:** ![Tom\_Tildrum](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e95f7d/32.png) [@Tom\_Tildrum](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tom_Tildrum)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 5:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/27 "2014-02-14T17:54:41Z")
Choose Harry, and turn Scotland into a total party kingdom. ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 7:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/28 "2014-02-14T19:16:28Z")
I hear they’re going to go with the very heroic (and winner of Wimbledon) Angus Podgorney. ---
**Author:** ![Loach](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/loach/32/350_2.png) [@Loach](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Loach)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 7:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/29 "2014-02-14T19:41:11Z")
> [@Siam\_Sam](#): > > What’s Sean Connery doing these days? If he’s not feeling up to it how about David Tennant? ---
**Author:** ![Tamerlane](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tamerlane/32/7602_2.png) [@Tamerlane](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tamerlane)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 8:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/30 "2014-02-14T20:30:52Z")
> [@Dr.Drake](#): > > Failing a Stuart, I would like to see a Gaelic-speaking king. They haven’t had one of those since the Middle Ages, and it’s about time. A little late on that one - there are fewer than 100,000 speakers of Gaelic in Scotland and only about 60% are “native” speakers ( i.e. not learned in school ). At this point a Gaelic-speaking king would be virtually a foreigner, like a Basque-speaking king of France ;). ---
**Author:** ![Chimera](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/8e8cbc/32.png) [@Chimera](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chimera)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/31 "2014-02-14T20:31:26Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > If he’s not feeling up to it how about David Tennant? Ok, that would be fucking awesome. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 8:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/32 "2014-02-14T20:47:32Z")
> [@Loach](#): > > If he’s not feeling up to it how about David Tennant? Would a new monarch be called a regeneration? ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 9:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/33 "2014-02-14T21:04:55Z")
> [@watchwolf49](#): > > …BTW, in a year and 208 days Elizabeth II will pass Victory for the longest reigning monarch in Britain… Do you mean her?: [Fiona Victory - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fiona_Victory) Or her?: [Queen Victoria - Wikipedia](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Queen_victoria) > [@Loach](#): > > If he’s not feeling up to it how about David Tennant? Hmm. I saw him in a simulcast of _Richard II_, and he seemed quite comfortable with a crown and throne: [http://www.rsc.org.uk/whats-on/richard-ii/](http://www.rsc.org.uk/whats-on/richard-ii/) ---
**Author:** ![cmkeller](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmkeller/32/118_2.png) [@cmkeller](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmkeller)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 9:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/34 "2014-02-14T21:10:11Z")
Siam Sam: > [@](#): > > What’s Sean Connery doing these days? Your mother, Trebek! Haw Haw! ---
**Author:** ![Ximenean](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/x/aca169/32.png) [@Ximenean](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ximenean)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 9:17pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/35 "2014-02-14T21:17:07Z")
Problem with David Tennant is that he’s no nationalist: “_I had no great sense of nationalism when I was in Scotland, and I could never understand why the SNP were banging on about it._” ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 9:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/36 "2014-02-14T21:22:18Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > The better question is, if Scotland decides to grant the rest of the UK their independence, what monarch would England et al choose? It seems to me that since the Union consisted of the guy who was already King of Scotland becoming the King of England as well, it was Scotland conquering England, not the other way around. Henry VII of England had two kids, Henry VIII and Margaret Tudor. Margaret was married off to James IV of Scotland, When Henry VIII died, Edward VI was crowned, but he died without issue, so the crown reverted to Henry VIII’s oldest daughter, Mary I … who also died without issue. Not things get weird … The Catholic Church never recognized Henry VIII marriage to Anna Boleyn, so Elizabeth was illegitimate. Once Mary I died, we go back to Henry VII’s oldest daughter, Margaret, who’s son was James V of Scotland, who was already dead and had an oldest daughter Marie Stuart, aka Mary, Queen of the Scots. Mary Stuart was Catholic and so completely unacceptable to Protestant England … so Elizabeth was crowned. Elizabeth died without issue, Mary Stuart was beheaded beforehand … and Mary’s boy, James VI was raised Protestant so he was crowned King of England, Wales, Ireland and already holding the crown of Scotland. Oh, Mary Stuart was King Francis II of France’s widow as well. In a nutshell … English and Scottish royalty of this era all came from Henry VII’s loins. Perhaps someone else can fill in where it went from here … ---
**Author:** ![Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/7cd45c/32.png) [@Elendil\_s\_Heir](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Elendil_s_Heir)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 9:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/37 "2014-02-14T21:30:08Z")
I think Scotland needs a poet-king with a keen grasp of high finance. Long live King Ewan!: [The Poet McTeagle - YouTube](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4W9p_NFm6qk) ---
**Author:** ![Guinastasia](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/guinastasia/32/5751_2.png) [@Guinastasia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Guinastasia)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 9:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/38 "2014-02-14T21:47:01Z")
Obscure German? Are you kidding? Pretty much EVERY obscure German royalty has some claim to the British throne, thanks to Queen Victoria and her family. Hell, almost every NON-obscure royalty has some claim as well. (Both reigning and pretenders) > [@watchwolf49](#): > > James VI of Scotland became also James I of England, wouldn’t the line of succession follow the same for both kingdoms from that point on? This would make Elizabeth II the rightful Queen of Scotland. BTW, in a year and 208 days Elizabeth II will pass Victory for the longest reigning monarch in Britain. I believe I’ve heard that Prince Charles is now the longest King-in-Waiting as well. > > All very confusing to me … Yes, BUT, as somenoe mentioned, James’s grandson, James II, was overthrown by his daughters. He had a son, who had issue (ever heard of Bonnie Prince Charlie?) So if they have descendents, they could also have a claim. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 9:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/39 "2014-02-14T21:48:00Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > Which two Garmanys are you talking about? There were three. DBR, DDR, and Berlin, the latter consisting of the three Berlin zones occupied by France, UK and USA, which had a separate Bundestag, which in effect rubber-stamped all the actions of the DBR. Berlin was a puppet in every sense of the word, but still an independent entity with its own separate governing and administrative body. It is then Berlin, that would be more or less equivalent to Scotland. DDR was Germany in name only – a completely separate state, not beholden to anything that the DBR did. DBR pulled no stings at all in DDR, directly. Good post, except that _DBR_ should be _BRD_. [ul][li]DDR = Deutsche Demokratische Republik = German Democratic Republic = GDR[/li][li]BRD = Bundesrepublik Deutschland = Federal Republic of Germany = FRG = FROG[/ul][/li] The [Wiki article on West Berlin](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/West_Berlin) has a good discussion in its _legal status_ and _citizenship_ sections. ---
**Author:** ![Monty](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/monty/32/47_2.png) [@Monty](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Monty)\ **Post date:** [February 14, 2014, 9:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318/40 "2014-02-14T21:55:08Z")
Is [Sir Malcolm Gregor Charles Mac Gregor of Mac Gregor](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Clan_Gregor#Clan_chief) in the running for King of Scotland? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-would-be-king-or-queen-of-an-independent-scotland/681318.md?page=3)