# Who's to blame if Biden loses? **URL:** \ **Category:** Politics & Elections\ **Created:** [May 7, 2024, 6:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233 "2024-05-07T18:41:05Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 26
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2024, 5:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/591 "2024-05-19T17:47:07Z")
As you acknowledge, the problem isn’t reality here, it’s perception of reality. ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2024, 6:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/594 "2024-05-19T18:21:49Z")
Of course it’s a real problem. But you said it above: people vote on their perceptions. Maybe they’re right and maybe they’re wrong, but most voters are not assiduously and accurately assessing reality; they are voting their feelings + their knowledge & experiences. Anyone in Detroit understands the situation well enough that it’s not going to swing the election. Anyone outside of Michigan doesn’t care enough about Detroit to let it swing the election (except, in both cases, where “Detroit” is code for “black,” and frankly I don’t want the racist vote). ---
**Author:** ![Dr.Drake](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/ad7895/32.png) [@Dr.Drake](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dr.Drake)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2024, 6:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/596 "2024-05-19T18:32:16Z")
I can certainly yield on that point, because I was basing it on years of media coverage of Detroit, but people have short & malleable memories. ---
**Author:** ![Sherrerd](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/sherrerd/32/8_2.png) [@Sherrerd](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Sherrerd)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2024, 10:20pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/597 "2024-05-19T22:20:54Z")
> [@On another topic](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1001913/88): > > Yes it’s rising nationwide. When it’s rising in cities like Detroit, Milwaukee, Vegas, and Philly, and **people in these cities perceive the sitting President as just shrugging this off,** then these people don’t turn out to vote for him. > > Biden won in 2020 by a measly 44,000 votes in GA, WI, and AZ; without those states he would’ve tied with Trump’s EC count. In Michigan, Biden won only by 154,188 votes. Y’all crunch the numbers. There is no way he wins if “homelessness is on the rise but so what?” is **what voters in these states are hearing from him and his fan club.** My bolding. This post is representative of the argumentation tactic you’ve exhibited throughout this thread. You claim, without any supportive evidence, that Awful Biden and the Awful Democrats are saying X—X always being something cold and mean. And then you offer your advice, which is that Awful Biden and the Awful Democrats should stop saying those cold and mean things. Awful Biden and the Awful Democrats should, instead of saying the cold and mean X, start _listening_! And should start showing some compassion! And should solve X! Instead of saying cold and mean things the way we all agree they do! (And of course we do _ **not** _.) This particular argumentative tactic is getting a bit…old. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2024, 11:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/598 "2024-05-19T23:02:45Z")
> [@On another topic](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1001913/77): > > Do the people quoted in this article sound indoctrinated by Russia and Fox News? Looking at their web site, I think they sound like pre-Tea Party Republicans: [https://www.neweraworld.work/about-us](https://www.neweraworld.work/about-us) A reasonable question to ask New Era leaders: Since you believe in “self-sufficiency” for urban and/or Black communities, what is it that you want from national political leaders? I do not know what they would say. They won’t say this, but I think the New Era types would like it if Biden made it a point to go to a soul food restaurant – always at the most off-peak hours – once a week or so. During the week, he can dine in Washington DC, and on weekends, in Delaware. It’s also a fifteen minute drive from his northern Delaware house to Mexican restaurants in Pennsylvania. He should go to one every weekend he’s in Delaware. Have his driver go a different way every time – but no closing roads. This will be worth more than TV ads. ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2024, 11:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/599 "2024-05-19T23:21:53Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > Have his driver go a different way every time – but no closing roads. You bring up a good point.They can’t go anywhere any longer. Not without causing huge disruptions. So they don’t except for very specific campaign stuff. ---
**Author:** ![Chingon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chingon/32/17645_2.png) [@Chingon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chingon)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2024, 11:23pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/600 "2024-05-19T23:23:31Z")
> [@PhillyGuy](#): > > They won’t say this, but I think the New Era types would like it if Biden made it a point to go to a soul food restaurant – always at the most off-peak hours – once a week or so. During the week, he can dine in Washington DC, and on weekends, in Delaware. > > It’s also a fifteen minute drive from his northern Delaware house to Mexican restaurants in Pennsylvania. He should go to one every weekend he’s in Delaware. Have his driver go a different way every time – but no closing roads. This will be worth more than TV ads. He would get rightly excoriated for shameless pandering. Might as well have him eat a taco salad to win the Latino vote… ---
