# Why are Democrats opposed to school vouchers? **URL:** \ **Category:** Great Debates\ **Created:** [September 17, 2013, 7:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084 "2013-09-17T19:47:29Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 20\ **Page:** 6
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 8:39pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/101 "2013-09-18T20:39:10Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Because in a democratic republic politics is naturally driven by voters and their wallets. Teacher’s unions pledge their money and votes to the party that will do their bidding. I hope you are going to tell us how you plan to change that, so we can do the same thing against the Koch brothers. ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 8:54pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/102 "2013-09-18T20:54:55Z")
> [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > This “rats leaving a sinking ship” approach is pretty common to voucher fans. The rest of us in the “patch the sinking ship, ferchrissakes” brigade don’t find it convincing. So when exactly should I expect the Democratic Party to “patch the sinking ship” and propose meaningful changes to the status quo, in which, as already established, the government classifies most schools in poor communities as failing? > [@](#): > > But abandoning the children there whose parents are unable or unwilling to get them out is an abandonment of the social contract, and is a despicable act. I agree. The status quo, supported by Democratic politicians and the teachers unions, in which failing public schools are allowed to continue failing year after year, constitutes abandoning the children who attend those schools. Those Democratic politicians and teachers unions are committing a despicable act. ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 9:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/103 "2013-09-18T21:02:49Z")
> [@Paranoid\_Randroid](#): > > The empirical evidence on school voucher efficacy remains _much_ more controversial than the linked summary lets on. **Paranoid Randroid** , thank you for your well-written post and thank you for the fact that, unlike any of the other voucher opponents, you’ve actually backed up your claims with citations. The evidence would seem to show that the majority of studies on the matter have found that vouchers lead to improved student performance among the students who use them, but there’s variation in how much improvement. That’s not surprising; there are many voucher programs and variety in the results is natural. But it seems to me that if vouchers sometimes produce big improvements and sometimes produce small improvements, that speaks pretty well for vouchers. As for the question of whether vouchers improve local public schools, I’d be interested to know exactly how researchers distinguished between the effects of “voucher threat” vs. the effects of “stigma”. But regardless, despite all the folks showing die-hard certainty that vouchers harm public schools, there’s not the slightest iota of research evidence which supports that belief. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 9:09pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/104 "2013-09-18T21:09:09Z")
> [@Farin](#): > > In that case, taxes should end. I’m sure a lot of your tax money goes to programs that do absolutely nothing for _you_, but benefit society as a whole. If you are going to fund education, fund it. Establish essential learning by grade level and let anyone who wants to teach MORE than that teach what they will. So while they learn Evolution, they can go to a private school that also teaches “Creation Science.” Who cares? A Muslim school would teach their ideals above and beyond the requirements, too… I care. It’s my tax money and my tax money does not go to fund religion. It’s the Constitution. And, teaching creation Science or All Koran, 100% Koran nothing but Koran doesn’t _benefit society as a whole._ ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 9:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/105 "2013-09-18T21:25:19Z")
> [@ITR Champion](#): > > Government scholarships and loans for students in higher education can be used at any accredited college or university, regardless of its religious affiliation. I’ve never heard any Democrat demand that such scholarships and loans be eliminated. If it’s fine to give government money to religious colleges and universities, then why not religious schools for K-12? > [@Amateur\_Barbarian](#): > > This dichotomy probably starts with the assumption that adults have either formed their religious beliefs or are adequately resistant to indoctrination or forced conversion, and are choosing a college fully aware of any doctrinal orientation. > > There are many funding, oversight and management differences between K-12 and upper education. But the Democrats who use church-state issues as an anti-voucher argument generally claim that it’s unconstitutional for government money to be used for religious schools or that a principle is at stake. If they actually believed such things were true, then it would surely be equally true in all cases, regardless of whether the student in question was K-12 or college-aged. But nobody ever objects to government money going to religious colleges or universities. Hence it seems that those who say that it’s unconstitutional for the government to give money to religious schools don’t actually believe what they’re saying. ---
