# Why are incandescent light bulbs illegal? **URL:** \ **Category:** Factual Questions\ **Created:** [November 16, 2014, 3:58am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750 "2014-11-16T03:58:13Z")\ **Posts on this page:** 14\ **Page:** 3
**Author:** ![Crafter\_Man](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/crafter_man/32/458_2.png) [@Crafter\_Man](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Crafter_Man)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 4:02pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/41 "2014-11-16T16:02:31Z")
> [@Gorsnak](#): > > This is a rather silly argument. Electric heat is more expensive than natural gas by a significant margin for nearly all Canadians outside of Quebec. Moreover, most Canadians do not heat their houses in summer, and indeed many have air conditioning. And finally, most light fixtures are poorly situated in rooms to effectively provide heat, which should be introduced to rooms at floor level along outside walls. The vast majority of Canadians will realize a significant majority of the cost savings that the lower electrical usage of LED bulbs offer. I do not disagree. I am simply saying that the efficiency of an incandescent bulb is somewhat dependent on how often you run your furnace, and the type of fuel you’re using. I burn propane six months out of the year. If I turn on a 100 W incandescent bulb for 24 hours during the winter, I will burn less propane. Let’s assume that, due to localized heating effects, the energy from an incandescent bulb needs to be twice the energy of propane to get the same heating effect for my home. Therefore, a 100 W incandescent bulb will add 1.2 kWh of “heating” energy to my home over a 24 hour period. If one gallon of propane can provide 27 kWh of heat, burning the bulb for 24 hours will reduce the amount of propane I burn by 0.044 gallons. If I pay 12 cents per kWh for electricity, and propane is $2.42/gallon, then it costs me $0.29 to power the bulb for 24 hours, but I burn $0.11 _less_ in propane. Obviously, incandescent bulbs have the opposite effect when I turn my A/C on in the summer. In which case I could simply switch to LED bulbs in the summer. 😉 ---
**Author:** ![The\_Joker\_and\_the\_Thief](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/t/e79b87/32.png) [@The\_Joker\_and\_the\_Thief](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/The_Joker_and_the_Thief)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 4:25pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/42 "2014-11-16T16:25:55Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > I have no idea what you think you’re saying, so I’ll just say this: > > Incandescent bulbs can be made more efficient. The package I have in my hand, the third one I’m not typing with, is “43w = 60w, soft white, dimmable, pleasant light.” That’s a 28% energy saving, exactly in line with the law. It’s available here and now, at every retailer, and being made by American factories. > > [The mistake is not understanding that halogen technology \*\*\*is \*\*\*incandescent.](http://www.theverge.com/2014/1/1/5263826/the-incandescent-light-bulb-isnt-dead) > > They are not banned. Not. They are good, old-fashioned technology pepped up with some improvements. Again, stop listening to those people who are telling you otherwise. And I mean stop listening to them on every single subject. They are deliberately lying to you for ideological purposes. And you are falling for it. You don’t have to. Cut them out of your life. Just because halogens nominally contain a tungsten and a blackbody emiter does not make them incandescents in the normal sense of the word. They have substantial, categorical differences between themselves and what people refer to when they use the word incandescent. > [@](#): > > Of course, not everyone or every place loves halogen. They cost at least four times as much and don’t give off that warm glow of a standard bulb we’re accustomed to. And they have an intense glare; they need to be shaded, shielded or directed so the filament isn’t in your line of sight. > > Halogen bulbs burn hotter than standard incandescents, so care must be taken in their use. It’s possible for the protective outer shell to break and for the inner bulb to continue working (though the outer shells are incredibly durable). This can pose a hazard, as the hot inner bulb can explode if moisture hits it. [http://www.familyhandyman.com/smart-homeowner/the-pros-and-cons-of-halogen-bulbs/view-all](http://www.familyhandyman.com/smart-homeowner/the-pros-and-cons-of-halogen-bulbs/view-all) ---
**Author:** ![Erdosain](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/erdosain/32/7284_2.png) [@Erdosain](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Erdosain)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 4:47pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/43 "2014-11-16T16:47:47Z")
I’m a bit puzzled. For the past couple years every time I roll into the light bulb aisle, I’ve been expecting to find nothing but LEDs and CFs. But every time it’s mostly incandescents for sale. This includes even last week at Target. Are these incandescent bulbs technically halogen? They look indistinguishable from traditional incandescents. If I hadn’t occasionally heard these rants and heard of people stockpiling traditional bulbs, I wouldn’t have even known something was up with light bulbs. ---
