# Why are American houses built so cheaply/poorly? **URL:** \ **Category:** In My Humble Opinion\ **Created:** [July 3, 2019, 5:51pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460 "2019-07-03T17:51:01Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 2
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2019, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/21 "2019-07-03T19:47:58Z")
> [@Treppenwitz](#): > > Well, in the UK if you buy a new build you would expect at least an outer layer of brick. > j Here in my corner of the US, you can reasonably expect a brick outer wall, a vapor barrier, some insulating sheathing (polyiso), some kind of wood-ish sheathing- OSB or plywood, and then the house framing, with more insulation between the studs. Then usually the inner layer of drywall. I guess another way to look at it is to ask whether anyone needs a house made the traditional masonry way enough to warrant the extra price? There are plenty of 50-75 year old wood framed/brick veneer homes out there doing just fine. Another reason for that style of construction is that it’s likely MUCH easier to modify the house- expand rooms, move walls, add-on, etc… if all you’re dealing with is wood framing and drywall. ---
**Author:** ![Marcus\_Flavius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a4c791/32.png) [@Marcus\_Flavius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marcus_Flavius)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2019, 8:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/22 "2019-07-03T20:26:43Z")
> [@bump](#): > > Here in my corner of the US, you can reasonably expect a brick outer wall, a vapor barrier, some insulating sheathing (polyiso), some kind of wood-ish sheathing- OSB or plywood, and then the house framing, with more insulation between the studs. Then usually the inner layer of drywall. > > I guess another way to look at it is to ask whether anyone needs a house made the traditional masonry way enough to warrant the extra price? There are plenty of 50-75 year old wood framed/brick veneer homes out there doing just fine. > > **Another reason for that style of construction is that it’s likely MUCH easier to modify the house- expand rooms, move walls, add-on, etc… if all you’re dealing with is wood framing and drywall**. That’s true… but houses shouldn’t be viewed as a lego set that you can just change around whenever you want. ---
**Author:** ![ZipperJJ](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/zipperjj/32/211_2.png) [@ZipperJJ](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ZipperJJ)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2019, 8:31pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/23 "2019-07-03T20:31:19Z")
> [@Marcus\_Flavius](#): > > That’s true… but houses shouldn’t be viewed as a lego set that you can just change around whenever you want. Why? America is huge, and a lot of us have what Europeans would consider huge plots of land. I live in a suburb built in the 1960s and have JUST a half acre and could easily triple the size of my home without building upwards. Why would you not want to be able to buy a small cheap house, and as you establish yourself and have more money, be able to add on to the house to suit your new needs and desires? The Amish - a group that came out of Europe - do this regularly. They just build on to the house, just like Lego, as their families grow. ---
**Author:** ![Alessan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/alessan/32/465_2.png) [@Alessan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Alessan)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2019, 10:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/24 "2019-07-03T22:28:17Z")
> [@kenobi\_65](#): > > Most of the U.S. is under minimal threat to home damage from hurricanes – the threat is highest in Florida, the Gulf Coast, and the Atlantic coast along Georgia and the Carolinas, though Atlantic hurricanes can and do hit further north. (California and Hawaii do get occasional hurricanes, as well.) Similarly, most of the U.S. isn’t particularly susceptible to earthquakes (with a few exceptions, the earthquake-prone areas are along the Pacific coast). > . OTOH, most of the western United States is \*very \*susceptible to fire, and yet people still insist on building their houses out of flammable materials. ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2019, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/25 "2019-07-03T23:00:36Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I’m curious, how do they construct new middle-class homes in other countries? A coworker from India said that she was surprised when she first came to this country to find that most of our houses are made of wood. Over there apparently the preferred building materials are concrete or masonry. ---
