# Why are Americans...what's the technical term...dumb as shit? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [December 11, 2012, 10:10pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756 "2012-12-11T22:10:34Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 17\ **Page:** 5
**Author:** ![Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/slow_moving_vehicle/32/291_2.png) [@Slow\_Moving\_Vehicle](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Slow_Moving_Vehicle)\ **Post date:** [December 13, 2012, 10:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/81 "2012-12-13T22:49:40Z")
> [@Wesley\_Clark](#): > > We do lag in some serious issues, usually regarding the social safety net (family/medical leave, universal health care) and investments in the people (affordable education, working public transit, taking climate change seriously, etc). Why we do that, I don’t know. I’d guess religion. For whatever reason we are way more religious than other OECD nations. I understand the point you are trying to make here, about the religious anti-intellectualism - you’re no doubt thinking about creationism and “intelligent design” and possibly personhood amendments that seek to legislate conception as the legal beginning of life - but blaming “religion” paints with waaay too broad a brush. We have a huge variety of religious communities in this country - after Tokyo, the biggest Buddhist city in the world is Los Angeles, and the U.S. has more Sikhs than Espicopalians and more Muslims than Jews - and most of them do not have a tradition of anti-intellectualism. The biggest Christian community in the U.S. is the Roman Catholic Church, which acknowledges both natural selection and the Big Bang as valid scientific theories. I think as well that the U.S. has more Jews than any nation other than Israel, and they almost venerate scholarship. The “intelligent design” folks are one small segment of the American religious population. ---
**Author:** ![Leaffan](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/leaffan/32/299_2.png) [@Leaffan](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Leaffan)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2012, 1:32am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/82 "2012-12-14T01:32:06Z")
> [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > Good old Canada. Looking through a pick-list in a program I use we discovered just today that there was a listing for ‘Numavut Providence’. > > I mean I can understand somebody not knowing about Nunavut (who does??). But Providence? Really? Oh, I once received driving instructions to our US office in a previous job that told me exactly how to get to the providence boarder, and where to turn at the providence signs, etc. Poor misinformed engineer that she was. ---
**Author:** ![Cat\_Whisperer](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cat_whisperer/32/4839_2.png) [@Cat\_Whisperer](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cat_Whisperer)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2012, 1:49am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/83 "2012-12-14T01:49:03Z")
> [@Leaffan](#): > > \ > > To which my response is, “Who is the President of Mexico?” And of course no one knows the fucking answer.\ Hugo Chavez? Dammit! President of Venezuela! I was so close! (It’s Enrique Peña Nieto, if anyone is interested.) > [@Sicks\_Ate](#): > > Good old Canada. Looking through a pick-list in a program I use we discovered just today that there was a listing for ‘Numavut Providence’. > > I mean I can understand somebody not knowing about Nunavut (who does??). But Providence? Really? I had heard of that on these boards before (and had a bit of doubt about it, since my reaction was like yours - “Providence instead of province? Really?”), but we had someone actually say it to our face a couple of years ago on vacation - hoo boy. Also - oh dear God, I did a Google search on Canadian providences. :smack: ---
**Author:** ![Cheshire\_Human](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/5f8ce5/32.png) [@Cheshire\_Human](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheshire_Human)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2012, 1:51am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/84 "2012-12-14T01:51:40Z")
> [@Ravenman](#): > > Anyways, if one doubts the intelligence of the average American, consider that the typical Yankee is about 20 to 40 points lower on the IQ scale than 90% of the self-reporting members of this message board. And you actually _believe_ this site’s self report? Umm this website is _not_ evidence for _that_. This site is my cite. ---
**Author:** ![Bryan\_Ekers](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bryan_ekers/32/183_2.png) [@Bryan\_Ekers](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bryan_Ekers)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2012, 3:46am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/85 "2012-12-14T03:46:09Z")
> [@Cat\_Whisperer](#): > > Also - oh dear God, I did a Google search on Canadian providences. :smack: Well, I admit we’re better off than most… ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2012, 4:13am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/86 "2012-12-14T04:13:24Z")