**Author:** ![Gorsnak](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/gorsnak/32/7587_2.png) [@Gorsnak](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Gorsnak)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 5:21pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/44 "2014-11-16T17:21:03Z")
> [@Crafter\_Man](#): > > I do not disagree. I am simply saying that the efficiency of an incandescent bulb is somewhat dependent on how often you run your furnace, and the type of fuel you’re using. > > I burn propane six months out of the year. If I turn on a 100 W incandescent bulb for 24 hours during the winter, I will burn less propane. > > Let’s assume that, due to localized heating effects, the energy from an incandescent bulb needs to be twice the energy of propane to get the same heating effect for my home. Therefore, a 100 W incandescent bulb will add 1.2 kWh of “heating” energy to my home over a 24 hour period. If one gallon of propane can provide 27 kWh of heat, burning the bulb for 24 hours will reduce the amount of propane I burn by 0.044 gallons. If I pay 12 cents per kWh for electricity, and propane is $2.42/gallon, then it costs me $0.29 to power the bulb for 24 hours, but I burn $0.11 _less_ in propane. > > Obviously, incandescent bulbs have the opposite effect when I turn my A/C on in the summer. In which case I could simply switch to LED bulbs in the summer. 😉 Okay, so we’re not disagreeing much. I’m gonna nitpick a bit anyways. 🙂 In your example, you’re still better off with LEDs in winter. Replace the 100W incandescent with 20w of LED, burn the extra $0.11 in propane (probably $0.09 actually since the LED bulbs still generate waste heat) and pay $0.06 for the electricity to run the light for a net savings of $0.13. Over 10,000 hrs that comes to $54, far more than the cost of the LED bulbs. Even in a best case scenario where the heating system is electric you won’t get a 1:1 energy cost replacement from incandescent lights as they’re generally going to be adding heat up near the ceiling where it isn’t very useful. So while the waste heat from incandescent bulbs will have some impact on heating, in virtually all real world cases it will still be more energy efficient to go with LED lighting and use the dedicated heating system to make up the difference. Hence I maintain that bringing up the “waste heat isn’t necessarily wasted” argument might be an interesting aside and possibly even relevant in extreme niche cases but on the whole is actually misleading. ---
**Author:** ![Exapno\_Mapcase](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/exapno_mapcase/32/1051_2.png) [@Exapno\_Mapcase](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Exapno_Mapcase)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 5:59pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/45 "2014-11-16T17:59:09Z")
> [@The\_Joker\_and\_the\_Thief](#): > > Just because halogens nominally contain a tungsten and a blackbody emiter does not make them incandescents in the normal sense of the word. They have substantial, categorical differences between themselves and what people refer to when they use the word incandescent. You mean, the special sense in which you are defining the word, which is unlike the sense that manufacturers, retailers, governments, and normal consumers use the word. > [@](#): > > They cost at least four times as much Not true. > [@](#): > > and don’t give off that warm glow of a standard bulb we’re accustomed to. Not true. > [@](#): > > And they have an intense glare; they need to be shaded, shielded or directed so the filament isn’t in your line of sight. Not true. I am writing this while sitting under a three globe ceiling fixture. Two of the globes have new-style incandescent bulbs, the third has the older style. You cannot tell any difference at all in their light. > [@](#): > > [http://www.familyhandyman.com/smart-homeowner/the-pros-and-cons-of-halogen-bulbs/view-all](http://www.familyhandyman.com/smart-homeowner/the-pros-and-cons-of-halogen-bulbs/view-all) That piece appears to have been written in 2009. It is simply outdated and flat out wrong with today’s bulbs. ---
**Author:** ![wolfpup](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/wolfpup/32/10618_2.png) [@wolfpup](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/wolfpup)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 7:05pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/46 "2014-11-16T19:05:44Z")
> [@dorsiflector](#): > > I am paying my electric bill. If I _choose_ to buy an inefficient bulb, and spend my hard-earned money on incandescent light, then why can’t I? Basically for the same reason that you can’t throw your garbage out the window into the street, or dump your used motor oil into the city reservoir, or do any number of other things that you might find convenient. Your “hard-earned money” doesn’t even begin to cover the environmental costs of the wasted electricity, and we all have to live on the same planet and breathe the same air. As **Princhester** said in post #23, failing to understand this is the classic tragedy of the commons. Other than that, I’ve nothing to add to the excellent responses already posted. Anyone who thinks that CFLs and LEDs don’t provide the “right” kind of light has apparently been spending too much time ranting about evil governments and not enough time looking at what the much-vaunted free market is actually producing these days. ---
**Author:** ![clairobscur](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/c/839c29/32.png) [@clairobscur](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/clairobscur)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 10:08pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/47 "2014-11-16T22:08:23Z")
> [@Joey\_P](#): > > As everyone else said, you can just go to Home Depot and buy regular light bulbs, but if you want CFLs that don’t feel like a parking garage, just look at the back of the package and buy ones with a warmer color temperature. > > Most every light bulb has some sort of chart on the back [like this](http://g-ecx.images-amazon.com/images/G/01/th/aplus/envirobulb/envirobulb-B00DPUO6XO-a19-lightcolor-sm.jpg) that indicates what color the light is, buy one towards the red end of the spectrum and you really won’t be able to tell it isn’t incandescent. Interesting. I don’t know if bulbs sold here have the same kind of chart, but I’ll look for it. Never paid attention. ---