**Author:** ![rbroome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/838e76/32.png) [@rbroome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rbroome)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2019, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/26 "2019-07-03T23:04:02Z")
> [@Treppenwitz](#): > > This may be a reasonable point; but you could turn it around and say, if I had to pick a home to ride out a hurricane in… > > Which leads me to a couple of questions. Is the Typical American Home as vulnerable to extreme weather as I imagine it to be? Are more people in the US at risk from earthquakes or hurricanes? And do building practices vary depending on the perceived risk of either (ie, by location)? > > As an aside, I once went out for a bike ride of 30 miles or so with my friend D in rural NJ - not much of an earthquake or hurricane risk in those parts. A house that was standing on the way out had been completely demolished (deliberately) on the way back. Razed to the ground, as in _WTF - where did that go_?? Not a good advert for housebuilding standards if you can do that, IMHO. In the UK I complain that modern British building practices are crap, but… > > j For hurricanes and similar extreme weather, I pick A. I can’t imagine the widespread damage a slate roof would cause in a hurricane strong enough to peel off the tiles. And of course it will take a strong wind to peel off tiles but it takes a strong wind to peel off shingles. I don’t know much about brick outer and inner walled homes, I have never seen them. How do they handle flooding or rain? Can they breath well enough to avoid mold in semi-tropical climates? If you plan to build say 2500 homes (there is a subdivision going in near me of that size), can your local labor market provide enough masons to do all that brick work in a reasonable time and at a reasonable cost? As for tile roofs, don’t they leak? I seem to remember stories about tile and or slate roofs leaking regularly in high winds and or freezing conditions. But I may not have heard correctly. Outside temperate climates, how do such roofs do in general? ---
**Author:** ![rbroome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/838e76/32.png) [@rbroome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rbroome)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2019, 11:06pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/27 "2019-07-03T23:06:25Z")
> [@Marcus\_Flavius](#): > > That’s true… but houses shouldn’t be viewed as a lego set that you can just change around whenever you want. why not? surely the ability to adapt to changing requirements is a plus? ---
**Author:** ![rbroome](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/838e76/32.png) [@rbroome](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/rbroome)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2019, 11:11pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/28 "2019-07-03T23:11:02Z")
> [@WildaBeast](#): > > A coworker from India said that she was surprised when she first came to this country to find that most of our houses are made of wood. Over there apparently the preferred building materials are concrete or masonry. I also wonder whether such traditions are set more by the availability of raw materials than some objective requirements. In countries with large tracts of forested land and well-developed infrastructure to harvest, process and ship wood products, wood is a versatile and cheap building material. Look at Scandinavia, while their standards are high, they still use wood in home construction. ---
**Author:** ![WildaBeast](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wildabeast/32/6_2.png) [@WildaBeast](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/WildaBeast)\ **Post date:** [July 3, 2019, 11:16pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/29 "2019-07-03T23:16:43Z")
> [@Kimstu](#): > > The American garage frequently **is** the “most important room in the house”, or at least the driveway leading up to it is. Which is to say that American society is super-dependent on the private automobile, so yeah, the garage is going to be featured very prominently in most modern houses. Though I agree it’s usually not the greatest look aesthetically. There’s no reason the garage absolutely has to be on the front of the house, though. I’ve seen some houses dating from the 1950s to the 1970s that put the garage door or carport on the side or even the back of the house. That left the front of the house with a more attractive wall with windows and shutters and all that. I think the reason this isn’t done more often is because then there has to be room for the driveway to go past the house and then turn 90 or 180 degrees into the garage. Most developers nowadays squeeze houses so close together there simply isn’t room for that. ---
**Author:** ![Melbourne](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/b5e925/32.png) [@Melbourne](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Melbourne)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2019, 12:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/30 "2019-07-04T00:33:00Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > I’m curious, how do they construct new middle-class homes in other countries? Aus is a country sort of like the USA, in that we actually do constuct houses. But we also have a lot of recent Chinese immigrants, so we construct tower appartments as well. A typical house around here is single-level, wood-frame, floating-slab, brick-veneer. By American or Euoropean standards, it’s a tent that keeps the rain out, but doesn’t keep the weather out. It will last 50-100 years if the termites don’t get it first. At the end of life, it will have sagged a bit. I won’t have to replace the roof, but I will have to repair it: the concrete tiles can be damaged by hail, or by people walking on them, or shifted by wind. In that lifetime all of the electrical switches and built in light fittings will need replacing, as will all the bathroom fittings. all the locks and door handles, some of the doors, and probably the furnace. Internal walls will need patching. ---
**Author:** ![Tzigone](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/839c29/32.png) [@Tzigone](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tzigone)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2019, 1:09am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/31 "2019-07-04T01:09:50Z")
> [@](#): > > There’s no reason the garage absolutely has to be on the front of the house, though. There’s also no _objective_ reason it shouldn’t. It’s a matter of aesthetic preference, and little more. One thing about a garage on front is that it’s well-suited to narrow lots (not wide enough to have yard on side and sometimes with no alley or entry from back). ---
