There’s no evidence to support your position. There’s plenty of evidence to support mine - polls showed that the public blamed Republicans far more than Democrats, there’s no polling data that showed this was reversing, and Democrats won big in elections most relevant to the shutdown, like Virginia.
At what point do you think the GOP would have given in? If you were in Schumer’s shoes, how long do you hold out? Another month? A year?
I don’t know, but that’s the GOP’s problem. The White House isn’t even following budget laws, and Congress refuses to hold them to account. Democrats aren’t obligated to support budget laws that are not being enforced.
The GOP has every branch of government, including SCOTUS. Democrats aren’t obligated to help them destroy the American system of government.
But the thing is, all stop on domestic air travel would have massively hurt all Americans, not just Republicans.
Of course, and that sucks. But who would they blame? The evidence so far indicates pretty strongly they’d blame Trump and the Republicans, who would have the power to end the shutdown without any help at all from the Democrats.
And as much pain as this might cause, it’s nothing compared to long-term fascism and tyranny. That’s not necessarily the immediate tradeoff, but short-term economic pain is nothing compared to fighting that threat. Everything should be and is about the fight against the slide into fascism and tyranny. Every decision politicians made should be seen in this light.
I can’t get into that apocalyptic thinking. I just vote for Democrats and hope for the best. I feel pretty good about our chances in 2026.
But I do need a functional air travel system.
I need a long-term, functioning democratic American system for my son.
If that’s your line the democrats were never there. Fascism and halthcare subsidies can happen at the same time. And doing this weird endaround with a bipartisan budget and then a party line vote to rescind part of it isn’t fascism either.
I think the dems screwed this one up but the stakes of this particular decision are not at that level. Its really all about economic pain over a relatively short term and having this weird endaround to the filibuster versus just being honest and doing away with it.
We’ll see. It’s not over yet, and we’ll have shutdown fights in the future. But I think Democrats significantly strengthened Trump’s hands for future fights that will have even bigger stakes.
“Since Republicans were trying to cancel Thanksgiving, we obviously had to vote with them. To stop them, of course. I mean, not all of us. Just some of us. Barely any of us. You can see why we had to give them what they wanted, which was canceling Thanksgiving, so thanks to 8 of us, Thanksgiving is saved!”
“Let me just point out, if I might, that we are 29 days into a Democrat shutdown, and the senator from New Mexico was absolutely right: SNAP recipients shouldn’t go without food. People should be getting paid in this country. And we’ve tried to do that 13 times. You voted no 13 times. This isn’t a political game. These are real people’s lives that we’re talking about. And you all just figured out 29 days in that, ‘Oh, there might be some consequences. There are people who’ll run out of money?’ Yeah, we’re 29 days in, and they’ve done their best to make sure that a lot of these programs are funded, but at some point the government runs out of money. 13 times people over here [right wing] voted to fund SNAP. 13 times they voted to fund WIC! My aching back, you finally realize this thing has consequences.” - John Thune, two weeks ago.
So will I. The coward Kaine never should have let Democratic leadership push him into the position of hurting his own constituency on a foolhardy, doomed attempt to use that pain to convince Republicans, of all people, to capitulate and say “Stop hurting everyday Americans! We’ll give you what you want.” Because that sentence is the only one that justifies the “leverage” narrative we’ve heard from Democratic Senators and pundits like Robert Reich.
What do you mean winning? They won. The election happened, Democrats won, so it was time to head to the locker rooms, pack up the uniform, and get on the bus home. It’s almost as if….almost like…healthcare wasn’t actually the issue all along
It’s nice to see a lot of posters coming around. This was obvious to everyone from the start, and the fact that they didn’t do that calculus shows what this shutdown was actually about
Don’t read into it. 36 hours is a common practice to reconvene and hold a vote. Remember that the Senate hasn’t actually passed the CR yet. They only voted for cloture. There’s nothing yet for the House to vote on.
I will give the Democrats credit for this: every time the Republicans bluster about letting the government shut down to make some political point, the Democrats always counter by claiming it would be terrible for America to let that happen and the Senators that support shutdown are horrible people.
Good job Democrats for proving your claim.
Bullshit. The leverage was (or should have been) about things Republicans actually care about - their own reelection prospects, and economic pain for corporations and the wealthy. If they’d stuck to their guns, they could have seen that bear fruit. Now they get nothing and just look weak.
It was also obvious to me from the start. I think the filibuster is bad and as long as it’s treated with the level of sanctity it gets in the senate it will reward brinksmanship. So I still support doing that brinksmanship until either the majority stops asking permission for basic government functions or when the party whose policies I agree with the most takes full advantage of it to get as much as they can.
The thing I don’t support is trying the brinksmanship when you don’t have the stomach to go through with it.
No , Schumer did not cave, and the Dems do not have iron clad control over their Senators. And really there was no use keeping up the filibuster, once they learned a large faction of the MAGAs wanted the government to shut down.
Again wrong.
Those semi-mythical files have been cleaned up and edited. Trump knows this and doesnt care anymore.
How were the people to get food if the dems caved early?
The Brits had no access, so those semi-mythical magical files werent consulted.
You are correct, he was wrong on this.
Correct.
Never. Too many MAGAs wanted the government shut down. So the Dems made their point, and then stopped.
Re last post, I do not know what Johnson will allow to the floor, but suspect it will be called TrumpCare.
Not by the Republicans it won’t. It’s not over-the-top, stupidly ostentatious enough. Remember the “Golden Dome” defense proposal? How about the “One Big Beautiful Bill”?
It will more likely be something like, “Super Best Healthcare Ever” or “Sparkly Diamond Plan” or something else that sounds like it was chosen by a committee of 5th graders.
“The Make True Loyal Americans Immortal Again Act”
That’s reasonable. If it wasn’t for this, I might withdraw my last post:
That’s a good counter-example, but I don’t remember “TrumpRX” being pushed in Congress as an initiative for people to rally around. (That doesn’t mean it didn’t happen, I just don’t remember it.)