**Author:** ![foolsguinea](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/foolsguinea/32/14751_2.png) [@foolsguinea](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/foolsguinea)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 10:50pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/48 "2014-11-16T22:50:34Z")
> [@Exapno\_Mapcase](#): > > “Energy-saving” incandescent bulbs can be bought off the shelf at Target for a buck apiece. > > Incandescent bulbs are not banned. They have never been banned. The government took nothing away. > > Now go write that 100 times on the nearest blackboard. > > And for Pete’s sake. Stop listening to anyone who tells you different. Now. Yeah, I’m considering going and buying one today (even though it will wear out much faster than a CFL). They’re not actually gone around here. Sometimes you want something without the turning-on lag of a CFL, and a little heat output, if at the cost of higher power usage. ---
**Author:** ![BrightNShiny](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/b/7bcc69/32.png) [@BrightNShiny](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/BrightNShiny)\ **Post date:** [November 16, 2014, 11:33pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/49 "2014-11-16T23:33:51Z")
> [@jtur88](#): > > The question nis not about whether they are good or not, but about it being a criminal act to manufacture, sell or use them. If they are actually more economical and perform better, the marketplace will reflect what people use. We are not talking about a theoretical market when it comes to the electricity grid. We are talking about a system with a huge amount of government intervention. The government intervened and continues to intervene in all sorts of ways to make sure that you get a more-or-less steady supply of electricity delivered to your door. If you were one of the relatively few people in the US who isn’t connected to the grid, then I might have some (but not much) sympathy for this argument. But if you are one of the many, many people who are connected to the grid, then these market arguments are merely self-serving. > [@](#): > > People who can afford uneconomical and inefficient products have, broadly, a right to indulge, and buy what suits their personal taste and pay the going price. So, people have a right to indulge on a system that all of us paid for building? They have a right to indulge using a system that all of us continue to pay for? > [@](#): > > The question is Why do light bulbs fall into a special category of consumer products that require legislative acts to not just discourage their use, but to criminalize it. Light bulbs aren’t in some “special category.” There is a whole array of efficiency regulations for consumer products. See here: [http://energy.gov/eere/buildings/about-appliance-and-equipment-standards-program](http://energy.gov/eere/buildings/about-appliance-and-equipment-standards-program) ---
**Author:** ![Chronos](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/chronos/32/134_2.png) [@Chronos](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Chronos)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2014, 1:27am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/50 "2014-11-17T01:27:54Z")
> [@](#): > > …and don’t give off that warm glow of a standard bulb we’re accustomed to. Not only is this untrue, it’s the opposite of true. Halogen bulbs give a _warmer_ glow than conventional incandescents. That’s why they’re more efficient: The higher temperature means proportionately more of their output in the visible range instead of the infrared. ---
**Author:** ![scr4](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/s/59ef9b/32.png) [@scr4](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/scr4)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2014, 1:37am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/51 "2014-11-17T01:37:27Z")
> [@Chronos](#): > > Not only is this untrue, it’s the opposite of true. Halogen bulbs give a _warmer_ glow than conventional incandescents. That’s why they’re more efficient: The higher temperature means proportionately more of their output in the visible range instead of the infrared. I think in common English usage, “warm glow” or “warm color” means _lower_ color temperature, not higher. ---
**Author:** ![jz78817](https://sea3.discourse-cdn.com/straightdope/user_avatar/boards.straightdope.com/jz78817/32/1028_2.png) [@jz78817](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/jz78817)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2014, 2:22am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/52 "2014-11-17T02:22:31Z")
> [@scr4](#): > > I think in common English usage, “warm glow” or “warm color” means _lower_ color temperature, not higher. more or less, but as far as light bulbs go it’s not so clear. “soft white” is ~2700K. “warm white” is ~3000K. “daylight” is ~5000K. ---
**Author:** ![Dale\_Sams](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/d/779978/32.png) [@Dale\_Sams](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Dale_Sams)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2014, 4:31am UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/53 "2014-11-17T04:31:26Z")
> [@dorsiflector](#): > > - Let’s say I buy a Hummer with the biggest engine available, that gets 6MPG. Is the government going to now force me to drive a more fuel efficient vehicle? It’s not the government’s business to regulate the market in this way. If the state you are in required some sort of inspection that your tank can’t pass…then yes, you will not be able to drive that vehicle. ---
**Author:** ![Habeed](https://avatars.discourse-cdn.com/v4/letter/h/a587f6/32.png) [@Habeed](https://boards.straightdope.com/u/Habeed)\ **Post date:** [November 17, 2014, 7:28pm UTC](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750/54 "2014-11-17T19:28:28Z")
> [@Hari\_Seldon](#): > > Another point: All winter those incandescent bulbs are providing hear as well as light. When I go to take a shower before going to bed, the first thing I do is turn on the 4 x 60W incandescents in the bathroom and then go putter for a couple minutes, while the lights heat the bathroom. The bulbs explicitly meant for heating are perfectly legal. You’d have to do a bit of rewiring and install a high amperage socket meant for one of the infrared heat bulbs somewhere in the bathroom. [Previous page](https://boards.straightdope.com/t/why-are-incandescent-light-bulbs-illegal/704750.md?page=2)