# Who's more at fault in this kitchen scenario? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 21, 2016, 12:58pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488 "2016-07-21T12:58:50Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![brainstall](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/35a633/32.png) [@brainstall](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brainstall)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/41 "2016-07-21T16:21:21Z")
I have often shoved things in the oven to get them out of the way in my small, nearly counterless kitchen, so I am in the habit of checking the oven when I turn it on, just to be sure. No biggie if I don’t because what I put in there is usually an oven safe cast iron pan. My friend stores large plastic containers in her oven. When she had someone house-sitting, she pointed out the containers in the oven, but the house-sitter forgot, and turned the oven on without checking and melted them all over the oven. My friend seems to think this is entirely the fault of the house-sitter. I’m inclined to think that for people who don’t normally store flammable, melty things in their oven, checking is not second nature, and they are not to blame for the damage. As far as A and B and who’s to blame? Why didn’t one of you check the oven when you first started smelling something burning? Mostly I’m just sorry this ruined a nice evening of enjoying pizza together for A & B. You need to find better things to fight about. ---
**Author:** ![watchwolf49](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/e9c0ed/32.png) [@watchwolf49](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/watchwolf49)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 4:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/42 "2016-07-21T16:21:35Z")
> [@Velocity](#): > > The OP said nothing about who was which gender but you’ve immediately leaped to the conclusion that A is female and B is male. Something of a hobby of mine. ---
**Author:** ![TriPolar](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/tripolar/32/3008_2.png) [@TriPolar](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/TriPolar)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 4:22pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/43 "2016-07-21T16:22:07Z")
> [@SmellMyWort](#): > > You realize that in the time between your walk-around and getting into your car a small child or endangered animal could have sneaked up and hidden behind your car. Good luck with the lawsuit. I do realize that, but that doesn’t release me from the responsibility to check anyway. ---
**Author:** ![psychobunny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/54ee81/32.png) [@psychobunny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/psychobunny)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 4:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/44 "2016-07-21T16:26:42Z")
To the OP: It is YOUR fault. It doesn’t matter who is person A or B. Suck it up and take the blame. ---
**Author:** ![Drunky\_Smurf](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/drunky_smurf/32/449_2.png) [@Drunky\_Smurf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Drunky_Smurf)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 4:34pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/45 "2016-07-21T16:34:46Z")
> [@watchwolf49](#): > > Person B is fully and 175% responsible … he turned the oven on, it was his duty to check inside first … it only takes 956 milliseconds to do so. Person A has absolutely _no_ blame in this case, even if she did leave the mitt in the oven. Person B _must_ apologize immediately, beg forgiveness and promise to never _ever_ try to pull this male macho bullshit ever again. > > Flowers, chocolate and tickets to the ballet are in order here. This is a vile and sexist post. I thought the SDMB was better than this. ---
**Author:** ![filmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7993a0/32.png) [@filmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmore)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 4:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/46 "2016-07-21T16:44:23Z")
Does person A have a habit of blame shifting? For example, you both leave the house and A was the last to leave and forgot to lock the door, would A blame B for not going back and checking that A locked the door? Or if B goes to the grocery store, does A blame B for not picking up something that B didn’t know they needed? Does A expect B to just know that they need more of A’s shampoo even though B doesn’t use that kind? I’m sure we all know someone who’s never at fault for anything. They can always find a way to shift the blame to another person. The OP sounds a little like that. I’m wondering if it’s a common pattern or if this is a one-time thing. It could be that the serious nature of this mistake caused A to panic and reflexively try to shift responsibility away. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 4:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/47 "2016-07-21T16:46:40Z")
But this is not an argument in which they should have stopped speaking to each other. It is as simple as A saying, I’m sorry I left the mitt in the oven, and B saying, I’m sorry I didn’t check, I’ll do so in the future. The house didn’t burn down, right? All we got was a burned mitt, which can be replaced, and a stinky smell, which will go away. This is one of those stories you laugh about later. ---
