# Why America's Prep Schools Aren't Following Arne Duncan's Public School Education Reforms **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [February 3, 2013, 6:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-americas-prep-schools-arent-following-arne-duncans-public-school-education-reforms/649242 "2013-02-03T18:37:23Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 3\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2013, 9:56pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-americas-prep-schools-arent-following-arne-duncans-public-school-education-reforms/649242/41 "2013-02-05T21:56:09Z")
> [@Strassia](#): > > I would be willing to bet that if you took the lottery losers and put them in a public school without any discipline or crime issues, where everyone had to apply to get in, the could be removed easily at any time for failing to meet either behavior or academic standards, and all of whose parents are heavily involved and committed to the success of their student and the school as a whole you would see their test scores rise as well. Do you have any research that backs up that statement? If not, why do you believe it? ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [February 5, 2013, 11:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-americas-prep-schools-arent-following-arne-duncans-public-school-education-reforms/649242/42 "2013-02-05T23:25:23Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > > This argument is unconvincing on several counts. First, vouchers tend to cost little compared to public schools. The first link in my previous post has the cost of a voucher in D.C. at $8,000 per year for grades K-8 and $12,000 per year for grades 9-12, in comparison to over $20,000 per year for public school students. The figure for public school sources seems to be wrong. According to [Census data here](http://www2.census.gov/govs/school/10f33pub.pdf) (page 31) D.C. has enrollment of 43,866 and education expenditures of $1,195,934,000, for a per-pupil cost of $27,263 per year. That smells like BS to me. The fact that nobody else cites these numbers except the CATO guy using census data that is not broken down by the actual money spent is highly suspicious to me. > [@ITR\_champion](#): > > If a poor kid at one of D.C.'s awful public schools takes his $8,000 voucher and heads to a private school to get a good education, the public school system is left with _more_ money per pupil, not less. Not really. Most educational expenditures are relatively fixed costs. You don’t save much money teaching a class with 32 kids as opposed to 29. ---
**Author:** ![alphaboi867](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alphaboi867/32/3898_2.png) [@alphaboi867](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/alphaboi867)\ **Post date:** [February 6, 2013, 2:39am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-americas-prep-schools-arent-following-arne-duncans-public-school-education-reforms/649242/43 "2013-02-06T02:39:25Z")
> [@Strassia](#): > > Great idea. Except it only works if the vouchers fully cover the cost of the school. Most voucher systems I have seen only subsidize those families that would have gone to private school anyway… Agreed. If a private school wants to accept vouchers then they can’t charge parents a penny more that student _and_ have to provide the exact same experiance they give to students who’s families are paying full tuition. > [@ralph124c](#): > > The biggest advantage that private schools have? They can expel disruptive students. The public schools have to take everyone, and put up with acting out, and near-criminal behavior. One disruptive child can bring a classroom to a halt. What do you do with a 16 year old who has been suspended 25 times in a semester? Private schools that accept vouchers shouldn’t be allowed any more ability to expel students than their public counterparts, nor should be allowed to use any selection procedures denied to public schools. If the local public school has to accept every child who lives in the area then so does the local private school. Including special education kids and chronic displinary problems. Also any standardized tests public school kids take private school kids should also have to take. For good measure they wouldn’t be allowed to require voucher kids to take religious education classes against their will or force participation or attendence at any prayer or religious ceremony. Naturally they’d have to have the same (or more expansive) anti-discrimation policies as public schools (for both students & staff), regardless if said policies would violate the “ethos” of the school. Any private school unwilling to do this can simply forgo taxpayer money. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-americas-prep-schools-arent-following-arne-duncans-public-school-education-reforms/649242.md?page=2)