# Who's more delusional - the Obama birthers or the moon landing deniers? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [July 24, 2009, 1:46pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119 "2009-07-24T13:46:31Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 10
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 9:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/181 "2009-07-31T21:37:25Z")
> [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](#): > > Hannity plays to the antichristers too. He’s more subtle about it. He does montages of Obama while playing the theme to the Omen … “Theme to The Omen”? I’m not a big fan, but the piece in question is _Carmina Burana_, by Carl Orff, which was composed in 1937 and frankly is in the standard repertoire. ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 9:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/182 "2009-07-31T21:41:02Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > The citizen parent has to have been on US soil for at least five years after turning 14; Obama’s mother wasn’t old enough to have done so. That law was changed in the 80s but was not retroactive. This law only applies to the Acquisition of U.S. Citizenship By a Child _Born Abroad_. Obama was born in Hawaii, a State of the U.S.A. End of story, unless you’re a wacko rating 7 or 8. ---
**Author:** ![Gangster\_Octopus](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/a8b319/32.png) [@Gangster\_Octopus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gangster_Octopus)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 9:43pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/183 "2009-07-31T21:43:35Z")
> [@cricetus](#): > > The citizen parent has to have been on US soil for at least five years after turning 14; Obama’s mother wasn’t old enough to have done so. That law was changed in the 80s but was not retroactive. I’m not sure, then I understand what you are saying, Ann Dunham lived in the US until she was 25, if Wikipedia is right. That seems to clearly meet the requirments. ---
**Author:** ![Strassia](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/e8c25b/32.png) [@Strassia](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Strassia)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 10:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/184 "2009-07-31T22:09:28Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > I’m not sure, then I understand what you are saying, Ann Dunham lived in the US until she was 25, if Wikipedia is right. That seems to clearly meet the requirments. If any U.S. citizen aged 18 has a child who is born outside the U.S. that child will not be a natural born citizen and thus would be ineligible to be president. That is why birthers insist that for some inexplicable reason Ann Dunham Obama (she was married at the time) flew to Africa to give birth to her son. Since she gave birth on U.S. soil, it is irrelevant. If she had been 19 when she gave birth, she could have been anywhere in the world and it would not matter. For the child to not be a natural born citizen both conditions must be meet (less than 5 years after 14 **and** born outside U.S.). On preview, maybe the confusion is that the 5 years after 14 condition must be met at the time of the birth. If I had gotten a foreign exchange student pregnant in high school and she had given birth outside the U.S. the conditions would not be met retroactively when if I stayed in the U.S. until I turned 19. ---
**Author:** ![Whack-a-Mole](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/whack-a-mole/32/141_2.png) [@Whack-a-Mole](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Whack-a-Mole)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 10:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/185 "2009-07-31T22:32:51Z")
Well…just keeps getting scarier: > [@](#): > > Only 42 percent of Republican respondents in a Research 2000 survey, conducted for the liberal website Daily Kos, said they thought Obama was a natural born citizen; 28 percent said they did not believe Obama was born in the United States; 30 percent said they were not sure. > > \ > > The conspiracy has a regional flavor. Overall, even including Democrats and independents, only 47 percent of respondents in the South said they believed Obama was born in America, with 23 percent saying he was not and 30 percent saying they were unsure. In the Northeast and Midwest, the percentage of respondents who believe Obama was born in the U.S. was over 90 percent. > > Ninety-three percent of Democrats say the president was born in the United States, as do 83 percent of independents. > > SOURCE: [New Poll: Less Than Half Of Republicans Believe Obama Was Born In U.S. | HuffPost Latest News](http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/07/31/new-poll-less-than-half-o_n_248470.html) ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/186 "2009-07-31T22:50:04Z")
