# Who ya gonna call? \[Is there any proof of ghosts, demons, or evil spirits?\] **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [November 5, 2013, 3:02am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119 "2013-11-05T03:02:09Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 8
**Author:** ![Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/budget_player_cadet/32/205_2.png) [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Budget_Player_Cadet)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 1:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/141 "2013-11-08T13:29:27Z")
> [@Marley23](#): > > There are other ways for people to get swept up in superstition. It’s a story about things a child said in the 1940s, which probably makes it a little tough to apply real scrutiny at this stage. Bingo. You could make up pretty much any anecdotal story about 50 years ago and nobody would ever be able to verify or refute it. It’s worthless as evidence. > [@lekatt](#): > > We had people lined up all day long. But you are right, some of them are not real psychics You have a weird way of saying “all”. For any “real” psychic that can demonstrate their ability under reasonably controlled experimental conditions, there’s a _million dollars_ in prize money waiting for them from the James Randi foundation. It still hasn’t been claimed. Oh, and a piano, a leg, and a wife from Tim Minchin. No psychic has _ever_ verified their ability under controlled circumstances, and given that essentially every one who ever has tried has been revealed as a fraud would explain why there aren’t more people jumping at the bit for the Randi Foundation’s prize. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 4:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/142 "2013-11-08T16:41:07Z")
> [@Budget\_Player\_Cadet](#): > > Bingo. You could make up pretty much any anecdotal story about 50 years ago and nobody would ever be able to verify or refute it. It’s worthless as evidence. > > You have a weird way of saying “all”. For any “real” psychic that can demonstrate their ability under reasonably controlled experimental conditions, there’s a _million dollars_ in prize money waiting for them from the James Randi foundation. It still hasn’t been claimed. Oh, and a piano, a leg, and a wife from Tim Minchin. No psychic has _ever_ verified their ability under controlled circumstances, and given that essentially every one who ever has tried has been revealed as a fraud would explain why there aren’t more people jumping at the bit for the Randi Foundation’s prize. I read that event of reincarnation over 20 years ago. You really believe that don’t you. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 5:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/143 "2013-11-08T17:09:34Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > I didn’t ignore it, I read it. I read many of Sagan’s books, Einstein’s books, Hawkins’ books, and other science books. I try to keep up with developments in Neuroscience, and Quantum physics. I also read spiritual books. your inability to accurately quote or cite any of these calls this statement into question. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 5:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/144 "2013-11-08T17:15:35Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > I read that event of reincarnation over 20 years ago. > > You really believe that don’t you. Do you have any evidence that would belay that belief? ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/145 "2013-11-08T17:21:04Z")
> [@simster](#): > > your inability to accurately quote or cite any of these calls this statement into question. Yes, and most everything I say is questioned, with anger and name calling. I don’t understand where all that comes from. Why are you holding all the anger? Tell me so I will understand. Remember Yoda’s “fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, and hate leads to suffering.” I have experienced spiritual events for many years and it doesn’t bother me. I know who I am and what I am doing here. Why can’t there be a civil discussion of this subject. I am thankful skeptics are in the minority on this issue. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 5:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/146 "2013-11-08T17:53:41Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > Yes, and most everything I say is questioned, with anger and name calling. I don’t understand where all that comes from. Why are you holding all the anger? Tell me so I will understand. Remember Yoda’s “fear leads to anger, anger leads to hate, and hate leads to suffering.” I have experienced spiritual events for many years and it doesn’t bother me. I know who I am and what I am doing here. Why can’t there be a civil discussion of this subject. I am thankful skeptics are in the minority on this issue. This is a discussion board - specifically the ‘great debates’ section of a discussion board - I for one, have no anger or animosity toward you - but when you post bull, you can expect to be called on it, get used to it - You are reading in, as usual, the ‘name calling’ and ‘anger’ - this is a civil discussion - many posters, myself included, do get a little tired of the charade you continue to attempt with your cites and evidence. ---
**Author:** ![Yllaria](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/yllaria/32/3452_2.png) [@Yllaria](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yllaria)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/147 "2013-11-08T18:37:46Z")
I hate to say this, but from my experience answering office phones called by the general public, “I am sorry sir we no longer investigate paranormal events or happenings” translates to “Get off of my phone.” Any office that gets a certain kind of call over and over will develop a standard phrase that gets the call over with as soon as possible, with as little arguement as possible. And that includes the tone of voice. If the tone of voice made you feel validated and less likely to prolong the call, then I’d bet money that’s what it was there for. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 7:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/148 "2013-11-08T19:45:39Z")
> [@simster](#): > > This is a discussion board - specifically the ‘great debates’ section of a discussion board - I for one, have no anger or animosity toward you - but when you post bull, you can expect to be called on it, get used to it - > You are reading in, as usual, the ‘name calling’ and ‘anger’ - this is a civil discussion - many posters, myself included, do get a little tired of the charade you continue to attempt with your cites and evidence. How would you determine if I post bull. It is content or do you believe I am not honest in what I post. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 7:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/149 "2013-11-08T19:50:59Z")
> [@Yllaria](#): > > I hate to say this, but from my experience answering office phones called by the general public, “I am sorry sir we no longer investigate paranormal events or happenings” translates to “Get off of my phone.” Any office that gets a certain kind of call over and over will develop a standard phrase that gets the call over with as soon as possible, with as little arguement as possible. And that includes the tone of voice. If the tone of voice made you feel validated and less likely to prolong the call, then I’d bet money that’s what it was there for. I would not have thought one would necessarily mean the other. I would just think that they didn’t investigate paranormal events. Could you not refer them to someone who does investigate them. ---