**Author:** ![Saint\_Cad](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/saint_cad/32/18907_2.png) [@Saint\_Cad](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Saint_Cad)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 9:36pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/106 "2013-09-18T21:36:18Z")
Wow ITR Champion, three recent responses and not one addresses Post #93 that pretty much undermined your evidence that you cited. Are you just going to ignore it? ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/107 "2013-09-18T22:50:00Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > I hope you are going to tell us how you plan to change that, so we can do the same thing against the Koch brothers. Why would you want to change it? ---
**Author:** ![Fear\_Itself](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/fear_itself/32/19637_2.png) [@Fear\_Itself](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Fear_Itself)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 11:00pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/108 "2013-09-18T23:00:42Z")
> [@Magiver](#): > > Why would you want to change it? You first. ---
**Author:** ![UltraVires](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/u/ecccb3/32.png) [@UltraVires](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/UltraVires)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 11:04pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/109 "2013-09-18T23:04:41Z")
> [@monstro](#): > > -Separation of church and state. Why should we use public money to support religious institutions and the inculcation of religious dogma? How do we ensure that private schools advertising themselves as secular just to get some voucher students aren’t actually teaching religious and/or crazy beliefs on the down low? I take it then that you are opposed to the Earned Income Tax Credit and any payments for welfare, yes? If not, then why are my tax dollars used so that a poor person can take that money and put it in the collection plate at church? I am also against Food Stamps because a person might purchase items to use for a pot luck dinner at a religious function. Money is fungible. With ANY government assistance, some of that money will find religious purposes to go towards. And the voucher program can be solved with accreditation. ---
**Author:** ![Magiver](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/m/4491bb/32.png) [@Magiver](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Magiver)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 11:15pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/110 "2013-09-18T23:15:07Z")
> [@Fear\_Itself](#): > > You first. I never suggested it be changed. Why shouldn’t teacher’s unions spend their money to serve their needs. I may not like it but that’s democracy at work. I like vouchers. I went to a private school for 8 years. ---
**Author:** ![Bricker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/977dab/32.png) [@Bricker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Bricker)\ **Post date:** [September 18, 2013, 11:30pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/111 "2013-09-18T23:30:43Z")
> [@Sinaptics](#): > > No, that’s not what I meant. To be absolutely specific, lawmakers (those who create the laws) are aghast that the laws they’ve created or propose creating, might include Islamic schools. Since they are lawmakers, their views can have a profound effect on the laws. You didn’t open either link, did you? Of course I did. Your first link involves Louisiana Rep. Valarie Hodges – not a leader in the legislature – complaining about a bill already passed. You’ll have to explain to me in what way you envision her having a “profound effect” on anything, especially in light of the fact that her comments run contrary to the Lemon test. Now, I grant that Tennessee’s Jim Tracy and Bill Ketron are more influential, in that they are debating a bill right now, rather than discussing a bill already passed, but the fact remains that, as one of them was quoted as saying, there is simply no way to amend the bill to exclude one religious tradition and remain constitutional. So unless you’re aware of an impending plan to appoint Tracy and Ketron to the Supreme Court, it’s safe to regard their likelihood of failure as… er… profound. ---
**Author:** ![Little\_Nemo](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/little_nemo/32/3120_2.png) [@Little\_Nemo](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Little_Nemo)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 12:21am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/112 "2013-09-19T00:21:15Z")
> [@Bricker](#): > > Of course I did. Your first link involves Louisiana Rep. Valarie Hodges – not a leader in the legislature – complaining about a bill already passed. You’ll have to explain to me in what way you envision her having a “profound effect” on anything, especially in light of the fact that her comments run contrary to the Lemon test. > > Now, I grant that Tennessee’s Jim Tracy and Bill Ketron are more influential, in that they are debating a bill right now, rather than discussing a bill already passed, but the fact remains that, as one of them was quoted as saying, there is simply no way to amend the bill to exclude one religious tradition and remain constitutional. > > So unless you’re aware of an impending plan to appoint Tracy and Ketron to the Supreme Court, it’s safe to regard their likelihood of failure as… er… profound. Are you claiming that the only moment when we should consider the political views of an elected legislator is when they are in the act of voting on a law? ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 2:42am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/113 "2013-09-19T02:42:14Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > > So when exactly should I expect the Democratic Party to “patch the sinking ship” and propose meaningful changes to the status quo, in which, as already established, the government classifies most schools in poor communities as failing? NCLB is an attempt. I disagree with people who think it’s a backhanded effort to privatize schools (the thing you’re trying to do forthrightly, at least), and although it’s a terrible attempt, it’s an attempt nonetheless. The Democratic party is afraid to tackle the root causes of failing students, which is POVERTY. That’s the elephant in the living room: too many children are growing up in poverty, which means high stress at home, which means food insecurity, which correlates with high crime neighborhoods. More and more families are trying to support themselves on a minimum wage which buys less and less. The kid who can grow up in these circumstances and thrive academically is thriving despite the circumstances, not because of them. If we want our schools to succeed, we need to eliminate poverty. But Republicans have currently won this ideological battle, so as long as Democrats are too timid to talk about ending poverty (or at least reducing it to, say, Scandinavian levels), you’re not going to hear meaningful changes. > [@](#): > > I agree. The status quo, supported by Democratic politicians and the teachers unions, in which failing public schools are allowed to continue failing year after year, constitutes abandoning the children who attend those schools. Those Democratic politicians and teachers unions are committing a despicable act. This “I agree: let me say something totally opposite what you said” is a disrespectful debating tactic, dishonest, and really, really stupid. You can do better. ---
**Author:** ![brickbacon](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/898d66/32.png) [@brickbacon](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/brickbacon)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 6:00am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/114 "2013-09-19T06:00:10Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > > I agree. The status quo, supported by Democratic politicians and the teachers unions, in which failing public schools are allowed to continue failing year after year, constitutes abandoning the children who attend those schools. Those Democratic politicians and teachers unions are committing a despicable act. Bullshit. First, why do people keep expecting that teachers’ unions should sacrifice the needs and desires of their constituents for what _might_ better the students? That’s not their job, their charge, or their primary goal (nor should it be). You might as well ask why the baseball union isn’t doing more, or why Walmart is turning a blind eye. Second, neither group is “allowing” failing schools, but merely failing to solve a ridiculously complex problem despite many sincere efforts. You keep acting as if a “failing school” is one issue that can be dealt with rather than a bunch of administrators, parents, teachers, students, etc. that have collectively not met society’s expectations for a variety of reasons. > [@ITR\_champion](#): > > **Paranoid Randroid** , thank you for your well-written post and thank you for the fact that, unlike any of the other voucher opponents, you’ve actually backed up your claims with citations. The evidence would seem to show that the majority of studies on the matter have found that vouchers lead to improved student performance among the students who use them, but there’s variation in how much improvement. That’s not surprising; there are many voucher programs and variety in the results is natural. But it seems to me that if vouchers sometimes produce big improvements and sometimes produce small improvements, that speaks pretty well for vouchers. That is not at all what was said, nor is it what the record shows. Just Google it for yourself. There are plenty of real-world example that have failed pretty spectacularly. Just look at [Chile](http://cipr.tulane.edu/articles/detail/1014/School-Vouchers-What-Louisiana-can-Learn-from-Chile). Friedman himself helped design it. The results? To quote the article: > [@](#): > > In a nutshell, the logic behind educational choice was that the freedom of voucher-bearing parents to select schools would create competitive forces, generating incentives for schools to improve their performance, reduce their costs, and introduce greater innovation. Did it work? > > While the evidence is complex, analysts suggest that “The Chilean reforms of the 1980s were not practicable, did not turn education upside down, and did not dramatically improve school performance” (Gauri 1998, 103). The reforms did not reduce inequalities in education: most poor children attend public schools, which have lower performance than private schools and are more poorly