> [@Gangster\_Octopus](#): > > I’m not sure, then I understand what you are saying, Ann Dunham lived in the US until she was 25, if Wikipedia is right. That seems to clearly meet the requirments. She was only 18 when Barack was born. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 10:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/187 "2009-07-31T22:51:08Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > This law only applies to the Acquisition of U.S. Citizenship By a Child _Born Abroad_. > > Obama was born in Hawaii, a State of the U.S.A. End of story, unless you’re a wacko rating 7 or 8. Never said otherwise. Somebody asked a “what if” question and I answered it. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 10:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/188 "2009-07-31T22:52:54Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > “Theme to The Omen”? I’m not a big fan, but the piece in question is _Carmina Burana_, by Carl Orff, which was composed in 1937 and frankly is in the standard repertoire. You’re probably right about the source, but Dio is right about why Hannity chose it. It’s antichrist music! We’re talking about the 70s movie, not the recent crap remake with Mia Farrow. ---
**Author:** ![Marley23](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/45deac/32.png) [@Marley23](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marley23)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 10:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/189 "2009-07-31T22:54:01Z")
> [@Whack-a-Mole](#): > > Well…just keeps getting scarier: They can’t do anything, so it doesn’t matter. At this rate, it’ll be near 100 percent of Republicans because the other GOP members will leave for fear of being mistaken for these loons. ---
**Author:** ![tnetennba](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/7993a0/32.png) [@tnetennba](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/tnetennba)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 10:55pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/190 "2009-07-31T22:55:36Z")
> [@Chief\_Pedant](#): > > The Pedant, usually knowledgeable about topics he posts on, is so clueless about this topic he’s not even sure what “birther dogma” is… > > If I took up the torch, I’m confident I’d have you believing in no time, though. 😉 > > The extent of my knowledge is: > > 1. Some folks don’t think Mr Obama is a citizen. > 2. The only thing Mr Obama has presented to the contrary is the official birth certificate–i.e. that thing you get when you ask the county clerk for a copy of your birth certificate. I got 'em for my kids so they can get passports and stuff. > > That’s it. That’s all I got, and I’m happy to admit I know nothing else, and the two things I think I know might be wrong… > > As a physician, I can tell you when someone is born there is a whole boatload of hospital records, including (40 years ago) a hand-filled-out form around the birth, but also stuff like “…primigravida admitted at term; 8 cm dilated and 90% effaced…” If I were Mr Obama, I’d either blow off the nutcases and give ‘em nuttin’–they’ll just move on to the next conspiracy–or give 'em my hospital record and send them back to their holes to cook up the next complaint. > > If no records were available, I’d just say, “Sir; no records are available. You may continue to address me as Mr President until you find some to the contrary.” I guess I am assuming Mr Obama has produced all he has (since there would be no reason to withhold exculpatory documents) or else just doesn’t care. > > Neither do I. I rather think most of these “birther” people probably just don’t like the man. Were he their type, I doubt they’d be harassing him over the issue. Nor will I be belaboring this thread anymore. Maybe instead of taking so much time composing your theories about what might be going on and chortling publicly about how you don’t know anything about it – which is not as charming as you think it is – you can just read the thread so far. You are adding absolutely nothing to the content. ---
**Author:** ![DSYoungEsq](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/c6cbf5/32.png) [@DSYoungEsq](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DSYoungEsq)\ **Post date:** [July 31, 2009, 11:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/191 "2009-07-31T23:12:12Z")
> [@Chief\_Pedant](#): > > The Pedant, usually knowledgeable about topics he posts on, is so clueless about this topic he’s not even sure what “birther dogma” is… > > If I took up the torch, I’m confident I’d have you believing in no time, though. 😉 > > The extent of my knowledge is: > > 1. Some folks don’t think Mr Obama is a citizen. > 2. The only thing Mr Obama has presented to the contrary is the official birth certificate–i.e. that thing you get when you ask the county clerk for a copy of your birth certificate. I got 'em for my kids so they can get passports and stuff. > > That’s it. That’s all I got, and I’m happy to admit I know nothing else, and the two things I think I know might be wrong… > > As a physician, I can tell you when someone is born there is a whole boatload of hospital records, including (40 years ago) a hand-filled-out form around the birth, but also stuff like “…primigravida admitted at term; 8 cm dilated and 90% effaced…” If I were Mr Obama, I’d either blow off the nutcases and give ‘em nuttin’–they’ll just move on to the next conspiracy–or give 'em my hospital record and send them back to their holes to cook up the next complaint. > > If no records were available, I’d just say, “Sir; no records are available. You may continue to address me as Mr President until you find some to the contrary.” I guess I am assuming Mr Obama has produced all he has (since there would be no reason to withhold exculpatory documents) or else just doesn’t care. > > Neither do I. I rather think most of these “birther” people probably just don’t like the man. Were he