Why all those types of toothpaste?

[GSV_Consolation_of_Dreams]

@mecaenas

Riiight. Gladwell is wrong, and I’m wrong, and all the professional marketers I know are all wrong. Marketing is about tricks and deception because one guy on an internet message board says so.

Touched a nerve there, did I?

If popularity of opinion is indicative of its truth(iness) to you…

Gladwell is one guy, you are one guy, the professional marketers you know are hardly impartial in the matter so it looks like two against one at the moment. Want to do a poll to see which definition gets the most support here?

[mecaenas]

Touching or not touching is irrelevant. So now you’re better placed to “win” an argument by appealing to a SDMB popularity contest? Really?

My point was that there is a logical and coherent case to be made as to why marketing is a legitimate and successful practice that is not based on malice or fraud. You’re writing-off an entire profession that underpins modern capitalism on the basis of “marketers are liars because I said so”.

Are you putting forth the case that no one ever needs anything and marketers don’t care in the slightest what people want, and that marketers invent problems and desires then trick people into spending money? Because that’s what it sounds like.

[mecaenas]

@CookingWithGas

I have known and worked with professional marketers too, and I have been a consumer for decades. I have not taken marketing classes and I do not know Gladwell’s work. That said, it is evident even to the casual observer that marketing has more than one face. Part of marketing is to discover the preferences and needs of the market and exploit those needs. (I do not say “serve” because, with rare exception, companies’ missions are to make money, not altruism.) Multiple varieties of a base product are a combination of meeting needs, and stimulating need. But it’s simply disingenuous to deny that marketing uses gimmicks and misdirection.

The objective of marketing is to take advantage of consumer behavior to be able to sell product. Sometimes that means meeting needs, sometimes it means creating needs, sometimes it means pretending that a product will meet needs that it does not.

People by nature notice when things change. They tend to fatigue from sameness, and desire something different; car styling is the classic example. Marketers understand this and the oldest cliche in the book is “New and improved!” That meets a need only in the sense that the marketers use what they know about human behavior to retain the consumer’s attention.

Remember FDS? Women were suddenly being told in advertisements that they needed genital deodorant. These ads caused at least some women to suddenly become aware of a problem that they didn’t realize they had (and didn’t in fact have) but figured they’d better do something about.

The recent ads for young mens’ products like a body spray whose name escapes me show women wildly attracted to men who use the product. Now I will allow that young men perhaps have a need for women to be wildly attracted to them, but marketing a spray that way doesn’t seriously “meet a need.”

Danika Patrick is hot but what in the world does that have to do with domain names at GoDaddy? Puh-lease don’t try to tell me this is meeting a need. It’s a gimmick to get attention. Countless products are advertised by associating it with desirable sexual scenarios, either subtly or blatantly. Weight loss, cosmetics, fitness, pharmaceuticals. You name it, they market it with sex. But none of these products actually get you more sex.

Don’t like the word “serve”? Fine, “exploit” is fine with me.

I’m talking about good marketing from the perspective of identifying market needs/wants and then customising the company’s product to meet/exploit that need or want. Sometimes it’s flavour, sometimes it’s quality, sometimes it’s image or status. This is what good marketing is about, you identify ways to fulfill demand to… SHOCK HORROR! Make money!

I’m not an American, so pretty much all of your examples are meaningless to me. But from what I gather there’s a whole stack of “gimmick” advertising going on, but just because this happens it doesn’t mean that all marketing is therefore bad and unethical and trickery. Ads are a tool and the end result, not the starting point. You’re confusing good, sound marketing with dodgy ad gimmicks and tarring everyone with the same brush.

Marketing =/= Advertising

[dtilque]

Just want to emphasize (RealityChuck mentioned it briefly) that the sensitive-teeth toothpaste is not a product of marketing excess. It fills a real need.

If you have receding gums, at a certain point the gums recede past the edge of the enamel and expose micropores in the teeth. The micropores expose the nerves in the tooth directly to environmental factors (heat, cold) which cause the teeth to hurt. Sensitive-teeth toothpaste contains potassium nitrate which somehow blocks this pain.

I’m not sure of the mechanism. I suspect that the potassium nitrate crystals form in the micropores which plug them up, thus insulating the nerves. However, it may be that it deadens the nerves or has some other mechanism.

[GSV_Consolation_of_Dreams]

@mecaenas

Touching or not touching is irrelevant. So now you’re better placed to “win” an argument by appealing to a SDMB popularity contest? Really?

Dude, you’re the one who dismissed an opinion because “one guy on an internet message board says so”. Presumably popularity contests are OK with you.
If you attack an opinion based on its rarity, I am perfectly entitled to defend that opinion by demonstrating the opposite.

@mecaenas

My point was that there is a logical and coherent case to be made as to why marketing is a legitimate and successful practice that is not based on malice or fraud. You’re writing-off an entire profession that underpins modern capitalism on the basis of “marketers are liars because I said so”.

If you can find those words you have put in my mouth somewhere other than in your own imagination, I’d like to see it. Don’t quote me with stuff I never said. And I am dubious that marketing “underpins modern capitalism” to any greater extent than any other department.

@mecaenas

Are you putting forth the case that no one ever needs anything and marketers don’t care in the slightest what people want, and that marketers invent problems and desires then trick people into spending money? Because that’s what it sounds like.

No, I’m not putting forth that case.

[Shot_From_Guns]

@GSV_Consolation_of_Dreams

Dude, you’re the one who dismissed an opinion because “one guy on an internet message board says so”. Presumably popularity contests are OK with you.

To be fair, I think was more of an appeal to authority than a popularity contest: the point I took away was that **mecaenas **was saying you’re some random, anonymous person who was presenting an unsourced opionion as fact.

[GSV_Consolation_of_Dreams]

Yes, maybe I should have been more clear that it was just my opinion. Still from my point of view Gladwell (Is this Malcolm Gladwell we are talking about?, could be Todd Gladwell, mecaenas’ dog groomer for all we know) is just one more guy on the Internet as well.

Granted he’s a well known author, but nothing I saw on his Wikipedia biography tells me why I should take his opinion of marketing/advertising particularly seriously.

[Mijin]

@Dog80

I was shopping for toothpaste and there were a billion different types:

-Plain
-Extra fluoride
-Whitening
-Fresh breath
-Anti-decay
-24 hour protection
-Sensitive teeth
…and several others I don’t remember now.

Must. Continue. List.
Without using google…

-Smoker’s / Tartar
-Enamel care (may be same as anti-decay, I’m thinking of the ones that imply they help rebuild enamel rather than prevent decay)
-“Combined”
-Children’s – low fluoride and/or “milk teeth”
-Baking soda (marketed as getting teeth extra clean)

…I’m sure we’ll have those billion types all named soon