funded, due to their inability to charge tuition or surcharges, both of which are open to their private counterparts (Levin 2011, 74; Economist 2011). The reforms did not improve performance either. But this is really beside the point as I am sure we can play dueling cites all night. The broader issue one needs to ask is why this system should theoretically work. Your side seems to have two main arguments: that a market based approach will yield better outcomes, and that school choice will lead to poorer kids having better opportunities. The issue with the first point is more a fundamental understanding of the how markets work and how people make choices. Markets may yield efficient outcomes, and reflect consumer choice, but the don’t guarantee great results or equality of opportunity for all. More importantly, those goals are typically to maximize profit, which doesn’t work in an area where a significant number of students are “unprofitable”. We are committed to a specific outcome (quality education for all), but an efficient market would never yield that. It’s almost never worth the time/money to educate the disabled, the lazy, the poor, or anyone else who doesn’t fit a certain mold. The market would focus on the top 80% with a greater emphasis on the top 10%, and not even bother with the rest. We (I think) agree that that would not be advisable for a number of reasons. There is also the fallacious idea that parents, many of whom are also poorly educated, would have accurate, intelligible information from which they could pick the “best” school. The problem is that parents who have that choice [rarely](http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/answer-sheet/wp/2012/10/12/why-the-market-theory-of-education-reform-doesnt-work/) do that; which is in keeping with the strategy most adopt when deciding anything. For example, do you always eat the most healthy food? We give people nearly absolute freedom to eat what they want. We even subsidize it in many cases. Yet, people mostly eat like shit. Why hasn’t choice let us to better outcomes in those cases even though there is more immediate consequences, and more information about best practices? The failure of vouchers really highlights the “[limits of parent driven reform](http://www.wpri.org/Reports/Volume%2020/Vol20no8/vol20no8.pdf)”. The second point is even more problematic. Being in the education field myself, I think many misunderstand why people like Obama send their kids to fancy private schools. Sidwell Friends is not really much better than a number of public schools in the DC-metro area in terms if education provided. The point of many of these schools is exclusivity and access. People send their kids there so they can mingle with other successful kids and families. This goal is undermined if a school starts accepting any kid with a voucher. While there is a significant middle ground, thinking vouchers will allow anyone to mingle with the offspring of the 1% is just foolish. These schools don’t have a demand problem any more than Harvard does. > [@ITR\_champion](#): > > But regardless, despite all the folks showing die-hard certainty that vouchers harm public schools, there’s not the slightest iota of research evidence which supports that belief. There is plenty. See above for one. > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > The Democratic party is afraid to tackle the root causes of failing students, which is POVERTY. Just like the scientists are afraid to cure cancer, and why GM killed the electric car. :dubious: ---
**Author:** ![Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/left_hand_of_dorkness/32/7156_2.png) [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Left_Hand_of_Dorkness)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 11:06am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/115 "2013-09-19T11:06:18Z")
> [@brickbacon](#): > > Just like the scientists are afraid to cure cancer, and why GM killed the electric car. :dubious: Nothing like that. This isn’t conspiracy talk. This is political cowardice. Democrats have gone along with the dismantling of our social safety net ever since Clinton, and surprise surprise, income inequality has increased. Are you seriously suggesting that Democrats have been spending significant political capital to end poverty in the last ten years? ---
**Author:** ![Cheesesteak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/cheesesteak/32/3694_2.png) [@Cheesesteak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Cheesesteak)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 2:37pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/116 "2013-09-19T14:37:27Z")
It’s a micro solution to a macro problem. You may get a better outcome for one student or another, but you don’t get a systemic benefit, overall the outcomes don’t improve. So, Joe Sixpack Jr. gets into Posh Private Elementary with his Voucher. Posh doesn’t have a ton of empty chairs sitting around, so Joe Jr. bumps another child from a spot. Where does that child go to school? You open up a new school for all these bumped students, where do you get teachers and administrators? Surely not from the leftover firings from the shrinking public school system. Is there an untapped pool of teachers who are WAY better than the failing public school teachers, but who haven’t managed to get a plum overpaid public teaching position. I’m assuming not, so you have the same teachers, (well, the ones who were laid off) just operating out of a different physical location. Same students + same core curriculum + same pool of teachers + different building = Unicorns and Rainbows The reality is: > [@Left\_Hand\_of\_Dorkness](#): > > If we want our schools to succeed, we need to eliminate poverty. Put poor and non-poor students in the same classroom with the same teacher, and you will get different results. Poverty, home life, culture, are an order of magnitude more important to student performance than union vs non-union teachers, or Public vs Private administrators. ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 2:49pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/117 "2013-09-19T14:49:03Z")