**Author:** ![Draelin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ce73a5/32.png) [@Draelin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Draelin)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 4:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/48 "2016-07-21T16:48:31Z")
> [@brainstall](#): > > My friend stores large plastic containers in her oven. When she had someone house-sitting, she pointed out the containers in the oven, but the house-sitter forgot, and turned the oven on without checking and melted them all over the oven. My friend seems to think this is entirely the fault of the house-sitter. I’m inclined to think that for people who don’t normally store flammable, melty things in their oven, checking is not second nature, and they are not to blame for the damage. I’m with your friend on this. She took the time to tell the house-sitter about it. It is perfectly understandable that the house-sitter forgot, however they are still responsible. ---
**Author:** ![Anaamika](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/a/5f9b8f/32.png) [@Anaamika](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Anaamika)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 5:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/49 "2016-07-21T17:16:01Z")
> [@Draelin](#): > > I’m with your friend on this. She took the time to tell the house-sitter about it. It is perfectly understandable that the house-sitter forgot, however they are still responsible. I’m with the housesitter. Jeez Louise, people, do _not_ store flammable objects in the oven! It is not a storage place! This is probably one of the ways fire starts. No matter what, I will never budge from the position that storing flammable objects in a place meant to heat up to several hundred degrees is a stupid, stupid idea. ETA: I just googled around and lots of fire prevention tips have this one: do not store flammable objects in the oven: “Don’t use your oven as ‘extra storage’ for flammable things like paper or plastic bags, plastic containers, or dishtowels. Even if you don’t turn the oven on, the pilot light can ignite objects inside.” Are you going to tell me you are too poor and don’t have any storage space? Well, you will have a lot less storage space when YOUR HOUSE BURNS DOWN! ---
**Author:** ![Draelin](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ce73a5/32.png) [@Draelin](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Draelin)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/50 "2016-07-21T17:21:32Z")
> [@Anaamika](#): > > I’m with the housesitter. Jeez Louise, people, do _not_ store flammable objects in the oven! It is not a storage place! This is probably one of the ways fire starts. I don’t disagree that storing flammable things in an oven is stupid and you shouldn’t ever do it. So is keeping a snake in a closed toilet. But if I go to somebody’s house and they say “Don’t use that toilet, there’s a snake in it,” it’s my fault if I forget that and get bitten on the ass. 🙂 ---
**Author:** ![Shodan](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/9f8e36/32.png) [@Shodan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Shodan)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/51 "2016-07-21T17:21:33Z")
Fourthing or fifthing the notion of “who gives a hoot in hell whose fault is it?” Excrement occurs. Blame it on kitchen gremlins if necessary. Meanwhile, the pizza is getting cold. Regards, Shodan ---
**Author:** ![Dead\_Cat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/9fc29f/32.png) [@Dead\_Cat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dead_Cat)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/52 "2016-07-21T17:25:21Z")
> [@iiandyiiii](#): > > Both are at fault. Oven mitts shouldn’t be left in the oven, and people should check the oven before turning it on. > > This is a multiple-failure scenario – a single failure wouldn’t have led to a burning oven mitt. Fix your process – the oven is off limits as storage for anything, and the oven must be checked prior to turning it on. Got it in one, so I’d just like to take a moment to note that funny stories are sometimes even funnier when told in a very matter of fact manner - nice one OP! ---
**Author:** ![filmore](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/f/7993a0/32.png) [@filmore](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/filmore)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 5:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/53 "2016-07-21T17:25:31Z")
For the people who normally store things in their oven, it would probably be a good idea to have a little sign near the on switch that says “Items may be stored in oven. Check first.” This way other residents or guests would be forewarned. I’ve heard that the homeowner can be liable for creating a risky situation that is not obvious to a guest. The example I heard was keeping your water heater set to a very high temperature. If a guest burns themselves, it would be the homeowner’s fault for not telling the guest that the temperature is much higher than normal. In the case where the homeowner told the guest of the risk (like bowls in the oven), that should be sufficient. But the homeowner can’t just expect the guest to know that flammable items may be stored in the oven, and could actually be liable if the guest is injured in that case. ---
**Author:** ![Yarster](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/y/7c8e57/32.png) [@Yarster](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Yarster)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 6:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/54 "2016-07-21T18:16:59Z")
I looked at this thread simply to see if anyone blamed B, which I can’t believe they did. In my mind, A was 100% at fault and an idiot for leaving a flammable item in the oven as a booby trap. I never think to look in the oven before I turn it on because I don’t expect a booby trap either, but I guess I will now that I know some moron might decide it’s a good place to store his fireworks and explosives collection and apparently when I plead my case on the Straight Dope after the house burns down, I’ll be told it is somehow my fault. I have had similar discussions with my wife about not leaving a room with a burning candle in it, and not placing items that are never used in front of items that are