> [@Cheshire\_Human](#): > > And you actually _believe_ this site’s self report? Umm this website is _not_ evidence for _that_. This site is my cite. Hell no. Look, do you know how dumb a IQ of 100 is? That is “never reads a actual book” “has to sound out a comic”, etc. There are some closed minded dudes here, and a lot of dudes with really off the wall ideas- but overall, I’d say the average IQ here is well over average. I present as evidence the thread where it was asked what % of posters here had read the Games of Thrones series. > **[Game of Throne Viewers: How Many of the Books Have You Read?](https://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=647157)** > > At DrDeth’s request, a poll. One poster contents that 90% of Game of Thrones viewers are not book readers, and another figures the non-reader figure is less than 50%. Let’s see, shall we? How many of the Songs of Fire and Ice books have you read? ... **80** fucking **%** had read at least one, most had read all of them. ---
**Author:** ![Namkcalb](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/n/c89c15/32.png) [@Namkcalb](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Namkcalb)\ **Post date:** [December 14, 2012, 5:25am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/87 "2012-12-14T05:25:47Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Hell no. Look, do you know how dumb a IQ of 100 is? That is “never reads a actual book” “has to sound out a comic”, etc. I think you are underestimate average IQ people, an IQ of 100 is more than enough to get an undergraduate degree if they put in the effort. I doubt there are many STEM PhD-holders from good universities with IQs lower than 120 though ---
**Author:** ![GiantRat](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/g/e47c2d/32.png) [@GiantRat](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/GiantRat)\ **Post date:** [December 24, 2012, 3:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/88 "2012-12-24T03:22:39Z")
> [@Simplicio](#): > > Turkey has a GDP per capita that’s a fifth of the US. Indonesia’s is like a fifteenth. I don’t think there’s any great mystery regarding why poor, populous countries fill out the bottom of the list. So maybe Americans aren’t “dumb as shit” because they’ve figured out how to generate revenue… seemed to win the Cold War, WWII, and pull off the Marshall Plan. ---
**Author:** ![handsomeharry](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/e9c0ed/32.png) [@handsomeharry](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/handsomeharry)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2012, 7:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/89 "2012-12-28T19:39:05Z")
> [@msmith537](#): > > Studies consistently show America lags behind most of the developed world in math, reading and the sciences. That means we are only ahead of countries that haven’t enough resources to actually build schools. > > A casual look at American television provides a wide range of reality shows about nouveau-riche morons, drunken idiots and competitions between attractive egomaniacs scrambling for cash. > > The Internet (present company excluded) has enabled millions of Americans to call each other f@g! and 100ser over topics they don’t understand > > Anyone who went to school in the US knows the respect those who demonstrate higher intellect receive. > > We have the best colleges in the world but most students use them to throw a 4 year drunken frat party. > The meme of Americans being loud, anti-intellectual, lazy and stupid has been around for a long time, but now it seems that quantifyable data is starting to validate it. How did a country that half a century ago put a man on Mars and defeated the Germans after they bombed Pearl Harbor become a country where the greatest minds figure out new ways to stuff tacos into pizzas? Because, the Germans are now our friends. And, our German scientists are better than the Russian’s German scientists. ---
**Author:** ![Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/e8c25b/32.png) [@Really\_Not\_All\_That\_Bright](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Really_Not_All_That_Bright)\ **Post date:** [December 28, 2012, 7:52pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/90 "2012-12-28T19:52:52Z")
> [@DrDeth](#): > > Hell no. Look, do you know how dumb a IQ of 100 is? That is “never reads a actual book” “has to sound out a comic”, etc. > > There are some closed minded dudes here, and a lot of dudes with really off the wall ideas- but overall, I’d say the average IQ here is well over average. > > I present as evidence the thread where it was asked what % of posters here had read the Games of Thrones series. > > [Game of Throne Viewers: How Many of the Books Have You Read? - Cafe Society - Straight Dope Message Board](http://boards.straightdope.com/sdmb/showthread.php?t=647157) > > **80** fucking **%** had read at least one, most had read all of them. Dude, Cafe Society is even less representative of the board than the board is of reality. [QUOTE=Cheshire Human] And you actually believe this site’s self report? Umm this website is not evidence for that. This site is my cite. [/QUOTE] You are completely missing his point. It doesn’t matter whether this site’s self report is true or not. ---
**Author:** ![wildorchid](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/w/82dd89/32.png) [@wildorchid](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wildorchid)\ **Post date:** [December 31, 2012, 10:14pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/91 "2012-12-31T22:14:12Z")
Its the public school system duh ---