**Author:** ![thorny\_locust](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/thorny_locust/32/431_2.png) [@thorny\_locust](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/thorny_locust)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2019, 1:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/32 "2019-07-04T01:40:43Z")
> [@bump](#): > > There are plenty of 50-75 year old wood framed/brick veneer homes out there doing just fine. There are plenty of wood framed/wood sided houses considerably older than that which are doing just fine, also. Mine’s roughly 120, and there are quite a few older than that. [There are surviving log cabins from the 1600’s](https://www.logcabinhub.com/olds-cabins/). – admittedly, “old” in Europe and “old” in the USA are two different things. And it’s difficult to find the quality of wood now that was in use even 100 years ago; really good wood takes a long time to grow, and modern forestry doesn’t allow for it. (Those 2 x 4’s and 2 x 6’s and so on have shrunk, too; even since the days when those became standardized sizes. I’ve seen in the walls of moderately old houses, and they actually were 2" x 4" or whatever. New ones aren’t.) ---
**Author:** ![bump](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7c8e57/32.png) [@bump](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/bump)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2019, 2:05am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/33 "2019-07-04T02:05:10Z")
> [@Melbourne](#): > > Aus is a country sort of like the USA, in that we actually do constuct houses. But we also have a lot of recent Chinese immigrants, so we construct tower appartments as well. > > A typical house around here is single-level, wood-frame, floating-slab, brick-veneer. By American or Euoropean standards, it’s a tent that keeps the rain out, but doesn’t keep the weather out. It will last 50-100 years if the termites don’t get it first. At the end of life, it will have sagged a bit. I won’t have to replace the roof, but I will have to repair it: the concrete tiles can be damaged by hail, or by people walking on them, or shifted by wind. > > In that lifetime all of the electrical switches and built in light fittings will need replacing, as will all the bathroom fittings. all the locks and door handles, some of the doors, and probably the furnace. Internal walls will need patching. Sounds pretty much exactly like the ones around here, except that I have a pier-and-beam foundation, and mine’s decently insulated against heat and cold. Houses are like anything else- they require periodic maintenance, which sometimes means outright replacement of things such as roofs, floors, internal drywall, etc… For example, in my 1969-vintage house, we’re slowly replacing the wiring- the original is aluminum which is not great, but we can’t really afford to do it all at once. I’m not sure that dimensional lumber not actually being the labeled size matters or indicates much of anything. It’s just a shorthand- we could just as easily call it an AxB, and as long as everyone was aware, it wouldn’t much matter. ---
**Author:** ![elfkin477](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/e/a9a28c/32.png) [@elfkin477](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/elfkin477)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2019, 2:17am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/34 "2019-07-04T02:17:24Z")
> [@Treppenwitz](#): > > Well, in the UK if you buy a new build you would expect at least an outer layer of brick. Forty or fifty years ago, that came with an inner layer of brick too. It very rarely snows in the UK, right? That implies it’s a lot warmer than the northern tier of the US during the winter, where the daily highs often don’t reach freezing (0C) for weeks at a time. Brick houses aren’t popular here in the northeast because brick is a really poor insulator - brick has an R value of 0.2. _Straw bales_ are about R-1.5 [[cite](https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/R-value_(insulation))]… Which isn’t to say it’s impossible to find brick buildings in the upper New England area, there are some, mostly ancient. And horribly, awfully miserable in the winter. I used to work in a converted mill building and even with heat blasting it was freezing anywhere more than a few feet from the heat vents five months of the year. ---
**Author:** ![Musicat](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/musicat/32/20189_2.png) [@Musicat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Musicat)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2019, 2:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/35 "2019-07-04T02:25:26Z")
We don’t build houses to last 100 years because after 50, they will be torn down and rebuilt with more modern materials. Sometimes retrofitting sucks. ---
**Author:** ![Der\_Trihs](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/der_trihs/32/233_2.png) [@Der\_Trihs](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Der_Trihs)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2019, 2:52am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/36 "2019-07-04T02:52:58Z")
> [@carrps](#): > > You don’t want to live in an unreinforced masonry (or brick) house in earthquake country (where I am). And it’s expensive to reinforce them. You want something with more “give.” This. Wood and metal flexes; brick and stone shatters. Their own weight just means they break more easily in a quake. Related: > [@Treppenwitz](#): > > Well, in the UK if you buy a new build you would expect at least an outer layer of brick. Here in California, that’s a deadly hazard since in an earthquake that brick facing will peel off and land on anyone who happens to be walking by when it hits. ---