**Author:** ![Telemark](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/telemark/32/372_2.png) [@Telemark](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Telemark)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/150 "2013-11-08T19:52:05Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > How would you determine if I post bull. We look for your name in the poster field. 🙂 > [@](#): > > It is content or do you believe I am not honest in what I post. For me, I’m not sure if you are honest in believing what you post but I give you the benefit of the doubt. However, the content of your posts have shown time and time again that you don’t understand the concepts of evidence, logic, or the scientific method. That is why people tend to pick apart your posts and expose the serious problems, inconsistencies, and nonsense in your contributions to this forum. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 7:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/151 "2013-11-08T19:58:10Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > How would you determine if I post bull. It is content or do you believe I am not honest in what I post. It is not your honesty that is in question so much as it is your incredible(one might even call it paranormal) ability tobe wrong on almost every subject you talk about, coupled with your inability to learn and retain the simplest of scientific definitions, rules and procedures. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 7:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/152 "2013-11-08T19:59:18Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > How would you determine if I post bull. It is content or do you believe I am not honest in what I post. I fully believe that you are being honest with what you think - you are not, however, being fully honest\* in your claims or citations, nor are you (seemingly) able to back up your claims with verifiable evidence. Your ‘quotes’ of other authors are rarely complete or accurate. (\*honest in the sense that every claim/cite you make is so obviously wrong you are either intentionally doing it or are so fully mis-informed that you have no other option) ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/153 "2013-11-08T20:02:13Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > I would not have thought one would necessarily mean the other. I would just think that they didn’t investigate paranormal events. Could you not refer them to someone who does investigate them. Why would they? The ‘paranormal’ does not exist… why would they waste the resources? ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 8:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/154 "2013-11-08T20:02:21Z")
> [@Telemark](#): > > We look for your name in the poster field. 🙂 > For me, I’m not sure if you are honest in believing what you post but I give you the benefit of the doubt. However, the content of your posts have shown time and time again that you don’t understand the concepts of evidence, logic, or the scientific method. That is why people tend to pick apart your posts and expose the serious problems, inconsistencies, and nonsense in your contributions to this forum. If I say I have seen a ghost which I have said. What about that is there to pick apart. You have been very insulting to me. You say I am not truthful so it is you that must prove your claim not I. You really could say you don’t believe in ghosts which would at least be polite. There is no proof that ghosts don’t exist it is only an opinion held by some. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 8:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/155 "2013-11-08T20:05:43Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > If I say I have seen a ghost which I have said. What about that is there to pick apart. You have been very insulting to me. You say I am not truthful so it is you that must prove your claim not I. You really could say you don’t believe in ghosts which would at least be polite. There is no proof that ghosts don’t exist it is only an opinion held by some. There is no evidence that ghosts exist - therefore the default assumption is that your claim is mistaken - it is you that must provide the evidence that ‘ghosts exist’ for your claim to be taken seriously. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 8:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/156 "2013-11-08T20:06:06Z")
> [@simster](#): > > Why would they? The ‘paranormal’ does not exist… why would they waste the resources? That is only an opinion held by skeptics. There are people who do research paranormal events. The caller could be referred to one of them whether they were in the city or not. ---
**Author:** ![Czarcasm](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/czarcasm/32/4050_2.png) [@Czarcasm](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Czarcasm)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/157 "2013-11-08T20:07:32Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > If I say I have seen a ghost which I have said. What about that is there to pick apart. You have been very insulting to me. You say I am not truthful so it is you that must prove your claim not I. You really could say you don’t believe in ghosts which would at least be polite. There is no proof that ghosts don’t exist it is only an opinion held by some. This post is a prime example of what we are talking about. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 8:07pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/158 "2013-11-08T20:07:58Z")
> [@simster](#): > > There is no evidence that ghosts exist - therefore the default assumption is that your claim is mistaken - it is you that must provide the evidence that ‘ghosts exist’ for your claim to be taken seriously. There is no default assumption, there are no assumptions at all that are rational. You made the claim so the burden of proof falls on you. ---
**Author:** ![lekatt](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/lekatt/32/7269_2.png) [@lekatt](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/lekatt)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 8:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/159 "2013-11-08T20:09:05Z")
> [@Czarcasm](#): > > This post is a prime example of what we are talking about. And what would that be… I am trying to learn, help me. ---
**Author:** ![simster](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/simster/32/1047_2.png) [@simster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/simster)\ **Post date:** [November 8, 2013, 8:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119/160 "2013-11-08T20:10:10Z")
> [@lekatt](#): > > That is only an opinion held by skeptics. There are people who do research paranormal events. The caller could be referred to one of them whether they were in the city or not. is it the FBI’s job to keep a list of ‘people that research stuff’ and refer them? No - its not. ‘There is no evidence for the existence of ghosts or the paranormal’ is NOT an opinion - it is a statement of fact. If you have evidence, present it - so far, you, nor anyone, has been able to present evidence that holds up to scrutiny. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119.md?page=7) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/who-ya-gonna-call-is-there-any-proof-of-ghosts-demons-or-evil-spirits/673119.md?page=9)