**Author:** ![Common\_Tater](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/common_tater/32/13846_2.png) [@Common\_Tater](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Common_Tater)\ **Post date:** [May 19, 2024, 11:32pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/601 "2024-05-19T23:32:53Z")
He could carry around some Huy Fong Schiracha sauce! Well, if he can find any. It was unobtainium for a couple years, and sounds like it will be again soon. ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 12:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/602 "2024-05-20T00:27:11Z")
> [@Chingon](#): > > He would get rightly excoriated for shameless pandering. Might as well have him eat a taco salad to win the Latino vote… That’s much better than [hanging out with rich people hoping to trade money for proximity to power](https://indianexpress.com/article/world/indian-american-billionaires-dinner-president-biden-fundraiser-9322302/). The area of Pennsylvania, near Biden’s New Castle County house, is heavily Mexican American. It seems like every other gas station has a Taqueria on the side. So he wouldn’t be going out of his way. If Joe is so afraid of harmless pandering, he’s to blame for ever having gone into politics. ---
**Author:** ![Chingon](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chingon/32/17645_2.png) [@Chingon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chingon)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 12:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/605 "2024-05-20T00:49:11Z")
What size dashiki do you think Biden should buy? ---
**Author:** ![PhillyGuy](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/ed655f/32.png) [@PhillyGuy](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/PhillyGuy)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 12:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/606 "2024-05-20T00:58:23Z")
> [@On another topic](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1001913/94): > > The soul food idea gave me second hand embarrassment so bad I had to look away from it when responding to his post. What gave me second-hand embarrassment was Biden pledging to appoint a Black woman to the Supreme Court. (Yes, Trump pledged a woman.) Biden gets credit for [going to Italian restaurants in Wilmington](https://www.delawareonline.com/story/life/2024/02/13/president-joe-biden-dines-landmark-wilmington-italian-restaurant-mrs-robinos/72568329007/). Is that embarrassing? Re your comment about what New Era wants, that could be. But I do not see them saying much in the way of wanting expanded government programs. It sounded more to me that they wanted a showing of time and caring. Of course, Biden has limited time, so no blame there. One reason Joe does go to Pennsylvania a lot is that it is close. Michigan is a longer trip. ---
**Author:** ![MyFootsZZZ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/myfootszzz/32/12580_2.png) [@MyFootsZZZ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/MyFootsZZZ)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 2:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/608 "2024-05-20T02:46:47Z")
> [@Sherrerd](#): > > that Awful Biden and the Awful Democrats are saying X—X always being something cold and mean. And then you offer your advice, which is that Awful Biden and the Awful Democrats should stop saying those cold and mean things. That’s obviously not a fair characterization. If I were Biden or Hillary, I wouldn’t be so dismissive of the people who are, for whatever reason, frustrated with them and/or the system. I understand that things are insane right now with Trump and MAGA, however I’m sure they’ve done things that’ve lead us to the situation we’re in now. They’re also guilty of some crazy crap in the past, that’s lead us, and the world, here. These are people, not heroes, “Super” or otherwise. I understand people make mistakes. But, why are they being so condescending? “Aren’t you supposed to lie to me and _kiss my_ butt?” When I see people really “glaze” Biden, I just think some of them are being dismissing or overlooking the fact that certain people have legitimate grievances and have the right to be pissed off. There’s a range of people begrudgingly voting Biden because of this, and seemingly people who are not voting for him, (which I still think is foolish, and innocent/undeserving people may [will] suffer as a result). Change might better be implemented on more ‘stable ground’, But first, you have to be specific of what you want to change and what one can due to achieve it. if you are currently doing what you can to offer perspective/influence on the matter, besides voting? You’d rather fight Trump over Biden? Still, I understand that some people are never satisfied, and that ‘many factors are at play’ when it comes to these powerful people’s past, and that everybody’s ‘only human’, and we’re not all going to agree on everything…at the very least, don’t you think the powerful should be a bit more, humble? We obviously shouldn’t glorify these people or hold them to any unrealistic expectations. Biden and the Democrats haven’t, in this instance, learned from past mistakes when Trump was first elected. In summary, I think we all share the blame, to some extent. No reason to burn it all to the ground, though. Seems kind of counterproductive for us. ---