**Author:** ![Tee](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/73ab20/32.png) [@Tee](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Tee)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2019, 3:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/37 "2019-07-04T03:06:05Z")
My recent purchase is a fixer-upper, circa 1900 but solid. There are hand hewn 8x8 support beams in a fieldstone basement. A lot of the original flooring is 2x15 planks (!), there is built-in cabinetry, etc. Saying it’s made of wood is kind of an understatement; it’s a monstrosity of lumber and I love it. Not all of the bedrooms have closets. None of the cabinetry can accommodate a large dinner plate. The ductwork is huge and sprawling, the furnace was old when Carter was President. These and many other things have to be addressed, systematically, but it’s not because the things themselves weren’t built well. ---
**Author:** ![jasg](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/j/f0a364/32.png) [@jasg](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jasg)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2019, 3:10am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/38 "2019-07-04T03:10:21Z")
When I was living and working in Germany, I was amazed by home construction quality. I helped a colleague install a TV antenna in his attic (early 80’s home) and was surprised to find a poured concrete floor in the attic. Beams, posts and rafters supporting the red tile roof were 8"x8" or 4"x10" equivalents. Interior walls were a foot thick and made of concrete blocks. Exterior stuccoed walls were even thicker. Houses seemed to be built for generations. An American who also worked there was building a new house in Maryland. He brought pictures of his new home as it was being framed. When he showed them off, a coworker said “I see the shipping crate but where is the house?” ---
**Author:** ![pabstist](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/p/e99b99/32.png) [@pabstist](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/pabstist)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2019, 5:40am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/39 "2019-07-04T05:40:28Z")
I live in Vermont, and our farmhouse is circa 1825. In the dirt basement you can see the tree trunks cut in half that support the first floor, they are about 12-18 inches wide, and still have the 200 year old bark on them. The roof is metal, I don’t think original but still over a hundred years old. It’s not standing seam, but 1/4" thick sheets that are about 4 feet wide and 8 feet tall with a cool scalloped design pressed in. I have to scrape some rust off and put on a coat of paint this year, for the first time in 15 years. Lathe and plaster walls that destroy any attempt to put in a nail or screw, the sound insulation is super good. No plywood for the exterior, just inch thick wide planks over the framing, covered by clapboard. Most of the really big windows even still have the original wavy glass, and there’s so many windows. I’m pretty sure that my old house could survive a tornado or earthquake if it was magically transplanted to another part of the country. Actually it has survived small earthquakes and 70 MPH winds, just since I’ve been here. And not to mention the massive weight of snow and ice on the roofs every winter. Anyways I think that in the ‘old days’ they built shit to last, to pass down through the family for generations. Today, it’s build a shit box as cheap as possible. Nobody stays in the same house for a long time, so screw it, let the new owner fix it. I think the average lifespan of any part of a new house is 15-25 years, and then it needs to be replaced, not restored. Kind of sad, actually. ---
**Author:** ![Marcus\_Flavius](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/a4c791/32.png) [@Marcus\_Flavius](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Marcus_Flavius)\ **Post date:** [July 4, 2019, 6:33am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460/40 "2019-07-04T06:33:33Z")
> [@Tee](#): > > My recent purchase is a fixer-upper, circa 1900 but solid. There are hand hewn 8x8 support beams in a fieldstone basement. A lot of the original flooring is 2x15 planks (!), there is built-in cabinetry, etc. Saying it’s made of wood is kind of an understatement; it’s a monstrosity of lumber and I love it. > > Not all of the bedrooms have closets. None of the cabinetry can accommodate a large dinner plate. The ductwork is huge and sprawling, the furnace was old when Carter was President. These and many other things have to be addressed, systematically, but it’s not because the things themselves weren’t built well. When I finally purchase my own home, I don’t want anything built past 1953 or so. Old homes have their issues, but generally speaking, the workmanship, craftsmanship, and quality of materials is far superior to what you’ll find in a ‘modem’ home. Though I prefer concrete and masonry, I’m not anti wood. A solidly constructed wood house with quality materials will last a very long time it taken care of [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460.md?page=1) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-american-houses-built-so-cheaply-poorly/836460.md?page=3)