their type, I doubt they’d be harassing him over the issue. Nor will I be belaboring this thread anymore. Hawaii doesn’t issue so-called “long forms.” They keep the original long form (the one with the signatures and all) in the state’s archives. There isn’t even an official way to request it. But you would have known that if you had, you know, educated yourself about the topic first, before talking about it. @whoever said that the birthers hate Pres. Obama because he’s black: I don’t think that’s Orly Taitz’ motivation. Mind you, she’s nutty as a dingbat, but I believe she is truly upset about the issue at hand. It offends her that she went through all sorts of hoops to become a citizen, but that Pres. Obama got in on a pass, as she views it. And it’s hard to be as passionate and convicted as she is on the topic without being truly a believer in the idea. This, of course, doesn’t mean that 99% of the people who question his citizenship don’t have that thought process. ☹ ---
**Author:** ![BrainGlutton](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/82dd89/32.png) [@BrainGlutton](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrainGlutton)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2009, 12:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/192 "2009-08-01T00:06:50Z")
> [@Knorf](#): > > “Theme to The Omen”? I’m not a big fan, but the piece in question is _Carmina Burana_, by Carl Orff, which was composed in 1937 and frankly is in the standard repertoire. No, I think it’s [“Ave Satani”](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ave_Satani) (composed for the film) not [“Carmina Burana.”](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carmina_Burana#Musical_settings_of_these_texts) I’ve often seen the two confused. ---
**Author:** ![SteveG1](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/bb73d2/32.png) [@SteveG1](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/SteveG1)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2009, 1:08am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/193 "2009-08-01T01:08:53Z")
> [@C3](#): > > Not only would they have had to plan this over 47 years ago, but if they were planning a takeover of the U.S. government back then, wouldn’t they have made sure Obama’s mom did give birth in the U.S. and name him Joe Smith or something? If it’s all a plot, it’s a pretty poorly conceived one. All that is exactly what they wanted you to believe. Those Kenyans are diabolically clever, and they have the full backing of _dun dun dunnnnnn_ The Illuminati. :eek: ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2009, 1:15am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/194 "2009-08-01T01:15:36Z")
"Dear freind, I am a kenyan goverment minister who must get a baby out of the country. This oportunity may help you earn as much as one millions dollars u.s…" ---
**Author:** ![holmes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e95f7d/32.png) [@holmes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/holmes)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2009, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/195 "2009-08-01T01:40:32Z")
opps. ---
**Author:** ![holmes](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e95f7d/32.png) [@holmes](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/holmes)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2009, 1:44am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/196 "2009-08-01T01:44:51Z")
The thing is, according to her, there is nothing Obama can do to become a [Natural born Citizen](http://www.colbertnation.com/the-colbert-report-videos/229691/july-28-2009/womb-raiders---orly-taitz) So even if Obama, "released the **document** it won’t matter to these people. ---
**Author:** ![Knorf](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/k/58956e/32.png) [@Knorf](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Knorf)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2009, 5:48am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/197 "2009-08-01T05:48:45Z")
> [@BrainGlutton](#): > > No, I think it’s [“Ave Satani”](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ave_Satani) (composed for the film) not [“Carmina Burana.”](http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Carmina_Burana#Musical_settings_of_these_texts) I’ve often seen the two confused. The Hannity crud used Orff. I don’t remember (or care about) The Omen’s music. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2009, 5:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/198 "2009-08-01T05:49:32Z")
Hannity used the Omen. ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2009, 5:54am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/199 "2009-08-01T05:54:55Z")
[Here’s the youtube.](http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=doqYZ0RC7a0) ---
**Author:** ![Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/e99b99/32.png) [@Diogenes\_the\_Cynic](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Diogenes_the_Cynic)\ **Post date:** [August 1, 2009, 6:04am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119/200 "2009-08-01T06:04:24Z")
At least, I’m like 99% sure it’s from the Omen. They commented on it on the Daily Show as well. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119.md?page=9) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-more-delusional-the-obama-birthers-or-the-moon-landing-deniers/504119.md?page=11)