**Author:** ![survinga](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/cab0a1/32.png) [@survinga](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/survinga)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 2:55am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/609 "2024-05-20T02:55:12Z")
> [@MyFootsZZZ](#): > > Who would be to blame for a Biden loss, and to what degree? I’m going to blame the Biden campaign in Pennsylvania, Michigan, or Wisconsin if he loses. Those are the three states where everything will be decided. And he has to do whatever it takes to win those three states. You could maybe throw Nevada & Arizona in there. But it’s really those old “Blue Wall” states that Biden needs to win. His advisers need to be lazer focused on those three states, and get in there and leave no stone unturned. I’ve seen people on this thread talk about how we have uninformed ignorant voters, an old media that doesn’t properly report the facts, social media which amplifies hate, and we have MAGA-GOP who are essentially fascists. All of that is absolutely true. But the thing is, Democrats in general are doing OK in congressional polling. They’ve done well in special elections. And they have a good shot of keeping the Senate and flipping the House. The only place that looks messed up for the Dems right now is Biden vs Trump. Even with all the problems that structurally hurt Democrats, it’s only the Biden race where I’m worried. I’m a Biden voter. And I think he’s done a very good job facilitating the end of the pandemic, supporting stimulus & legislation to spur a very fast recovery from the pandemic recession, all of which has resulted in an overall lowering of crime. But he has to sell what he’s done, and he has to get in front of voters and listen to them. He has to show energy. He needs to do more interviews. When he went in front of Congress in March, he knocked it out of the park. We need more of **that** Biden. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 7:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/610 "2024-05-20T19:04:12Z")
> [@survinga](#): > > I’m going to blame the Biden campaign in Pennsylvania, Michigan, or Wisconsin if he loses. Those are the three states where everything will be decided. And he has to do whatever it takes to win those three states. You could maybe throw Nevada & Arizona in there. But it’s really those old “Blue Wall” states that Biden needs to win. His advisers need to be lazer focused on those three states, and get in there and leave no stone unturned. I don’t think there is a foolproof strategy that guarantees that Biden will win those states just by “doing whatever it takes.” He could run the perfect campaign and still lose. ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 7:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/611 "2024-05-20T19:09:22Z")
> [@Procrustus](#): > > He could run the perfect campaign and still lose. Exactly. Which is why the ultimate blame, as it always does, lies with the voters (and eligible voters who choose not to vote), whatever the outcome. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 7:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/612 "2024-05-20T19:15:13Z")
> [@survinga](#): > > I’m going to blame the Biden campaign in Pennsylvania, Michigan, or Wisconsin if he loses. Those are the three states where everything will be decided. And he has to do whatever it takes to win those three states. You could maybe throw Nevada & Arizona in there. But it’s really those old “Blue Wall” states that Biden needs to win. Especially as Biden has always presented himself as the “Workingman Politician” from his first days as Senator. If there is a disconnect between him and voters in those states then he is going to get curbstomped in the election. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 7:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/614 "2024-05-20T19:31:10Z")
> [@On another topic](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1001913/96): > > Are you saying the possibility of failure means it’s not worth trying? Not at all. I’m sure he’s trying. I just wouldn’t blame the Biden campaign if it didn’t work. ---
**Author:** ![Procrustus](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/procrustus/32/2994_2.png) [@Procrustus](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Procrustus)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/616 "2024-05-20T20:49:37Z")
> [@On another topic](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/1001913/97): > > And if he doesn’t even try…still no blame for him? Even though it means Trump wins? I am sure, absolutely sure, that Biden wants to win as much as I want him to win. I’m also sure he and his staff know more about elections than I do. I’ll give him the benefit of the doubt and say he’s doing all he can to win those battleground states. Maybe he’ll win them, maybe he won’t. But if he doesn’t, I won’t accuse him of not trying. (nor do I blame Clinton for losing those states). ---
**Author:** ![iiandyiiii](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/iiandyiiii/32/7924_2.png) [@iiandyiiii](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/iiandyiiii)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 8:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/617 "2024-05-20T20:49:38Z")
I see no reason to believe that Biden and his team aren’t doing the best they can with the information they have available. It may turn out not to be good enough, but so far you’ve presented nothing more than opinion that they’re making any particular mistakes. ---
**Author:** ![Velocity](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/velocity/32/18006_2.png) [@Velocity](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Velocity)\ **Post date:** [May 20, 2024, 8:53pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233/619 "2024-05-20T20:53:59Z")
The impression I get from this thread thus far is that if Biden does in fact lose this November, most Democrats are just going to throw their hands up and say, “Well, we did the best we could, and nothing could have averted this outcome.” [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233.md?page=25) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/whos-to-blame-if-biden-loses/1001233.md?page=27)