> [@brickbacon](#): > > First, why do people keep expecting that teachers’ unions should sacrifice the needs and desires of their constituents for what _might_ better the students? That’s not their job, their charge, or their primary goal (nor should it be). I entirely agree. There is absolutely no reason to expect the teachers unions to care about whether students get a quality education. I entirely expect that where they exist, teachers unions will oppose anything that benefits students if it hurts their members’ bottom lines, even if it’s a huge benefit for students and a minor loss for a few teachers. Much better if public school teacher unions didn’t exist, as they didn’t for a large majority of American history. ---
**Author:** ![ITR\_champion](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/i/c67d28/32.png) [@ITR\_champion](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/ITR_champion)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 3:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/118 "2013-09-19T15:02:32Z")
> [@Saint\_Cad](#): > > Wow ITR Champion, three recent responses and not one addresses Post #93 that pretty much undermined your evidence that you cited. Are you just going to ignore it? There’s not a whole lot to respond to. Throwing spitwads at the author, based on his background, is not worth responding to. Saying things like “most educational studies are crap” sounds like a way to dismiss the available scientific evidence for no reason. Saying “It had been pretty well established that standardized test tend to be cultural tests so if one group is dominated by the dominant culture then the results are skewed” sounds like a way to ignore data from standardized tests. It is true that there are other measures of school success beyond standardized test scores and parent surveys. I would love to see a larger study which compared outcomes for poor children who get vouchers to those who don’t, along a larger number of measures. I do not see any Democrats rushing to perform such a study, though. It’s worth noting that not a single Democrat claiming that vouchers hurt students has offered an iota of evidence to back it up. Hence I will continue to believe the position that is backed by a lot of scientific evidence, even if that evidence isn’t a perfect as it theoretically might be, rather than the position that’s not backed by any scientific evidence. ---
**Author:** ![Richard\_Parker](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/r/35a633/32.png) [@Richard\_Parker](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Richard_Parker)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 3:19pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/119 "2013-09-19T15:19:55Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > > It’s worth noting that not a single Democrat claiming that vouchers hurt students has offered an iota of evidence to back it up. A casual perusal of this thread reveals this claim to be utterly false. Statements like these may contribute the reluctance of posters to dig into the studies with you. ---
**Author:** ![DrDeth](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/b487fb/32.png) [@DrDeth](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/DrDeth)\ **Post date:** [September 19, 2013, 3:41pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084/120 "2013-09-19T15:41:02Z")
> [@ITR\_champion](#): > > I entirely agree. There is absolutely no reason to expect the teachers unions to care about whether students get a quality education. I entirely expect that where they exist, teachers unions will oppose anything that benefits students if it hurts their members’ bottom lines, even if it’s a huge benefit for students and a minor loss for a few teachers. Much better if public school teacher unions didn’t exist, as they didn’t for a large majority of American history. And now one of the true reasons for GOP support of vouchers comes out- to get rid of the teachers union. Because somehow teachers in a Union are evil and not interested in their kids education, whilst non-unionized teachers are pure & noble paragons of education.:rolleyes: Bah. Look, the evidence for vouchers improving education or even for kids getting a better education in private schools is poor and biased. There’s really only two reason for vouchers: make sure those little minds are stuffed full of “ the Good Christian Bible instead of that nasty science stuff”:rolleyes: and an attack on teachers unions. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084.md?page=5) [Next page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-democrats-opposed-to-school-vouchers/669084.md?page=7)