**Author:** ![BigAppleBucky](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/bigapplebucky/32/178_2.png) [@BigAppleBucky](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BigAppleBucky)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2013, 2:24am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/92 "2013-01-01T02:24:16Z")
> **[Amazon.com: Rethinking America: 9780517193549: Smith, Hedrick: Books](https://www.amazon.com/Rethinking-America-Hedrick-Smith/dp/051719354X)** > > Amazon.com: Rethinking America: 9780517193549: Smith, Hedrick: Books I recommend Hedrick Smith’s Rethinking America (link) to anyone interested in the subject matter of this thread. Annual hours of education are not the main topic of the book, but they are certainly mentioned. There is no doubt America can and should do a better job of educating its children. The educational black holes of Texas and other creationist states are a handicap the rest of the country will have to try to make up for. ---
**Author:** ![ralph124c](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/8797f3/32.png) [@ralph124c](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ralph124c)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2013, 4:12pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/93 "2013-01-01T16:12:23Z")
There is a difference between intelligence and intellectual curiosity. In my years of teaching, I would say that most of the kids I taught were quite intelligent. However, many lacked curiosity about the world-they were quite happy to remain ignorant of geography, world affairs, different cultures, etc. If video games and football are your thing (and not art and literature), who am I to criticize? I don’t go crazy over modern art. ---
**Author:** ![Beware\_of\_Doug](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/278dde/32.png) [@Beware\_of\_Doug](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Beware_of_Doug)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2013, 4:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/94 "2013-01-01T16:49:37Z")
There’s curiosity, but it’s often a narrow, disciplined sort of curiosity. My neighbor is a French major on her way to an ESL degree, and she is a bright and outgoing person, but she is totally “in the box” - no interest in much of anything but languages, teaching, and her language-teaching friends. All of her personality is her work - she’s totally tracked. Her kind of people are about the best we can do as a culture. Anyone really interesting or diverse tends to be a mistake. ---
**Author:** ![Lust4Life](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/l/ecc23a/32.png) [@Lust4Life](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Lust4Life)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2013, 7:26pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/95 "2013-01-01T19:26:18Z")
I think that maybe the op s point is something that is not specific to the U.S. but is a general trend throughout the Western nations. Over here in the U.K. there seems to be a definite dumbing down of tv, educational standards are being eroded by exams being made easier, calls for less capable students to be admitted to the top universities because of their poorer economic background, people who are inadequate, either educationally or behaviourlly are excused on the grounds of made up “disorders” (Which haven’t actually been proven to exist scientifically, and that includes dyslexia), so its “not their fault”. We are developing a culture of mediocrity, where the masses intimidate the exceptional with accusations of elitism, or of having preferential backgrounds (even when this is usually not the case), but turn a blind eye when its useful to their own welfare. Children are told that they are in all but years, virtually the equal of adults in wisdom and maturity, that everyone if they are poor in one discipline, are certainly made up for in another. Yes he can’t spell very well, but he’s excellent in intersocial action (playing with other children in the playground) Children aren’t children anymore, they’re “young people”, to call them children is an insult. After all they’re just as knowledable as grown ups . And if they don’t know something then they can always Google it. If anything the dumbing down of education is worse over here then it is in the U.S. . But I understand his feelings. ---
**Author:** ![Ulfreida](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/ulfreida/32/8014_2.png) [@Ulfreida](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Ulfreida)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2013, 7:48pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/96 "2013-01-01T19:48:10Z")
Wait, you can stuff a taco into a pizza? ---
**Author:** ![cmyk](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cmyk/32/3353_2.png) [@cmyk](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/cmyk)\ **Post date:** [January 1, 2013, 8:40pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756/97 "2013-01-01T20:40:08Z")
Only the dumb Americans are dumb. I mean, c’mon… How dumb can you be? [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-americans-whats-the-technical-term-dumb-as-shit/643756.md?page=4)