always used in the pantry, because the result will be eventual disaster. This has happened to both of us when my wife placed exotic olive oils (always in tall, skinny, and fragile glass bottles) in front of soups, cereals, and other common ingredients. Eventually someone reaches around the olive oil, tries to pull out the needed item, and brushes against the unstable oil bottle, which commits ritual suicide, jumping from a high shelf in the pantry to its violent death on the tile floor below. It explodes and creates a 30+ minute clean-up project that stains clothes and creates an ongoing hazard because the dog will eventually find and eat that one piece of glass you missed that is covered in delicious olive oil. My other favorite is the ongoing arms race of plate and serving dish designers who insist that everything must be a different size, have raised or pointed edges,with asymmetric aspects, and be just-nice-enough that they can never been thrown out. My wife loves these. The result is an inevitable Jenga tower of porcelain that was fine when you closed the cabinet, but has inexplicably shifted and falls towards the next person who opens that cabinet. I refer to these as booby traps too, and I regularly have to remind my wife to please not do that because A is ALWAYS AT FAULT in these situations! ---
**Author:** ![IvoryTowerDenizen](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ivorytowerdenizen/32/17937_2.png) [@IvoryTowerDenizen](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/IvoryTowerDenizen)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 6:45pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/55 "2016-07-21T18:45:41Z")
I’m still missing the part where the oven mitt ended up in the oven deliberately. If it was a routine storage place then B should have known to check (even if B thought putting it there was stupid). If it was an accident or one time occurrence, then A doesn’t bear the full brunt of the responsibility. Why this didn’t end up with A and B both laughing at themselves for perfect storm of accidents is beyond me. ---
**Author:** ![Karen\_Lingel](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/karen_lingel/32/18649_2.png) [@Karen\_Lingel](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Karen_Lingel)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/56 "2016-07-21T19:15:43Z")
100% A’s fault. ---
**Author:** ![Natlaw](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/a88e57/32.png) [@Natlaw](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Natlaw)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/57 "2016-07-21T19:26:40Z")
Now I know why my oven insists I open/close the door before it’ll turn on 🙂 Though that didn’t prevent me from melting a plastic container I meant to microwave. ---
**Author:** ![Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/eyebrows_0f_doom/32/3119_2.png) [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Eyebrows_0f_Doom)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 7:29pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/58 "2016-07-21T19:29:35Z")
> [@IvoryTowerDenizen](#): > > I’m still missing the part where the oven mitt ended up in the oven deliberately. If it was a routine storage place then B should have known to check (even if B thought putting it there was stupid). If it was an accident or one time occurrence, then A doesn’t bear the full brunt of the responsibility. > > Why this didn’t end up with A and B both laughing at themselves for perfect storm of accidents is beyond me. How would it get in there accidentally? You use the oven mitt to lift up the hot item and take it out of the oven. For the oven mitt to then go back into the oven it would have to have been put there. They’re both at fault, but 95% percent is A. ---
**Author:** ![kayaker](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/kayaker/32/441_2.png) [@kayaker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/kayaker)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 7:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/59 "2016-07-21T19:40:08Z")
> [@Eyebrows\_0f\_Doom](#): > > How would it get in there accidentally? When I warm plates in the oven, I put a mitt or towel down first to keep the plates clean. I can imagine grabbing my heated plates and forgetting the towel or mitt, especially if I’m cooking for a special occasion. Things get hectic. ETA: but I always look in the oven before preheating it. How would I know how the racks are set, otherwise? ---
**Author:** ![Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/9de053/32.png) [@Jackknifed\_Juggernaut](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Jackknifed_Juggernaut)\ **Post date:** [July 21, 2016, 7:44pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488/60 "2016-07-21T19:44:23Z")
Persons A and B have resolved their issue: If Person A leaves any flammable items in the oven, then Person A will have to put in $10 into the vacation fund. And if Person B forgets to check the oven before turning it on, then a similar fine will be assessed. Part of the issue is that Person A thinks it’s perfectly normal to store oven mitts in an oven and doesn’t want to change a practice that has apparently gone on for generations, and unanimously approved by each and every individual that Person A has ever encountered. While Person B thinks that Person A will soon be receiving a Darwin award, Person B is afraid that the award may erroneously go to Person B, posthumously, since everyone knows that Person A is an expert in the kitchen while Person B is a novice. The vacation fund exists for that special trip to heaven on earth, which is currently preferable to a free trip to actual heaven (preceded by a short period in what will appear to be hell). [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488.md?page=2) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-at-fault-in-this-kitchen-scenario/760488.md?page=4)